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inotof
Member



Joined: 2005/1/7
Posts: 267
Morehead, KY

 Virgin or Young girl?

I just want to throw this out there– Isa. 7:14, in the traditional KJV states that “ God Himself will give you a sign–Behold a virgin shall conceive and bear a Son and shall call his name Immanuel”. Indeed this is one of the most powerful Prophetic Scriptures that the prophet Isaiah ever uttered (53 takes the cake though ;) ) I’ve noticed a disturbing trend among modern Bible translations. The word “virgin” is missing from that passage being replaced with the phrase "young girl". I’m not sure if there has been any commenting on this fact here on SI, I know that there is a post about “Which Translation”--I use a lot of different Bibles when I study–so I’m not bashing al translations–it would seem though that there are many “NEW” ones that are a little on the Liberal side of the fence. I guess what bugs me most is these are supposed to be “scholars” those that have devoted their lives to the study of Gods word. However it would seem that rather than using their time to help make the sacred words of Scripture more clear, that they muddy the Living waters, or rather seek to , with their own opinion or what they “think this passage must have meant”. Where do we draw the line? I recently read a “preview” copy of a “new” translation coming out–people at the CBA Advance where all abuzz with it. I however was shocked at it’s warm reception despite the fact that the translators cut out the Virgin Birth.
This is one of the foundational truths about Jesus! Why oh why, do some seem content despite attacks from Satan, despite attack from liberal media, despite the attacks from, the homosexual agenda and other groups too numerous to name ON THE OUTSIDE—seem all too eager to call into question the validity of the faith that they themselves (supposedly) hold to!?!
We need to pray that those that really have a heart for Jesus would stand and proclaim with boldness unheard of, the True Gospel of Our Savior! We need once again kneel at the feet of Jesus rather than at the feet of intellect, after all, as I understand it, the foolishness of God (if there is indeed such a thing) is wiser than the wisdom of men.
My main concern is this, if “so-called scholars” can change the facts of the virgin birth, then what can they do to manipulate the power of the Cross and what of the blood or the absolute natural death of Jesus–when --if this kind of junk is allowed to continue–will Jesus no longer be resurrected? It sickens, saddens, scares and spurns my soul.


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David

 2005/2/5 13:53Profile
philologos
Member



Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re: Virgin or Young girl?

Hi inotof
We did touch on the topic of the meaning of 'almah' over a year ago in a virgin shall conceieve.


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Ron Bailey

 2005/2/5 15:22Profile
inotof
Member



Joined: 2005/1/7
Posts: 267
Morehead, KY

 Re:

Thaks a million! is there anyway to search through the posts of the past? that way i can avoid reposting topics.


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David

 2005/2/5 15:55Profile









 Re:

You're heading smack into the Bible version debate.

The main reason for this change is that the KJV is based on a different text than the modern versions are. (NIV, NASB, RSV, etc)

This is a very deep topic, but one that I believe ALL believers need to study. You will be amazed by what you havent been told about modern versions.

My personal belief is that the KJV is based on the preserved Word of God (thru His promises), and the modern versions are based on corrupted text, commonly referred to as the Alexandrian Text. Therein lies the difference.

Happy research!

Krispy

 2005/2/7 9:25
philologos
Member



Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re:

Quote:
You're heading smack into the Bible version debate.

The main reason for this change is that the KJV is based on a different text than the modern versions are. (NIV, NASB, RSV, etc)

My personal belief is that the KJV is based on the preserved Word of God (thru His promises), and the modern versions are based on corrupted text, commonly referred to as the Alexandrian Text. Therein lies the difference.


KrispyKrittr
The more you write on this topic the more I think you don't really understand the basics of it. Old Testament texts are not part of the discussion about manuscript families. That only pertains to the New Testament.

Your statement above is completely inaccurate. All versions KJV, NIV, NASB, RSV are based on the [u]SAME[/u] Hebrew text of the Old Testament; the Masoretic. The RSV has sometimes taken the Septuagint as it primary source, but otherwise all translations of the Old Testament have the Masoretic text as their foundation.


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Ron Bailey

 2005/2/8 5:05Profile
philologos
Member



Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re:

Yes, Sermonindex has quite a power search engine here. Experiment with it. I use it to find the most recent postings. Just hit 'search' as it is without any search parameters and it will produce the whole SI archive (theoretically) in date order. I can then scan the topics to see what is happening in the forums.

If you use this search engine with 'virgin' in the 'key words' search, you will pages of stuff. If you specify a forum this will narrow the search. If you specify a post-er this will further narrow the search.

The other way is just to start a conversation in the lounge; most likely someone will remember an earlier thread and link you to it.


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Ron Bailey

 2005/2/8 5:13Profile









 Re:

Quote:
The more you write on this topic the more I think you don't really understand the basics of it. Old Testament texts are not part of the discussion about manuscript families. That only pertains to the New Testament.



I know my post implies that, and thats probably because I wrote it on the fly and did not express myself as clearly as I probably should have. However, I believe the issue between the Greek manuscripts does play into this because the changes in the OT that we see in the modern versions DOES fit together with the Alexandrian Text better than if it were left "virgin". So therefore, I stand by what I say. Changing the word to young girl in the OT will fit the modern versions better. And thats wrong.

You are correct about the text used for the OT, and I understood that long before I began talking with you about it.

I'm not as far off base as you like to make me out to be. I'm just not as seasoned as you at debating it and getting my words to express my position.

Krispy

 2005/2/8 7:58
Sentry
Member



Joined: 2004/2/5
Posts: 119
West Monroe, Louisiana

 Re: Virgin or Young girl?

Inotof,

I agree, we must be very careful of some of these newer versions...but I'm curious, just what versions are you talking about?

I checked the following versions...and all of them mentioned the virgin birth:

NEW LIFE VERSION
NEW INTERNATIONAL VERSION
AMERICAN STANDARD
NEW AMERICAN STANDARD
THE MESSAGE
AMPLIFIED BIBLE
NEW LIVING TRANSLATION
NEW KING JAMES
ENGLISH STANDARD


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Mark

 2005/2/9 14:36Profile





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