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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : God does not go against the will of man.

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proudpapa
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Joined: 2012/5/13
Posts: 2936


 Re:

Hi stevet83 I am not at all offended nor am I at all upset I am just showing another perspective one that I am coming to that seems to be more scriptural, may I be wrong in some of my assumptions? I have been in the past so there is no reason for me to think that I have it all figured out now.

my comment was directly cut and past from scripture and than I gave the scripture from which It came from

 2012/11/3 1:40Profile
proudpapa
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Joined: 2012/5/13
Posts: 2936


 Re: stevet83

RE: ///Literal translation? Really? Help me out here///

The NIV is not a literal translation it is a Dynamic equivalence (thought for thought) The translater where very bias with changing things to fit their reformed theolgy. Everwhere that you see the word sinful nature it is not the greek word for sin nor for nature it is the greek word Sarx. 1 John says

1 John 4:3
And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh (sarx) is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world

Sarx does not mean sinful nature it simply means flesh and includes the mind of the flesh

 2012/11/3 1:47Profile
stevet83
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Joined: 2012/9/9
Posts: 77


 Re:

You didn't agree with me saying all have sinned, you said babies aren't included, I repeated all have sinned. You then quoted a verse about all being made righteous, I assumed you were trying to imply that means all men. If that is the case then all are saved. When in fact "all" in Romans 5 is only those who are in Christ.

I don't even know what perspective you're talking about because you haven't said it, could you let me know please.

 2012/11/3 1:51Profile
proudpapa
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Joined: 2012/5/13
Posts: 2936


 Re: stevet83

stevet83 wrote /// When in fact "all" in Romans 5 is only those who are in Christ.///

The Free gift has come upon all the same as the condemnation came upon all men.

sin revived from our parents to us when we understood the law and personally failed it. that is the condemnation that came upon us. Paul says "I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died." this was paul innocent as a Baby growing up under the law understanding it failing at this point in Pauls life sin(guilt)revives at this point in time from one generation to the next. Paul said at this moment I died as what 1 Cor 15 22 says For as in Adam all die.

like wise "even so in Christ shall all be made alive"

Like wise "even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life."

That is the free gift is offered to all men but many will reject it





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 2012/11/3 2:13Profile
stevet83
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Joined: 2012/9/9
Posts: 77


 Re:

So you have a problem with the NIV. I'm not schooled enough to discuss translations, nor do i know the intentions of 'biased" translaters. Sarx is used for the physical body, and as u said "the mind of the flesh" which I'm assuming is the natural man or the carnal mind, and as I put it "flesh/sinful nature" to show the context of my using "flesh".
Either way there is a distinction clearly seen with Adam and Eve prior to sinning, people who aren't born again, and those that are. The distinction is the death of flesh/natural man/carnal mind and the "new creature" who is in Christ. Is that better?

 2012/11/3 2:20Profile
proudpapa
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Joined: 2012/5/13
Posts: 2936


 Re: stevet83

Hi stevet83

stevet83 wrote ///Either way there is a distinction clearly seen with Adam and Eve prior to sinning,///

They where innocent with no law, naked and not ashamed just as an infant

the kingdom of heaven is of the such as little children

 2012/11/3 2:26Profile
proudpapa
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Joined: 2012/5/13
Posts: 2936


 Re: stevet83

stevet83 wrote //The distinction is the death of flesh/natural man/carnal mind and the "new creature" who is in Christ. Is that better?//

well said

 2012/11/3 2:29Profile
stevet83
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Joined: 2012/9/9
Posts: 77


 Re:

I should add if you have not been born again you are controlled by the flesh. Paul says "dead in your trespasses and sin"

 2012/11/3 2:40Profile
proudpapa
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Joined: 2012/5/13
Posts: 2936


 Re: stevet83

hi stevet83

no disagreements, the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

 2012/11/3 2:55Profile









 Re:

Suzanna Wesley was one of the most successful mothers in Modern Christianity..[ 1730's]. She bore 19 children, with 10 surviving, including John and charles Wesley. This is what she said about the Will and child-rearing;

""When the will of a child is totally subdued, and it is brought to revere and stand in awe of the parents, then a great many childish follies, and faults may be past over.

Some should be overlooked and taken no notice of, and others mildly reproved. No wilful transgression ought ever to be forgiven children, without chastisement, less or more, as the nature and circumstances of the offence require.

I insist upon conquering the will of children early because this is the only strong and rational foundation of a religious education."

Something to consider here about ourselves, and what the Cross really is.

 2012/11/3 5:48





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