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 Re:

"Please don't preach hate."

You claimed earlier that those who do not keep the letter of the 4th commandment do not really love Jesus - that is preaching hate.

"This is an enlightened community."

Like the Galatian church that was allowing the judiazers... very enlightened

"We share and learn"

Some of us also correct and rebuke, and take seriously the call to shut the mouths of those who seek to take Gods heritage captive into law.

" My post is all biblical with the appropriate verses to back it up"

So was mine - and I showed how you were twisting the verses you posted.

"You can disagree but don't persecute."

I am not persecuting you - clever way to spin this. Like the poor dogs who came teaching heresy to the galatians. They were so persecuted by Paul. Then there are the poor persecuted teachers on Crete whom titus was instructed to shut their mouths. Yes... "persecution"... you poor fella. I pray that you will see the error of your way and be filled with the holy spirit through faith.

-Jim



 2012/2/26 14:09
roadsign
Member



Joined: 2005/5/2
Posts: 3776


 Re:

Ephah, I admit, your response to my testimony threw me. Perhaps I was overly cryptic. Eleven year ago I produced a fuller testimony and theological reflection and uploaded it. Here you'll see how central the fourth commandment was to me, and then you can decide if this sounds like "doing my own thing".

I realize this is old and could stand rewriting - but I am no longer able to access this site. Anyway, the first two "chapters" here may help you understand my thinking - and what perhaps indeed might need reconsideration. I welcome your thoughts.

Entering the Place of Rest:
http://www.quiteexcellent.com/thewayback.net/articles/ENTERING/title.htm

Blessings,
Diane


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Diane

 2012/2/26 14:29Profile
Christinyou
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Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3699
Ca.

 Re:

"Today, let us remember the fourth commandment and Keep it Holy". !!!not!!!

Today let us remember the fourth commandment and keep Him Holy, for He is our Sabbath rest, continually and forever. "Do this in remembrance of Me". The Body and Blood of the Lord of the Sabbath, we must enter His Rest.
Heb 4:. Our rest is not in the flesh anymore but in the Spirit and in Christ by He that is born again in us, which gives the flesh strength and rest. For God swore in His wrath that we cannot enter His rest by our own keeping of the Old Testament Law. "A new commandment I give you" Love which is fulfillment of the whole Law, that Love is Christ, "Christ in you the hope of Glory".

In Christ who is my Sabbath Rest: Phillip


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Phillip

 2012/2/26 14:43Profile









 Re: And this is love....

Brother Jim, please spare me the old tired pharisees/ judiazers rhetoric, please. And please don't put words in my mouth I didn't claim anything brother, it's your own Savior that made this statement.

1 John 2:4 -- He who says I know him, and not keep his laws, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

I didn't say that I merely quoted it from the same bible you and I are reading from. Yet you say I'm ignorant of scripture. You're right I am.

All throught the scripture, Our Savior pleads with his people to keep his commandments, over and over and over.

Even on the way to be crucified, he said the same thing, "If you love me keep my commandments" How can anyone claim to love him with a straight face and reject his commandment, HOW!

 2012/2/26 15:06









 Re: And this is love....

Diane please forgive me, I have no ill intentions at all. I do understand you your post. What I'm suggesting is believers should stick to what the holy Scripture tells us to do, what our savior commanded us to do; not by our own feelings or experiences.

All throught the scripture, Our Savior pleads with his people to keep his commandments, over and over and over. Even on the way to be crucified, he said the same thing, "If you love me keep my commandments" How can we claim to love him while rejecting his commandment, HOW!

 2012/2/26 15:09









 Re: And this is love....

Brother Philips, thanks for reading my post, your comments are welcomed. I will be blunt, there is no where in the Scriptures that teach us to keep the commandments anyhow we deem
necessary.

However, If that works for you, great.

 2012/2/26 15:23
Christinyou
Member



Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3699
Ca.

 Re:

The Lord is no longer in His temple in Jerusalem, so no one can keep the Sabbath as God intended for worship and forgivness of sin by blood sacrifice.

We are His temple and He is in us, this is keeping the Sabbath, "do this in remembrance of Me". Going to the assembling of ourselves as the time grows near is a good thing and we are told not forsake this assembling. But, The Church assembly is not where we keep the Sabbath, we keep the Sabbeth in His temple, daily. We are His temple and that is where He will meet us, as on the seventh day, but now by the Christ in His temple, us, our Sabbath is 24-7. I no longer am in the outer court in the temple, for we are commanded to come boldly to the throne of Grace, that is where the Lord of the Sabbath is and will always be, by His Grace and mercy, "Christ in you the hope of Glory", the fulfillment of the Word of God which also includes the Sabbath now in us. There is a difference in the Law of the Sabbath and fulfillment of the Sabbath in you.

"You must be born again to see the things of the Kingdom of God". Which by His rebirth in us we now see Him as our Sabbath.

In Christ: Phillip


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Phillip

 2012/2/26 16:42Profile
hulsey
Moderator



Joined: 2006/7/5
Posts: 640
Missouri

 Re:

Ephah,
How do you interpret these writings of Paul?

Galatians 3:15-21

15 Brethren, I speak in terms of human relations: even though it is only a man’s covenant, yet when it has been ratified, no one sets it aside or adds conditions to it.
16 Now the promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed. He does not say, “And to seeds,” as referring to many, but rather to one, “And to your seed,” that is, Christ.
17 What I am saying is this: the Law, which came four hundred and thirty years later, does not invalidate a covenant previously ratified by God, so as to nullify the promise.
18 For if the inheritance is based on law, it is no longer based on a promise; but God has granted it to Abraham by means of a promise.

I understand this to say that the Law does not replace the promise given to Abraham, is different from the promise given to Abraham (different in purpose), and is less powerful than and subordinate to the promise given to Abraham.

19 Why the Law then? It was added because of transgressions, having been ordained through angels by the agency of a mediator, until the seed would come to whom the promise had been made.
20 Now a mediator is not for one party only; whereas God is only one.
21 Is the Law then contrary to the promises of God? May it never be! For if a law had been given which was able to impart life, then righteousness would indeed have been based on law.

The Law is only contrary to the promise if it too can make someone righteous. But righteousness, while demanded by the Law, is not a promise of the Law. If the Law can do that then the promise is of no use.

24 Therefore the Law has become our tutor to lead us to Christ, so that we may be justified by faith.
25 But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.

Christ did say that if we loved Him we would keep His commands. But He also said that He was a ‘greater than Moses’. The commands that Christ Himself gave; love one another are higher than the Law of Commandments given by Moses. Christ too was a Law Giver.

How do you interpret this passage from Galatians?

Galatians 4:8,9

8 However at that time, when you did not know God, you were slaves to those which by nature are no gods.
9 But now that you have come to know God, or rather to be known by God, how is it that you turn back again to the weak and worthless elemental things, to which you desire to be enslaved all over again?

These were Gentiles who had become Christians. They were being taught that they had to keep the Law of Moses in order to be Christians. The way I understand these verses, Paul is saying a Gentile who leaves idolatry to become a Christian is turning to something as weak as the idolatry he left if he begins to keep the Law as though it were necessary for his salvation. Paul calls the Law “weak and worthless" for making someone righteous.


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SI Moderator - Jeremy Hulsey

 2012/2/26 18:11Profile
roadsign
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Joined: 2005/5/2
Posts: 3776


 Re:

Quote:
How can we claim to love him while rejecting his commandment, HOW!



It’s an impossibility, isn’t it! The challenge (which seems to reflect your struggle Ephah) is in judging what is deemed “obedience”. Let’s admit, there are numerous biblical laws you can follow without being obedient to God at all. You can do it in your own powers, and you can do it for faulty reasons – such as the older brother in the parable. And here I’m not merely speaking theoretically, I’m speaking from a personal awareness.

Praise God for Galatians – such as 5:16-18 which helps set this issue straight! But even here, I realize one may imagine they are following the Spirit when they are following their own “spirit”. But conversely, one might judge another as “doing their own thing” when they are truthfully following the Spirit (many great saints have been accused of that).

In a sense we merely work ourselves into a futile frenzy when we try to dissect another person’s motives or their degree of obedience – even our own. After all, even if you and I are doing okay, God may very well be calling us to a costlier obedience. And God doesn’t give you or me that call for another person. He gives that person the call directly – by his Spirit. And if one does not have the Spirit because they have not been born from above – then what good is it to fill the void by merely trying to follow manageable commandments (as one understands them)? Now that doesn't make sense, does it!?

Diane


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Diane

 2012/2/26 18:38Profile









 Re:

"Brother Jim, please spare me the old tired pharisees/ judiazers rhetoric, please."

Have I now become your enemy by telling you the truth?

-Jim

 2012/2/26 18:42





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