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rbanks
Member



Joined: 2008/6/19
Posts: 1257


 The trappings of Legalism

Hi everyone,

I have not started a thread in a long… time. I have decided to start this one with something on my heart instead of replying to the many other threads that many are struggling with.

The reason I’ve called it “The trappings of Legalism” is because that is what came to my mind as I reflected on why many fall into the bondage of legalism. I believe there are people who honestly want to please God and they fall into bondage trying to please Him. I have seen people and I have also been guilty of trying to find something in the bible that I am not doing that they were doing back then, not realizing that God’s word speaks to all ages and the spiritual truth is the same but methods and customs are not the same.

Let’s take for example the spirit of foot-washing is the same but back in the bible days (and maybe in some parts of the world they still do) they washed their feet when they entered a home after they walked from place to place. I believe Jesus was using foot washing as an example not necessarily as an ordinance to practice every time we do communion.

I believe people have fallen into legalism concerning a certain Sabbath Day instead of understanding the spiritual significance of the Sabbath being our spiritual rest in Jesus Christ.

I also believe even though not all but some have fallen into legalism in the wearing of a head covering because they believe that it is mandatory for all ages, people, and places instead of realizing the spiritual significance of what Paul was saying to the Corinthians. We even have some excellent bible preachers falling prey to these “trappings” making such statements as classifying the sins of the flesh as the same as not doing an outward custom for a particular time and place when so many excellent bible teachers can’t even agree on exactly what Paul was meaning in 1 cor. 11.2-16.

I am not an excellent bible teacher but I believe that if one is in a setting or region where the custom is not in the wearing of a veil or material for an head covering as long as we are not disobedient to the spirit of authority in the order that Paul laid out then we do not have to join into another custom that we are not familiar with because that is the whole thing Paul was trying to say to the Corinthians.
I hope to say more but got to go for now.

Any thoughts…

Blessings to all!

 2012/2/6 18:52Profile
myfirstLove
Member



Joined: 2005/11/26
Posts: 496


 Re: The trappings of Legalism

Hi Rbanks,

Do you consider this legalism?

Act 15:20 but should write to them to abstain from the things polluted by idols, and from sexual immorality, and from what has been strangled, and from blood.

The gentiles were told to do things that were customary for Jews...abstain from things polluted by idols, from animals strangled and blood. Those are not necessarily heart issues, but commands regarding things outside the heart.

Were the apostles being legalistic here? Should they have just not given any commands to the gentiles? I'm trying to understand how you define legalism and how you judge what parts of the bible are legalistic.

Thanks...

~Sean


_________________
Lisa

 2012/2/6 19:13Profile









 Re:


Paul's mind -



1 Corth 8 - whole chpt.



1Co 9:19-23 For though I be free from all men, yet have I made myself servant unto all, that I might gain the more. And unto the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law; To them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law.
To the weak became I as weak, that I might gain the weak: I am made all things to all men, that I might by all means save some.
And this I do for the gospel's sake, that I might be partaker thereof with you.



1Cor 10:23-33 All things are lawful for me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but all things edify not.
Let no man seek his own, but every man another's wealth.
Whatsoever is sold in the shambles, that eat, asking no question for conscience sake: for the earth is the Lord's, and the fulness thereof.
If any of them that believe not bid you to a feast, and ye be disposed to go; whatsoever is set before you, eat, asking no question for conscience sake.
But if any man say unto you, This is offered in sacrifice unto idols, eat not for his sake that shewed it, and for conscience sake: for the earth is the Lord's, and the fulness thereof:
Conscience, I say, not thine own, but of the other: for why is my liberty judged of another man's conscience?
For if I by grace be a partaker, why am I evil spoken of for that for which I give thanks?
Whether therefore ye eat, or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God.
Give none offence, neither to the Jews, nor to the Gentiles, nor to the church of God; even as I please all men in all things, not seeking mine own profit, but the profit of many, that they may be saved.



Romans 14 - whole chpt -

 2012/2/6 19:50
MaryJane
Member



Joined: 2006/7/31
Posts: 3057


 Re: The trappings of Legalism

rbanks
You wrote:The reason I’ve called it “The trappings of Legalism” is because that is what came to my mind as I reflected on why many fall into the bondage of legalism. I believe there are people who honestly want to please God and they fall into bondage trying to please Him. I have seen people and I have also been guilty of trying to find something in the bible that I am not doing that they were doing back then, not realizing that God’s word speaks to all ages and the spiritual truth is the same but methods and customs are not the same.
_________________
Thank you for this post. I found it very thoughtful and I really appreciated it. I too have struggled with looking for things I can do to "please" God in some external way. HE is showing me that the desire to please HIM does come from HIM... but its not about doting all the i's and crossing all the t's, its about living daily moment by moment in JESUS! Walking by faith and trusting in HIM, living in submission to HIM as LORD, not because I am "told" to by men but because I long to because of who HE is.

I look forward to reading what more you have to share.

God Bless
mary

 2012/2/6 20:25Profile
Matthew2323
Member



Joined: 2004/5/17
Posts: 235
Colorado

 Re: Account

Sean,

You do know that you are welcome to create your own account here at SI?

Matthew


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Matthew

 2012/2/6 22:46Profile
rbanks
Member



Joined: 2008/6/19
Posts: 1257


 

Sean,

Thank you for bringing up one of the points I was trying to make. The four necessary commands in acts 15 which seem good to the Holy spirit was for the purpose of keeping them out of a burden of legalism in keeping the law of Moses. The apostle’s said that is was a yoke that none could bear and that no one could be saved except only through the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Of the four commands two were primarily for God because they were sins of the flesh that would keep one from inheriting the Kingdom of God and must be dealt with by the blood of His cross and our faith in Christ our redeemer whom we receive our deliverance.

The two commandments that you mentioned was primarily for the Jewish people whom Christ also died for whereby the Holy Spirit would give them(Gentiles) special grace to obey, as in Paul saying that if eating meat offends my brother then I will eat no meat. It is obvious that all around them were Jews that Christ also died for and these two things were very offensive to the Jews and they needed the fellowship of the Jewish people. This is one of my points concerning the head covering in Corinth for the women had been made free in Christ but they were still to honor their husbands as their head under Christ. The material head covering was the custom of the Jewish religion and for a married woman to pray or prophesy in their new freedom without this visible head covering it would appear to others that the women was dishonoring her husband. The woman’s head in the passage of scripture in 1 cor 11 is clearly her husband who she would appear to be dishonoring because of the custom. This is why Paul appeals to nature teaching us how it would be a shame for a man to have long hair or a woman to have short hair.
Now let’s fast forward 1900 years from 1 cor 11 and let’s go west completely away from the eastern customs because remember the Gentiles were not given the law of Moses but Jesus died for them also. The bible teaches whom the Son has set free is free indeed so where does it say in the bible that we are to go to a yoke of bondage of doing something outwardly that is religious.

Colossians 2:14-23 (KJV)
14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.
18 Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshipping of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind,
19 And not holding the Head, from which all the body by joints and bands having nourishment ministered, and knit together, increaseth with the increase of God.
20 Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances,
21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not;
22 Which all are to perish with the using;) after the commandments and doctrines of men?
23 Which things have indeed a shew of wisdom in will worship, and humility, and neglecting of the body; not in any honour to the satisfying of the flesh.
God is not calling us to a bondage of religious actively but he is calling us to holiness of heart and lifestyle that reflects our glorious Savior.

Blessings to all!

 2012/2/6 22:53Profile
myfirstLove
Member



Joined: 2005/11/26
Posts: 496


 Re:

Hi Rbanks,

You said: "The material head covering was the custom of the Jewish religion and for a married woman to pray or prophesy in their new freedom without this visible head covering it would appear to others that the women was dishonoring her husband. The woman’s head in the passage of scripture in 1 cor 11 is clearly her husband who she would appear to be dishonoring because of the custom. This is why Paul appeals to nature teaching us how it would be a shame for a man to have long hair or a woman to have short hair. "

I don't want to derail your thread, but since you brought this up, can you explain this using the passage out of 1 Cor 11? Maybe go verse by verse?

As far as I can see, there is nothing in those passage where Paul is telling them to not wear a covering. On the contrary he builds his case as to why they are to do so. He ties his argument to Christ submission to God, to the Angles, to the glory of Man, to the common sense teaching of nature, and then says it is the custom of the churches. The scriptures as well as church history verify this.

What I don't get, is why people think that to obey something that God has said, is legalism. The yoke of bondage is not doing something outward, the yoke of bondage is the necessity to keep the entire Levitical law. God tells women to dress modestly (which of course goes for men as well). Now, because we as Christians have to modify our dress, to be modest, are we somehow placed under a yoke of bondage because we must do something "outward"? I don't think so.


_________________
Lisa

 2012/2/6 23:11Profile
rbanks
Member



Joined: 2008/6/19
Posts: 1257


 Re:

Sean,

Brother, you have missed the whole context of everything I have been trying to convey on this thread.

I am sorry that I wasn't able to communicate it better for you so maybe later on when I have more time, Lord willing, I will try from another angle.

Blessings to you!

 2012/2/6 23:27Profile









 Re: The trappings of Legalism

Here we go again. The most popular word on this site is LEGALISM. Everyone that dares to obey the instructions of our Savior and our hevenly father who is Yahweh is either a legalist or belongs to some spooky movement. Heck, the word is not even in the bible.

Quote:
I believe people have fallen into legalism concerning a certain Sabbath Day instead of understanding the spiritual significance of the Sabbath being our spiritual rest in Jesus Christ.



Really brother? you intend to teach us what the significance of the Sabbath is? Really? Is that what our Savior said? Is that what our Heavenly father meant when he blessed the seventh day and asked us to keep it holy? is that it? we can all pick anyday that we're comfortable with and keep it holy? we can all keep memorials to the dead, eat swines flesh and sanctify ourselves right?

Surely that has to be the plan of life; let's do it our way, Iniquity is more desirable, nobody can keep those old laws anyway. Let's go ahead and sin. "For sin is the transgression of the law" (1 John 3:4)

I guess I don't understand what the means either. Oh I forgot, we're under a "New Covenant" the Royal Law of Liberty, the one that says we a free to sin because we're saved by grace. Yes! that's love.

 2012/2/7 1:06
ginnyrose
Member



Joined: 2004/7/7
Posts: 7474
Mississippi

 Re: The trappings of Legalism

QUOTE:
"the spirit of foot-washing is the same but back in the bible days (and maybe in some parts of the world they still do) they washed their feet when they entered a home after they walked from place to place. I believe Jesus was using foot washing as an example not necessarily as an ordinance to practice every time we do communion."

You believe? on what basis? Can you share a book, chapter and verse to substantiate it?

On the other hand Jesus says in John 13:15-17:
15For I have given you an example, that ye should do as I have done to you.
Joh 13:16 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord; neither he that is sent greater than he that sent him.
Joh 13:17 If ye know these things, happy are ye if ye do them.

AND:
Mat 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

Just because you refuse to enjoy the blessings of being a servant gives one no authority to rebuke those that do. Jesus' words are the final authority regardless how much you wish to modify them.


_________________
Sandra Miller

 2012/2/7 6:07Profile





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