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brothagary
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Joined: 2011/10/23
Posts: 1863


 the first sin

oridgnaly our father of dust the first adam commited sin against god ,and as we christians are now part of the body of christ who is the seconed adam ,we were part of the body of adam , in whoms loins we all were

in the same way we now partake of the devine nature through being born again ,
we all partook of image of the man of dust ,a corputed nature ,,,that which is born of flesh is flesh ,in a wider contex speaks about us being born spirtual dead

when adam oridgnaly sinned all those in the body of adam died the spirtual death ,and we remained dead in adam ,till we were made alive in christ ,,bless god

roms ;5 18 So then as through one transgression there resulted condemnation to all men, even so through one act of righteousness there resulted justification of life to all men

tho as the sons of adam willfully sin and hold down and supress the reveled comons truths of concence and gods atrubutes

romans teaches it was through adams firts sin , that resulted in us being condemed and found guilty ,contrary to popular teachings

romons 5;19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous

not only did the sons of adam suffer condemnation because of adams sin ,,we in adam were all made sinners as mentioned before

we bore the image of the man of dust as paul said

this hapend wile in the loins of adam ,,

made sinners refures to us being created sinners , this happend in one scence before the foundation of the world ,and was experanced at conception or creation of our bodies

rom 5;12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:


we from this verse see that death came to all thoses that sinned

and the fact remains that as babies and children experance death ,,,,this proves that death can come upon them beause they were in adam when he sinned ,, when adam sinned and died spirtual all who are in his body sinned and died spirtual ,,and the reflection of is the pycical death that can be expernced any time in the natural mans life

we in christ inherit death ,through christs death along with resarection life ,,bless god

we who are in or were in adam inherit sin and death with out resarection life , through adams sin and his spirtual death

in contrass

the gift of righeoteous is imputed to us through christ and his righeousness


roms 5 18and through one mans offence (adam), judment came to all men resulting in condemnation

the curse of sin ws imputed ,because of adams disobedance


in the same way the elect were created to partake in the devine nature ,through death and resarection
roms 6;5 says we were united with him in his death

humans were united to partake in the courption of adam through his spirual death ,and inherit the opasite of the devine nature

that god might show what it means to express grace and mercy, in all there defenitions

with out the fall ,there woould be no mercy or justafication and full expresions of grace

god works all thing for good to thoses who are called according to his pourpus

amen



 2012/11/4 19:54Profile
stevet83
Member



Joined: 2012/9/9
Posts: 77


 Re: the first sin

Amen...
Under Adam:
We're born in sin and inherit condemnation .

Under Christ:
We're born again in righteousness and inherit eternal life


 2012/11/4 20:22Profile
brothagary
Member



Joined: 2011/10/23
Posts: 1863


 Re:

just for the record bro ,,iv never ever read a comentary from any reformer or even been a member of a reformed church ,or herd a sermon on oridgnal sin ,,tho i do believe some of what is called reformed doctrine


i just think the bible teaches oridgnal sin and other doctrines that are taught in reformed circuls


blessings

 2012/11/4 21:19Profile
proudpapa
Member



Joined: 2012/5/13
Posts: 2936


 Re: the first sin

p1118 Niv Student Bible 1 John commentary Zondervan 1992
//Gnostics balked at the Christian concept of Gods becoming human.because they believed a physical body was intrinsically evil,they denied a pure God could take on a body. Some dealt with the problem by claiming that Jesus was never a human being,but a phantom,a temporary appearance of God who looked human....
The apostle John debated in person with gnostics of his day,and had Gnostic thinking in mind when he wrote this letter.....
throughout the letter especially in 4:2-3,the author lambastes those who deny that Jesus came in the flesh.....
Live as you please
To Gnostics all matter was evil . Only the Spirit was pure,and Gnostics sought to rise to a higher more spirtual plane.This teaching produced side effect:people who strove to rise above matter didn't care about personal ethics.Their pure spirits could not be tainted by "earthly" sin Thus,they could act any way they wanted.//


If the physical body is intrinsically evil Than what about the flesh of Jesus ??

Was Jesus Christ our Lord, not made of the seed of David according to the flesh ??



 2012/11/4 22:53Profile









 Re: the first sin

Great article Gary. Thought you read reformed doctrine for breakfast! Good to see some clarity coming into your writing. Nice to be clear headed what! In a post some months ago the Sarx (Flesh) thing was discussed and I recall GinnyRose making an amazing statement right at the end of that post. Something to the effect that Jesus didn't actually have Josephs DNA. She didn't put it exactly that way, but thats what it meant. I recall being somewhat taken aback, yet at the same time realised that it was actually true. Of the line of David by matrimony not DNA. In the likeness of sinful flesh. Not sinful flesh. Mmmm. Anyway whilst it is true that our father Adam according to the flesh made a decision which has affected us all, what we ought to be asking is what that decision really was. This would give much more practical help to the reality of sin in our lives. If we understood what Adam's sin really was, we would understand something of what resisting sin really was. Then we wouldn't have to spend our days researching doctrines at all.


See the last post in this thread! Wild.

https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=45968&forum=36&start=0&viewmode=flat&order=0

No I haven't started on drugs. Just having a Californian Moment. Its 4 am in the UK. Bless you Gary and Brenda also.

 2012/11/4 23:13
proudpapa
Member



Joined: 2012/5/13
Posts: 2936


 Re: amrkelly

Hi amrkelly, the last post in that thread which by the way I will say was written by a dear sister,but that does not mean that I am in agreement was Augustines position I see very little evidence for it other than the Fact that Jesus was begotten Of God and not Joseph.(a large conclusion to form just from that fact)

amrkelly can you show any evidence of such a position being held by the early church fathers before Augustine??

 2012/11/4 23:28Profile
brothagary
Member



Joined: 2011/10/23
Posts: 1863


 Re:

all matter is not evil, only a gnostic would sugest that

but as james said ,the spirit the dwels in man lusts to do evil ,
matter is good a courptive influenec did inter in to the spirit or the heart of man ,,leading to do evil

the bible talks about those who are born againg are not born of courptable seed john chapter 1


the courption is inbeded in to the seed of adam ,, not only that we also see this coruption in animals and plants ,,which was subject to futility but not willingly paul said that,,,,it grones in this courption ,till the reveling of the sons of god

this is not gnostisims ,,,becase it is the opasite


matter is good ,,but the spirit is evil is what total depravity is ,that was the result of the oridgnal sin

they say matter is evil and spirit is good

its utterly a satanic doctrine

men being givern over to the evil prince ,,the spirit of the prince and power of the air ,which is the spirit that works in the children of desobedance

in which we all walked before the new birth

paul taught that

blessings






 2012/11/4 23:28Profile
brothagary
Member



Joined: 2011/10/23
Posts: 1863


 Re:

i hope you and your wife are doing well andrew ,,good to see your still posting here

blessings

 2012/11/4 23:32Profile
proudpapa
Member



Joined: 2012/5/13
Posts: 2936


 Re: amrkelly

Hi amrkelly even though I have not came to the same conclusion as what you have on this subject, I also am glad to see you posting, you have much to offer.

 2012/11/4 23:47Profile
proudpapa
Member



Joined: 2012/5/13
Posts: 2936


 Re: amrkelly

Hi amrkelly even though I have not came to the same conclusion as what you have on this subject, I also am glad to see you posting, you have much to offer.

 2012/11/4 23:47Profile





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