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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : "The Cost of Disciplship" by Dietrich Bonhoeffer Book Study Thread

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 Re:

The first three chapters of this book has a specific purpose and it takes one of the most insightful looks into the outcome of the reformation up to the point of this book being written. Cheap grace here is juxtaposition ed to Costly grace. One is salvation and the other is not. DB would look at the reformers, the second generation, the ones who came after Luther as people who merely gave mental assent to truth and had no new birth, was not regenerated and was not a new creature in Christ because salvation is not an abstract truth as the proponents of cheap grace had turned it into, but is Jesus Himself and a transformed life, it is knowing Jesus.

He writes in chapter one ......

"Cheap grace means grace as a doctrine, a principle, a system. It means forgiveness of sins proclaimed as a general truth, the love of God taught as the Christian " conception," of God. An intellectual assent to that idea is held to be of itself sufficient to secure remission of sin."

What DB has just described is the essence of religion and religiosity. And the ones who have a mere mental assent will always be the enemy of those who actually know Jesus and have been transformed by Him. One can perhaps trace this back to Cain and Abel or Saul and David and see the spirit of it down through the ages as religious men hunted down saints and killed them as heretics and done it in the name of God believing to be serving God.

He further writes in chapter one, page 45 ..........

"It is costly because it costs a man his life," referring to costly grace. And here he thrusts a blade into what became of the reformation .............

"Yet the outcome of the Reformation was the victory, not of Luther's perception of grace in all its purity and costliness, but of the vigilant religious instinct of man for the place where grace is obtained at the cheapest price. All that was needed was a subtle and almost imperceptible change of emphasis and the damage was done."

In other words, religious men sought to follow after Christ with the bare minimum of outward obedience and their eternal hopes rested upon a verbal confession of abstract truths but without the knowledge of the Lord Himself. And so, if wrongly applied, both saved and unsaved can verbally give assent to "justification by faith alone," one would be saved, the other would not. In order to illustrate this DB speaks of a man who strives all of his life to learn and at the end of his life he announces " I now do see that we can nothing know." Yet he goes on to say it is " quite a different thing when a freshman comes to the university and uses the same sentiment to justify indolence." This teaching of cheap grace has so taken hold of much of Christendom that the Lordship of Jesus is now counted as a " work," and therefore unnecessary for salvation.............bro Frank

 2012/8/9 0:51
IssacharSon
Member



Joined: 2012/7/12
Posts: 185
Southeast USA

 Re:

Regarding Christ's call in Db's chapter "The Call to Discipleship".

Overall it made me review the whole concept of the "calling" some folks claim to hjave on their lives. Doesn't every Christian have a "calling" on their life, not just pastors and clergy.

Isn't God forming a holy nation, a "royal priesthood"?

"The commandment is plain and straightforward: 'Follow Me'" ("Cost of..." pg 75).

Love-in-Christ,

KP

 2012/8/10 20:47Profile
IssacharSon
Member



Joined: 2012/7/12
Posts: 185
Southeast USA

 Grace and Discipleship

When I read the chapter on "The Call to Discipleship",

DB writes the following about our response to discipleship:

"As an external act the new existence is no better than the old. Even at the slightest estimate it can only achieve a new law of life. A new way of living which is poles apart from the new life with Christ. If a drunkard signs the pledge, or a rich man gives all his money away, they are both of them frreing themselves from the slavery to alcohol or riches, but not from their bondage to themselves" ("Cost of Discipleship", pg. 65)

As we continue moving in our "own little orbit" - we are still subject to the commandment of works, he goes on to say. This is how disciples can still fall into the error of "Pelagianism".

I guess, then, that when Christ calls, we don't see to "do something" worthwhile, but we respond simply for the "sake of the call".

How is any of this counter to Christianity?

Love-in-Christ,

KP

 2012/8/14 11:49Profile
MaryJane
Member



Joined: 2006/7/31
Posts: 3057


 Re: Grace and Discipleship

by IssacharSon on 2012/8/14 5:49:38

When I read the chapter on "The Call to Discipleship",

DB writes the following about our response to discipleship:

"As an external act the new existence is no better than the old. Even at the slightest estimate it can only achieve a new law of life. A new way of living which is poles apart from the new life with Christ. If a drunkard signs the pledge, or a rich man gives all his money away, they are both of them frreing themselves from the slavery to alcohol or riches, but not from their bondage to themselves" ("Cost of Discipleship", pg. 65)

As we continue moving in our "own little orbit" - we are still subject to the commandment of works, he goes on to say. This is how disciples can still fall into the error of "Pelagianism".

I guess, then, that when Christ calls, we don't see to "do something" worthwhile, but we respond simply for the "sake of the call".

How is any of this counter to Christianity?

Love-in-Christ,

KP
__________________

I am reading there just now will post soon what the LORD has placed on my heart from these pages :)

God Bless
mj

 2012/8/14 11:51Profile
MaryJane
Member



Joined: 2006/7/31
Posts: 3057


 Re:

Faith is only real when there is obedience never, with out it, and faith only becomes faith in the act of obedience. DB(the cost of discipleship)
___________________
I have often thought that these two acts where separate from one another but now I am beginning to see how perfectly in CHRIST they flow together. It is because of the faith that GOD has given me which compels me to live my life in obedience to HIM... and yet as I live my life obediently unto HIM(by HIS strength) my faith in HIM grows all the more stronger. JESUS calls me and I respond, there is an action that is required of me...HE calls and I respond but its only when I respond to HIS call that my eyes are opened and I see that if HE had not called I would not have responded. If HE had not supplied me with the desire, and faith to respond I would have been unable to respond in self. Because of who HE is and because HE has first called out to me by the power of the HOLY SPIRIT convicting me of my wretched sinful state that I am able to respond to HIS call. HE says come and because of who HE is I desire to follow. Its not the call that draws me its the person speaking the words that I long to obey and follow. I am seeing that since the first step I took at the cross in responding to CHRIST is so important, that each subsequent step must be also done in the same manner. Each step I take through out my life must be in response to HIS leading, to HIS calling, it must be done in obedience which increases my faith in HIM as I follow and respond to HIS leading in my life. If I find myself walking off on my own, or rushing in to do a thing that I think is “good” but have no direct call from CHRIST or leading from HIM in that direction the end results is sin and self. It does not matter if I see the thing as “good” if CHRIST says no then I am to obey, I may see the thing He calls me to as having no value and yet if CHRIST says come if I love HIM, and my desire is truly for HIM only I must follow. IT does not matter what I see or perceive about the thing HE has called me to, what matters is CHRIST. Of course I know that HE will only lead me to do what is good and righteous so there is no need for fear or doubt. In doing this my faith is increased by HIM who is leading and who has given me all that I need to obey. There is no self, there is only CHRIST...

Just my thoughts
God bless
maryjane

 2012/8/14 12:42Profile
Zionshield
Member



Joined: 2007/2/13
Posts: 135
Ohio

 Re:

I like what you are saying, maryjane.

I think of the response of creation when He said "Let there be..." We too find our being in the 1st step of obedience and become a new creation. He will put us in any number of circumstances to set up the possibility of faith-obedience.

It's this response of faith that attaches the branch to the Vine. Thereafter all that we need to do is remain or abide. I like what Watchman Nee said somewhat relative to this. He said the devil will more often try to get us to come out of hiding in Christ, to stop resting in Him.

Once we do this we strengthen the flesh and lose our dependence on the Lord. At this point we are a withering branch and need the Lord to present us with an oppurtunity for faith-obedience in order to regain our place at the cross, the Vine. Thus the seeking and knocking that prepares us to obey His voice when He opens the door.


_________________
Randy Lambert

 2012/8/17 22:51Profile





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