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pilgrim777
Member



Joined: 2011/9/30
Posts: 1211


 Re:

Quote:
You will find this mentality among religious people especially the longer they have been in religion. After that I think we might find that in areas in which people have determined there is no God based on their own work in the fields of the sciences and maybe technology but the religious aspect comes first.

This is why I separate myself from denominations and I don't keep myself in the religious bubble, if that makes sense?



That makes a lot of sense and it probably brings a lot more peace into your life. It certainly does for me.

Pilgrim

 2012/7/20 13:36Profile









 Re: some people are so closed minded!!

In the verses posted out of 1John 2 in the last post, it speaks about there being an antiChrist to come, but "many" antiChrists in the world and we can take that as "from before the creation of man."

"Anti" means "in place of" and not just "against".

John 1:1 states - In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

also - Rev 19:13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called "The Word of God."

By The Word of GOD was all things Created.

This is "Jesus". He said that He 'is' The Truth.

So, if we ignore The Word of GOD - we're ignoring Jesus.

This has nothing whatsoever to do with denominationism.

It has nothing to do with "religious people" - but has everything to do with those that love "The Word of GOD".

HE is called "The Word of Life" and His Word is called "The Word of Life."

The Bread from Heaven.

If a person finds anything that contradicts The Word of GOD that is also Jesus' Name - they are "antiChrist" or "walking in the spirit of antiChrist" because they are putting either their own words or the words of men "in place of and against" Christ Jesus - The Word of GOD made flesh and written.

It's all about "relationship" with Jesus/The Word of GOD, from eternity past, until eternity future - The Word of GOD is forever established in Heaven and will not go out void and if The Word of GOD be lifted up - He will draw all men unto Himself.

After Peter was baptized at Pentecost, he preached The Word of GOD and 3000 were saved. That was the first 'act' of The Holy Spirit upon the crowds that built the Church.

Those that infiltrated The Church after Pentecost - were hirelings, false teachers and why the Epistles were needed to be written --- to become what we now also can depend on - The Word of GOD - not religion.

Anything less is antiChrist.

 2012/7/20 13:58
IssacharSon
Member



Joined: 2012/7/12
Posts: 185
Southeast USA

 Re:

Jesus-Is-God wrote:

Every single debate can be ended with His Word alone - but I've yet to see a debate in 9 yrs on the internet that's been carried out with His Word and the original languages alone. Always quotes from so-and-so.

The day that anybody wants to calmly debate a topic with Scripture only, I'm going to celebrate exceedingly first and then we'll have a wonderful time together."

Jesus-Is-God, we had "a wonderful time together" in our "calmly debate" over the "nachash" translation in Genesis 3! I learned so much in that discussion with you! We debated and came out the other end in complete agreement. We never diverted from the Word of God in our debate and even used Scripture to interpret Scripture, as you poignantly illustrated certain elements of the discussion with a myriad of examples from other parts of scripture.

I, too, seek out discussions which rely on God's Word alone as the standard for Truth or any other epistemology.

I was a philosophy major in my undergraduate years and only recently have I found that all branches of the philosophical arts (History of Ancient Philosophy, History of Modern Philosophy, Epistemology, Metaphysics, and Ethics) can be resolved within the parameters of God's Word. God's Word addresses all scopes of philosophical inquiry...and resolves them.

Thirteen years after completing a B. A. in Religion and a BPhil in Philosophy from an Ivy League, liberal arts college, with a library spanning the thoughts and theories of the greatest minds in ancient and modern philosophical history - yet, when the Lord God, in his divine grace, started to reveal His Word to me and open my mind and heart to His truth - the philosophy of man quickly lost its epistemological stronghold on Truth. None compare to God's wisdom, which I truly love. As a philosopher by credential, God's Word reveals itself to be the true "philosopher's stone".

Jesus-Is-God also wrote:

"When we stand before Him - He'll ask us "What did you do with The Word that I left for you and My Spirit of Truth?"

That's a very serious question that I know He'll ask us."

With fear of God, Life is lived abiding in Christ consumed within His Spirit of Truth, and His Word abiding in me. My goal in life is to replace self-consciousness with Christ's consciousness. I decrease, He increases. The Word is the source of faith, as it comes by hearing the Word of God. Faith is the source of Godly love which John writes about in the NT. Man's knowledge never, ever taught me anything about faith. Philosophy loves wisdom, but it loves not God. This is an implicit contraction if one accepts God as an existential import whereby we start with the assertion that He exists. The philosopher's logic is as follows:

God is Wisdom
Philosophers are "lovers of wisdom"
Philosophers love not God

I've learned enough about deductive logic to see the implicit contradiction developing here. Yet and still, I once participated in this contradiction.

(I hope that the SI "Logicians" don't read this post, because they'd probably eat me alive - <chuckle>!)

Thank you for taking a stand for God's Word, Jesus-Is-God.

Love-in-Christ,

KP

 2012/7/20 18:04Profile
TMK
Member



Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 5379
NC, USA

 Re:

J-i-G wrote:

"Every Epistle is by an Apostle that had to fight to get 'the truth' back so that the Church would be strong.

Error weakens the Church.

Yes, instead of "fighting" - people should be going to The Word Alone to learn Truth and then they have the Truth Who is Christ Jesus behind them in their battle to save souls."
______________________

I have read all your posts in this thread and I am not 100% sure I understand what you are saying. You SEEM to be saying that there is no room for differing interpretations of various scriptures, because one of them must be wrong, and the person who has it wrong (usually the person who disagrees with how WE see it) must not be seeking the Truth, or are not being led by the Spirit of Truth.

Or perhaps I am missing your point entirely, which may be likely.

The OP is about close-mindedness. Are you saying that close-mindedness is a good thing when it comes to doctrinal points? I ask this because if two Spirit-filled believers who are honestly seeking after truth view certain doctrines or passages very differently, how do you reconcile this, especially when both cannot be right, even though both sides can very admirably support their views comparing scripture with scripture to the point where neither side can be said to "win" the debate?

At that point, it comes down to this: we can take a hard stand and insist that it is our way or the highway, despite the good arguments for the other side, or we can yield and accept that the other side may in fact be right, and change our view, or rather we can be open-minded and not be dogmatic about that particular subject.




_________________
Todd

 2012/7/20 20:03Profile









 Re:

TMK wrote :

"both sides can very admirably support their views comparing scripture with scripture to the point where neither side can be said to "win" the debate"

Indeed, and I call those who argue from the point that there is only one way to interpret various verses and doctrines, closed minded, rather. Sometimes those who make their point in other ways than using scripture are doing so for this very reason.

 2012/7/20 20:18









 Re:

Would like to go back to that word "anti" - defined ...

G473 αντί - anti =
1) over against, opposite to, before
2) instead of, in place of (something)
2a) instead of

As the prefix of antiChrist.

Jesus said, "I Am The Truth".

How many "truths" does Jesus have concerning His specific Teachings?
Didn't He say - let our answers be either Yea or Nay?

Has He more than one truth regarding GOD's Nature? Does He permit man to make up their own stories about Who He is? The very thing that got us started onto this topic last night.

A poster had put that GOD 'decreed' or 'authored' Adam's sin and yet punished him for it.

That would carry over to all of our sins, would it not?

How many truths do you believe that we should have regarding GOD's nature and the teaching on the cause of the original sin of Adam, that affects us all?

I've stressed "study" and with The Spirit of Truth.
Word studies - how and where else that one word is used - it's definition and the grammar in the sentences that it's used in and then with cross-referencing that verse to those through-out the rest of GOD's Word.

The confidence is never in our flesh - but the full confidence is in that GOD left us His Truth in His Word and used a language so exact that we can say that there are 24 "the"s. That's how exact the Greek is. That's the language GOD chose to write His New Testament in, for that very reason.

But all of this takes intensive study and prayer that His Spirit of Truth would guide us into all truth - As He had promised. But study is labor. He never said that it wouldn't be. It's a "seeking GOD" through the words that He's left for us. Other than the labor of study - none can take credit. Only The Perfect Author of that Book can take all credit for leaving us a Book that never contradicts itself. That it is One Book and not two.

If the Omniscient GOD can leave us a Book of Truth - who are we to say that it doesn't contain His Perfect Truth?
Again, does He have multiple truths?

All beliefs fall back on His Character. A false belief - falsely reflects upon His very Nature. That is why the searching out His Word in earnest is so very important - because if we stray too far from the Truth that He 'is' - we've strayed from Who He is and risk falling under another Jesus, other than the One and Only GOD, that He is, from eternity past.

If we say that we can't come into His Truth - we make Him a liar. We make Paul and John liars. We make the whole of the Book a lie and can no longer quote Jesus when He said - I AM THE TRUTH, follow Me.

If His Name is The Word of GOD and we claim to have The Word of GOD in our hands to study - why would we have the idea that there are multiple truths?

All truth reflects back on Who He 'is' - and if we stray from truth - we are coming under the defintion given for "anti".


 2012/7/20 21:09









 Re: some people are so closed minded!!


PaPa - Paul, John, Jude, and the other authors of what we call our Bible were indeed very closed minded.

It's only when people get their beliefs from men that they stumble and are tossed to and fro with every wind of doctrine.

The last days will be most notable for doctrines of devils - false prophets and false teachers - heresies.

If we don't get The Truth from Him alone - when everything that we believe is "shaken" - which it will be - we ourselves will be shaken.

I've seen people get shaken very easily in what they believe because they got what they believe from a human.

Where do we draw the line with multiple interpretations of what HE has said?

In His Love.

 2012/7/20 21:40









 Re:

Hi Sister KP. Thank you for taking the time to post. I came home earlier today really tired and didn't want to give you a quick reply - so I'll do my best to not do so - but wish I didn't feel so exhausted. I know we'll have other threads and other days to continue our quite enjoyable talks. It's been mutual, Sister.

Since my last post here, I've been grieving in spirit, I suppose you'd say. I fear that some may not realize that His Word is ALIVE. It's not just a book of words like any other book. It goes into our spirits - like money in the bank, and when needed - even if the brain isn't working - Scripture will come up from the spirit to either confirm or correct anything that we're exposed to.
While reading or hearing a sermon - or something that somebody says... the Scripture that we've deposited into the spirit [where it's discerned] - will come up to protect us.
I worked with Christians with Alzheimer and what I just posted was Proved to me through these dear old Saints with barely any brain left - in truth. The spirit doesn't get any diseases and that's where HIS Word is planted and stored and ready when needed without the need for their/our brain.


Any message that would take away, in the slightest, from our great-great need to be filled with His Word is from that "angel of light" that you and I spoke about - because that dark-one Knows that His Word is Light - Power - Life and Truth and why The Word was the Only thing that Jesus Himself used or needed against Satan's temptations. It's all we'll ever need. It's Life gives us His Spiritual Light and Life. Thy Word is a Lamp onto my feet and a Light upon my path - said the 5 wise virgins in His Spirit of Truth.
[Notice how the 5 foolish asked for more oil and were refused by the 5 wise and yet He hadn't come yet and there appears to have been a short time for them to go seek some, that they'd have to 'pay' for, before He came. Why would anyone need a lantern during the 'Brightness' of His Appearing had come 'right after' the call? Must have been a period of darkness to get through, before He Came.]


His Word is Spirit and Truth --- and that can be said as, "Spirit and The Word" ... same thing.

When I said that I hadn't seen any discussions between two people using Only His Word in 9 yrs - that's because the only site I knew that 'did' talk that way, closed down some yrs ago.

What I mean by 'study' is so simple compared to what 'studying' was, before computers. I have a few Bible programs, but I like the e-sword best and then I use another for the Greek grammar.
But this is how I read The Word ... using this version below, because you only need to hold the cursor over the number and not even have to click and the Strong's definition comes up .... Rom 1:12 (G1161) ThatG5124 is,G2076 that I may be comforted togetherG4837 withG1722 youG5213 byG1223 theG3588 mutualG1722 G240 faithG4102 bothG5037 of youG5216 andG2532 me.G1700

Many times, you'll see that some words have no number in some verses - so you know that the translators stuck that word in.

Then, if we look at a verse like John 3:16 and look at the grammar - we find that the KJV says "believeth", but the grammar is "continuous action", so it's really "continually believing".
That makes a very big difference with the "said a sinners' prayer one time" folks.


I'm not too big on the Commentary section, but in that section I do like TSK, Torrey's Scriptural Knowledge, because he gives the cross-references to most all of the verses. Not saying he could do it exhaustively for each verse - but when you go verse to verse - he gives more for those.

You could spend an entire day doing a study on just one verse. Sometimes two days. Sometimes even more. GOD's Word is fathomless and there's little to compare to spending the time studying this way. It's mind blowing actually because just the Greek is a language so unlike our own because though the Strong's is O.K. for an idea of the definition, in the Greek, they'll add a few letters before or after the word and that'll give you the tenses, gender and so much more. And because we're doing what The Holy Spirit was given to us for - He kicks in and the Joy and Awe is from His Joy - that John 16:13,14 over-drive [for the lack of a better word right now.]


Why folks find reading or studying His Word boring is because they haven't gotten into the Depths of it. Just cross-referencing alone is so exciting - to see how many verses from the O.T. are cross-referenced to the New - and that's when you realize that IT'S JESUS SPEAKING ALL THE WAY THROUGH THAT ENTIRE BOOK, FROM COVER TO COVER.


O.K... Now I just have to say WOW and I LOVE IT/HIM! :)


Bless you Sister. I pray you're strengthened daily in spirit by His Word.
Satan can't handle someone that is filled with Both - he can't 'confound' - His Spirit with The Truth of His Word .... Amen!

Even folks with Alzheimer. :) I am a witness of that fact.



His Love back to you.
Have a Great night!

 2012/7/21 1:13
IssacharSon
Member



Joined: 2012/7/12
Posts: 185
Southeast USA

 Re:

Jesus-Is-God,

You said so much in your last post that I NEED to respond to in utter agreement!

I have to go to this Wedding Reception in a few minutes, so I'll have to respond later.

But just to read what you wrote about the "JOY" and "AWE" the Holy Spirit shares with those who seek the Lord and desire to know Him, is soooo true.

All week I have been attending parties, dinners, and other various family "get-togethers" as part of a week long wedding celebration within my extended family. My sixty year-old uncle is getting married for the third time.

Yet, at all of these occasions, I mostly babysit, fellowship with the children (my nieces, nephews, and second and third generation cousins). Two nights ago at such an event, I surprised the matriarch of the family (my grandmother) by having the children get together and organize a talent show to perform for her. One of the acts was performed by three 6 to 8 year-old girls who opted to sing "Jesus Loves Me" a capella!

This precious performance was the only circumstance I encountered whereby The Lord God was brought up. And of course, the topic was initiated by little children. Why is such a social faux pas to talk about the beauty and greatness of The Lord at gatherings and celebrations? Ugh! How upsetting.

Will talk to more about this,

Love-In-Christ,

KP

 2012/7/21 16:37Profile
proudpapa
Member



Joined: 2012/5/13
Posts: 2936


 Re: Jesus-is-GOD

Jesus-is-GOD how are you?

Jesus-is-GOD wrote //PaPa - Paul, John, Jude, and the other authors of what we call our Bible were indeed very closed minded.
It's only when people get their beliefs from men that they stumble and are tossed to and fro with every wind of doctrine.//

I agree, but the problem is we all, rather we admit it or not, have had preconcieved views that have been brainwashed into us of what certain scriptures mean. I want to be open not to every wind of doctrine but rather to God rooting out errors in my understanding and leading me to all truth.

 2012/7/23 22:45Profile





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