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 Slandering God's Servants - SI Forums Note

Dear Brothers and Sisters,

I wanted to bring again this burden we have on SermonIndex to not sin with our mouths as we type messages in the forums that slander the names of God's servants. To me it is amazing that the enemy can convince so many Christians to speak ill of so many others in the body of Christ and not to busy about the work of the Lord. There is a lost world without Christ and we can argue over so many petty problems and not see our own sin in the meantime. Paul did speak out a few times in the New Testament towards a few individuals that opposed strongly the gospel or who were blatant false teachers.

Yet many of us can calmly and with calculated stroke blacken the name and character of a servant of God who perhaps does not see truth perfectly even and is still growing in grace. My wife brought this quote to my attention without any knowledge of my writing this small forum note: "I would rather play with forked lightning, or take in my hand living wires with their fiery current, than speak a reckless word against any servant of Christ, or idly repeat the slanderous darts which thousands of Christians are hurling on others." - A.B. Simpson

I write these things as reminder for myself firstly because we are all prone to judge others dear saints. I pray that the Lord would pour out His Spirit upon those who participate in the forums and that a beautiful unity and love for others would be expressed. God can make these forums a powerful testimony for His Name as we seek the best for Gods servants and to desire firstly inward purity in our private life's.

I want to also bring to attention the guiding principles for the forums and the point on slandering:

7. SLANDERING OTHERS - We have a zero tolerance on slander, evil-speaking and speaking against a person's character without warrant. 'Slander no one.' / 'to malign no one, to be peaceable, gentle, showing every consideration for all men.' NASB (Titus 3:2). This is a very important biblical principle and we ask that you would especially respect the biblical method of approaching a brother privately (Matthew 18:15). Also there are hundreds of websites in the internet that exclusively post wrong teachings, errors and question the character of Christians, we do not want SermonIndex to be seen as such a ministry and ask that all forum members do not participate in posting in what is wrong. We believe simply that truth dispels errors and to focus on the truth will shine a light into all the darkness.

SermonIndex Community Guiding Principles
https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=44556&forum=13


Thank you for taking your time to read these things saints, there is such precious washing and cleansing in the blood of Christ for our sins. Christ was struck in the mouth for perhaps the sins of our mouths. May we have a holy reverence for our communication especially when speaking of Gods servants.

May we also pray for each other on the site, for I surely need these prayers to walk in ways that please the Lord (Ephesians 4:1) in this area of my life.


_________________
SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2012/10/23 3:05Profile
rufnrust
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Joined: 2010/1/9
Posts: 243
Indiana

 Re: Slandering God's Servants - SI Forums Note

Amen. Again, Jesus intercedes, - the devil accuses. Who are we in agreement with?

Ruf


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Russell

 2012/10/23 8:47Profile









 Re: Slandering God's Servants - SI Forums Note

I wanted to post this here, since the Contemplative prayer thread was closed. [ and in it were references to Ihop ]. I agree about unlawful slandering of God's servants....and I think it wrong.

On a personal note, I have a high degree of respect for Mike Bickle, and actually know him. I moved my family and business to KC, and lived a block away from him and was highly committed to the vision there; and participated in prayer there 40 hours a week for years. I would trust Mike with my checkbook and wife; He is a man of great integrity.

But let us not confuse "slander" with pointing out Bad Doctrine, or Heresy, and because a brother once knew the truth, and was honored, does not mean he is incapable of being deceived, as evidently once trusted Diotrophes became.

"I wrote unto the church: but Diotrephes, who loveth to have the preeminence among them, receiveth us not.

Wherefore, if I come, I will remember his deeds which he doeth, prating against us with malicious words: and not content therewith, neither doth he himself receive the brethren, and forbiddeth them that would, and casteth them out of the church.

Beloved, follow not that which is evil, but that which is good. He that doeth good is of God: but he that doeth evil hath not seen God."

There is a great falling away occurring, and men are leaving sound doctrine daily, and sometimes it must become personal...as is repeated throughout the bible....specific men who became deceived.

I remember you Greg, and your Quote on a Rick Warren thread, where you stated that......................... "Rick Warren has done more good for the cause of Christ than all the "discernment ministries combined."****[ paraphrased to that effect] which to me....shows a total lack of Godly discernment...and yet....you named a name, didn't you......?

And more recently, You stated that John G. Lake was in effect a heretic, by stating he did not believe in Hell, and wondering why so many people referred to him as a Godly man. Is this not so? ...and when confronted by AbideInHim, and me, Brothertom.[ who have read all written by him and about him]...you just ignored us....but you did not lock the thread, did you?

If heresy is not confronted, it tends to spread like a cancer, and not everyone who names the name of Christ is God's servant....and that get mixed up around here.[sometimes]..and it is this that is dangerous.

I appreciate this site....but it is not all about getting along all the time, and peace is a division of the Truth....which always cuts through the darkness, and divides.

"Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division:

For from henceforth there shall be five in one house divided, three against two, and two against three."
JESUS.

And men are involved in this division, but we should not slander the Godly, for sure. Confronting them about false practices and beliefs is another matter, that Jesus and all of the Apostles practiced daily.**********

"Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.

For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock.

Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them.

Therefore watch, and remember, that by the space of three years I ceased not to warn every one night and day with tears.!"...Paul

It is this creed that a true Shepherd must devote himself; not unity and good vibes.

 2012/10/23 9:48









 Re:

While Tom and I differ on IHOP, I agree with what he is saying in his post. He is 100% correct.

Greg, I love you and respect you. You know this. But another point that needs to be mentioned is that the political banter on this forum has ineed gotten out of control... as it always does here... but I do find a double standard in the midst of it because many of the threads that you or the other mods have locked were started by you. You have posted articles concerning the current political climate here in America, or about whats happening while America is in the middle of election season... and then seem surprised a few days later that it has had the same effect as chum in the water.

I'm not chewing anyone out, or coming against anyone. We are blessed to know men like these mods. I consider several of them to be "friends". I agree with the premise of this thread! I'm just saying that we ALL need to consider what Greg has said here... including Greg and the Mods. We can not start a thread that has a history of turning ugly... and then act surprised and disgusted when it turns ugly.

(I also notice very little is ever posted by the Canadians about Canadian politics. It's always American politics.)

Love you all...

Krispy

 2012/10/23 10:15
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Posts: 37399
"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11

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 Re:

Saints,

I am not trying to self-justify myself or am concerned about my reputation but wanted to clear up some of these comments in regard to what I stated in the past:

Quote:
Rick Warren has done more good for the cause of Christ than all the "discernment ministries combined.


Brother, yes I said something in that vien. My burden in that quote or something slightly different was to express the fact that discernment ministries that point to the darkness and speak evil of many are not doing the will of God. Such ministries seem righteous but are stepping in the place of the devil "accuser" and also stepping in the place of "God" judge. We each have a realm of responsibility in our own walks with the Lord and in our local areas and we are not to be the police of Christendom world-wide, I fell into this trap for a season.

So therefore to conclude my point was that God has problaby used Rick Warren more to bear fruit for His kingdom than all of the discernment ministries that speak evil and show wicked things only to accuse. (One should seperate some godly ministries from this who biblical and gently teach truth and sometimes use an example of error). I trust that helps clear up my thinking in this area so it is not a stumbling block to some.


Quote:
And more recently, You stated that John G. Lake was in effect a heretic, by stating he did not believe in Hell, and wondering why so many people referred to him as a Godly man. Is this not so?



Brother, I wrote this thread in 2005 and never locked it but simply must have missed the last few posts and never personally responded: https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=8606&forum=40&start=10&viewmode=flat&order=0 - I have always thought highly of John G. Lake and still do feel the Lord used him (I have posted an article by andrew strom to this fact manytimes) but did hear his lack of belief in an eternal hell near the end of his ministry. So the question was raised about him my heart not that he was not was he a "heretic" I never actually used that wording.



--


"I would rather play with forked lightning, or take in my hand living wires with their fiery current, than speak a reckless word against any servant of Christ, or idly repeat the slanderous darts which thousands of Christians are hurling on others." - A.B. Simpson


Again I would encourage brothers and sisters to read the guiding principles and the first post in this thread:

7. SLANDERING OTHERS - We have a zero tolerance on slander, evil-speaking and speaking against a person's character without warrant. 'Slander no one.' / 'to malign no one, to be peaceable, gentle, showing every consideration for all men.' NASB (Titus 3:2). This is a very important biblical principle and we ask that you would especially respect the biblical method of approaching a brother privately (Matthew 18:15). Also there are hundreds of websites in the internet that exclusively post wrong teachings, errors and question the character of Christians, we do not want SermonIndex to be seen as such a ministry and ask that all forum members do not participate in posting in what is wrong. We believe simply that truth dispels errors and to focus on the truth will shine a light into all the darkness.

SermonIndex Community Guiding Principles
https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=44556&forum=13


_________________
SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2012/10/23 14:07Profile









 We need both: Warning and encouragement. Jesus did.

Thank-you Greg for responding as you did, which frankly increases my respect for you in the matters of integrity, and DO understand the propensity to accuse and devalue the wrong thinker or heretic; and there-by elevate yourself in the process. I am sure that I too have fell into this trap also, as you confessed.

"So therefore to conclude my point was that God has probably used Rick Warren more to bear fruit for His kingdom than all of the discernment ministries that speak evil and show wicked things only to accuse."..Greg.

But, How? can an unsaved liberal one-worlder EVER bare fruit for God? It is impossible.....and discerning evil and error in men posing as Christians is what the Wolf and the false prophet are all about, and as I wrote.....the Holy Shepherd must expose and drive away. Jesus did.

I cannot see how you can deny this, and yes...it does open up a can of worms often....but it is necessary.

"Now in this that I declare unto you I praise you not, that ye come together not for the better, but for the worse.

For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it.

For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you."

Saying that, I want to let this matter lay if it is alright with you....but encourage you that not all conflict is bad, or unedifying....and there are many "Christian" ministries that are in the process of falling away.

As Tozer said; the WAR is not over the Gospel, but the PURITY of the Gospel.....which Satan is constantly trying to corrupt. We need both; Edifying holy encouragement, and warning and instruction on what is sound doctrine, and what is not. This is the nature of teaching and Exhortation.

 2012/10/23 14:33
sermonindex
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Posts: 37399
"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11

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 Re: We need both: Warning and encouragement. Jesus did.

Brother, I would ask you to respect the point of this thread is not to debate the points you brought up but rather to consider what was written in the first post. I believe we all need to consider these things and ask the Lord in our private walks how we slander others in a way that does not glorify Christ. Thank you.


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SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2012/10/23 14:39Profile
Sree
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Joined: 2011/8/20
Posts: 1756


 Re: Slandering God's Servants - SI Forums Note

Quote:

Yet many of us can calmly and with calculated stroke blacken the name and character of a servant of God who perhaps does not see truth perfectly even and is still growing in grace.



Brother, I understand that in a body of believers there are babes and there are mature believers. Babes may not know all the truths. But babes should not teach as well. This forum being public lets both babes and mature in Christ to post their thoughts. But if those posted by babes are against the solid teachings of the Bible, then how can one handle it? I do not mean that we should rebuke such posters but we should also let the truth know. What if someone who is a new believer in Christ, comes to SI and reads a thread posted by Babe and gets deceived?

One such example is, whenever someone posts about struggling with a certain kind of sins, there are many posters who do not believe in repentance, advice or teach that you don't need to repent as God has already forgiven the sin you are now struggling with. This is against the word of God. On one side we have Sermons on repentance preached by such God fearing men like Zac Poonen and on these forums we let anyone teach the opposite.


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Sreeram

 2012/10/23 15:40Profile
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Joined: 2011/7/29
Posts: 683
northern USA

 Re: Slandering God's Servants - SI Forums Note

Likewise shame on anyone who criticizes a discernment ministry, for they are valid servants of the LORD!

Discernment ministries EXPOSE false teachers/heretics, as did the apostle Paul in his day. Discernment ministry saved me, and others, from the very subtle heresies/false teachings of certain heresies so prevalent today, including the tricky tentacles of Oneness Pentacostalism (which denies the Trinity) and which had me in confusion. Heretics (wolves in sheeps clothing) are NOT servants of the LORD but agents of the DEVIL. Paul EXPOSED them, he did not defend them in any way. He even said Let them be accursed. Unity at the expense of Truth is false unity.

 2012/10/23 15:46Profile
richrock
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Joined: 2012/2/27
Posts: 93
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 Re:

Greg,

I for one fully appreciate the terms with which you have stated in your first post. I do agree with them, and if any of my posts have slandered anyone, I will take this opportunity to repent of that slander.

However, like many things in our Christian lives, there exists a fine edged knife between what can be deemed truth according to scripture and what is in fact a clever distortion of the scripture.

Without discernment, and some (carefully reviewed) ministries I will not name, I would still be walking a self-centred, man-pleasing and doctrinally flawed Christian walk, even on many occasions uncertain that I was indeed saved. As much as we are to love our brothers, as much as we are to do good, to help, encourage, we are also to warn. I recall the example given by Paul Washer (whom many here would respect) who describes a child on a railway track. Do you whisper? Do you beckon quietly? Or do you scream "GET OFF THE TRACK!!!!" as the train approaches?

We all have to prayerfully consider what we write, which is also what we say, and even more so - what we are thinking. I am not perfect in this, in fact this is something that the Holy Spirit is challenging me in. To take a step back, think, pray, even breathe - before issuing a response or determining that it is better to walk away.

Sometimes (and there are some occasions in scripture) to call people out, in the expectation of repentance and a return to truth, but we are not to do this so lightly. Other times may call for a quiet word, then to meet together with another brother or sister, then in the congregation (the scripture for these escapes me at present). Also, was it not Paul who said that wolves had crept in unawares?

What I'm trying to get across is that some occasions call for it, but others don't - the ones that don't are the slanderous statements in my understanding.

Unless I am in grave error with this, I will not say any more on this matter. I appreciate this site for it's work in bring much quality teaching, and probably the best (I've found) Christian forum that does not typically degenerate into fights or flame wars. That says much for the Christ-like attitude of the mods and members.

 2012/10/23 16:19Profile





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