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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Messiah as our Bridegroom.

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EverestoSama
Member



Joined: 2010/5/17
Posts: 1175


 Re:

Quote:
How can son's and daughters' be the wife?

How can The Father be be their husband?

We don't pray to our husband which art in heaven, we pray to "Our Father which art in heaven".



Yup. And that's just for starters.

 2012/6/21 22:56Profile
Blayne
Member



Joined: 2012/5/27
Posts: 274


 Re:

Hi! ChristInYou & EverestoSama

Well, what can I say?
Evidently, you failed to understand the truth about what Paul explained as "a great mystery".

Yes, it is indeed true that, (as an individual), you address God as your Heavenly Father because He is the origin of all life.

However, the faithful church collectively is the wife of Jesus, the Husband.

Paul clearly states that Christ is the Husband of the church, (Eph 5:31-32).
"For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one. This is a great mystery, and I take it to mean Christ and the church".

Further confirmation is, "The two shall become one. But he who is united to the Lord becomes one spirit with him".

Here are additional Scriptures which you can review concerning God as Husband to His People in the Old Testament:
Isaiah 54:5, "For your Maker is your husband—the Lord Almighty is His name—the Holy One of Israel is your Redeemer; He is called the God of all the earth".
Isiah 61:10, "I delight greatly in the Lord ... For He has clothed me ... as a bridegroom decks himself as a priest".
Isaiah 62:5, " As a young man marries a maiden (virgin), so will your sons marry you;as a bridegroom rejoices over his bride, so will your God rejoice over you".

Clearly the Church (which is you and me) is the "Wife of the Lamb" (Christ). When a man and a woman marry, they become one flesh. Because we have an intimate relationship with Jesus, we have become one spirit with Him.

Presently, we are the wife of Christ.
But the Scripture says that Jesus ransomed us for God: "For thou wast slain and by thy blood didst ransom men for God", (Rev 5:9)". That's why Jesus saved us! He saved us for God ... not for Himself.

The Salvation plan of Jesus is to present us as a bride without spot or wrinkle to the Bridegroom, who is God.

Jesus Christ is the beginning of the New Creation, and when it is completed He will surrender everything to the Father, for God desires to be everything to everyone. Therefore fulfilling the Scripture saying, "When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all", (1Cor 15:28).

Now, please! I don't wish to enter into a debate about this.
Frankly, my posture towards you and everyone else is this:
Are you content with what you have as a Christian?
If so, then far be it for me to attempt stealing your contentment away.


=====================
Re:
by Christinyou on 2012/6/21 19:24:32

How can son's and daughters' be the wife?

How can The Father be be their husband?

We don't pray to our husband which art in heaven, we pray to "Our Father which art in heaven".

=====================

Re: |
Quote:
How can son's and daughters' be the wife?

How can The Father be be their husband?

We don't pray to our husband which art in heaven, we pray to "Our Father which art in heaven".


Yup. And that's just for starters.

=========================

 2012/6/22 0:24Profile
EverestoSama
Member



Joined: 2010/5/17
Posts: 1175


 Re:

Quote:
Evidently, you failed to understand the truth about what Paul explained as "a great mystery".



Not really. It makes perfect sense Christ currently being the husband AND the bridegroom if you look at it from the Jewish perspective of marriage (which is the perspective being spoken from written by first century Jews) and not from the modern day western perspective of marriage.

It explains it a bit in the original post. However, if one continues to try and view it through the lens of a western perspective 2000 years removed from it's original context, culture, and audience, it's not going to make much sense, and a person might have to read things into the text that are not there to have it line up with their presuppositions.



 2012/6/22 0:31Profile
Blayne
Member



Joined: 2012/5/27
Posts: 274


 Re:

Hi! EverestoSama

Your comment here reminded me of a 'secret' recipe that I once read. It dutifully gave all the measurements and time allowances but failed to name the ingredients.
But of course, that's why the recipe still remains a 'secret'.
Your reply here failed to avail the scriptural ingredients to your stated opinion.
I guess I'll just have to leave you to your secrets and move on past the nonsense. :)

=======================
Re:
by EverestoSama on 2012/6/21 21:31:49

Quote:
Evidently, you failed to understand the truth about what Paul explained as "a great mystery".



Not really. It makes perfect sense Christ currently being the husband AND the bridegroom if you look at it from the Jewish perspective of marriage (which is the perspective being spoken from written by first century Jews) and not from the modern day western perspective of marriage.

It explains it a bit in the original post. However, if one continues to try and view it through the lens of a western perspective 2000 years removed from it's original context, culture, and audience, it's not going to make much sense, and a person might have to read things into the text that are not there to have it line up with their presuppositions.
=======================

 2012/6/22 4:57Profile
EverestoSama
Member



Joined: 2010/5/17
Posts: 1175


 Re:

Quote:
Your reply here failed to avail the scriptural ingredients to your stated opinion.



Quote:
It explains it a bit in the original post.



Secret ingredient number 1: Make sure to read everything in the post you quote. ;)

The original article stated it just fine. YOU'RE the one trying to say something quite beyond that by reading onto the Scriptures something that it doesn't say. Your difficulty seems to be coming from the fact that you aren't grasping the Hebrew perspective (the one that Jesus, Paul, and all the apostles were speaking from) of marriage, betrothal, and union.

The idea of Christ as the bridegroom didn't originate in the New Testament either. It's heavily portrayed throughout the Song of Songs, which was being read in the temple at the time of the Passover, when all of this was taking place.

You're saying something beyond that. Now, the burden of proof is on YOU to present that solidly, not the other way around. So far your evidence in Scripture has not been the least bit convincing. Just saying.

And hey, if you can get some more convincing Scriptural content to support your supposition, I'll promise you this, I'll be the first one on here to say that I had it all wrong.

 2012/6/22 6:13Profile









 Re: Messiah as our Bridegroom.


Amen, Brother Art. Tis True and such Beautiful Word Pictures for us - to give us that strength,hope and anticipation to endure until He returns for us.

The Bridegroom cometh future tense and when He Comes [Rev 19:7] Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to Him:
for the marriage of the Lamb is come,
and His wife hath made herself ready.

The Song of Solomon [Amen, EverestoSama] and the Five wise virgins.


Such a beautifully Scriptural way you've presented our relationship of Love with our Beloved.
We wait on Him, Whom our soul longs for.

Thank you!

 2012/6/22 8:20
Christinyou
Member



Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3707
Ca.

 Re:

The mystery of Paul is not the Father becoming the husband of the Son. The mystery is The Only Begotten Son, The Incorruptable Seed being birthed in the believer, The Son not only becoming the life of God the The Father in the believer by the Son, but the believer also becomming the Bride of Christ, who is now our husband also, who on resurrection day He will take us to His and our Father's House, as a witness of the five virgins with oil in their lamps.

John 14:2-4 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also. And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know.

John 14:9-12 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father? Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works. Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works' sake. Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.

This cannot be my Husbands house, but must be "My Father's House", and yours, which the Bride of Christ will be taken by the Bridegroom to His and our Father's House to celebrate the Marriage Supper of the Lamb.

In Christ: Phillip


_________________
Phillip

 2012/6/22 16:07Profile
psalm1
Member



Joined: 2007/1/30
Posts: 1230


 Re:

Quote by Blaine;

"Jesus is not the 'bridegroom' but the 'husband', because He ALREADY has taken up a dwelling place in us and we are one spirit with Him."




This is not true.

The bride will be gathered in the future. That is why the living and the dead are gathered up into heaven.The left behind 5 foolish virgins will be martyred,also the 144k and the 2 witnesses.

They all must be gathered to heaven,the fathers house,for the wedding and the marriage supper.

 2012/8/26 12:58Profile
Christinyou
Member



Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3707
Ca.

 Re:

Would the Son not be proud and wanting to show the Bride to His Father of whom He paid such a price for, bringing to completion Those chosen to be in the Son and the Son in them, even before the foundation of the world. The Father's perfect plan to bring sons' into His house.

Ephesians 1:4-6 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.

We are the Bride, accepted in the beloved Jesus Christ who is the Groom and when in the Father's house Jesus is our husband of His bride, the son's of God "our Father".

With perfect adoption procedures, having the Seal of the Holy Spirit in us, with a new name written on a perfect white stone, that only I know as I am known.

In Christ: Phillip


_________________
Phillip

 2012/8/27 20:16Profile





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