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bible4life
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Joined: 2009/1/21
Posts: 1559
Locport, Illinois

 Early church fathers writings

My friend and i want to do a study into some of the early church fathers writings from the first couple centuries after Christ. If you know some of their names like Irenaeus, Ignatius,Clement, Polycarp,Origen, Clement, Papias, etc. I really would like to know where they stood on certain doctrines and just what they believed and said knowing that they came right after the apostles and some of them knew them personally. From my understanding many of them believed you could lose your salvation and I heard also that one of them thought the Shepherd of Hermas was possibly inspired text at one time. Does anyone know of these writings or actually read any of these before? What is your opinion on them? Should i be very careful about reading this material?


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John Beechy

 2012/1/30 20:24Profile
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 Re: Early church fathers writings

Dear Brother,

This is a great subject worthy of study. We have put up on the main page of the Text Sermons an Early Church Dictionary with over 120 topics done:

https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/articles/index.php?view=category&cid=849


Also David Bercot's Early Church Dictionary is a good resource to have to read on various topics what were some of the early church fathers believing in those times. Not all that the early church fathers held to were in perfect balance. But many of them had a great balance on the Fear of the Lord and Grace.


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SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2012/1/30 20:29Profile
bible4life
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Locport, Illinois

 Re:

great i will take a look, thank you.


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John Beechy

 2012/1/30 21:12Profile
twayneb
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Joined: 2009/4/5
Posts: 2003
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 Re: Early church fathers writings

bible4life: If you use e-sword you can download the works of the antenicene fathers. They are searchable there by word, etc., just like the Bible on esword.


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Travis

 2012/1/31 7:32Profile
pilgrim777
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Joined: 2011/9/30
Posts: 1211


 Re:

I have always wondered how they got the title "Early Church Fathers"?

That title has seemed to give them influence over the original scriptures.

I have always only thought of the NT Writers as the "Early Church Fathers", if that term must be used.

Why can't they be called Early Church Christians or Elders?

"Fathers" is so RCC and gives them too much power to negate what the Scriptures say. Some people refer to their writings as if they were Holy Ghost breathed.

Just my observations through the years.

Pilgrim

 2012/1/31 9:02Profile
rnieman
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Joined: 2008/10/24
Posts: 146


 Re: Early church fathers writings

Hello bible4life, the following is should help.

http://www.ccel.org/fathers.html


"From my understanding many of them believed you could lose your salvation"

All Pre-Nicene fathers believed this as did most of the Post-Nicene leading up to the reformation where eternal security gained traction.

Russ

 2012/1/31 9:48Profile
ArtB
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Joined: 2004/4/27
Posts: 431
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 Re:

Russ writes: "From my understanding many of them believed you could lose your salvation"

All Pre-Nicene fathers believed this as did most of the Post-Nicene leading up to the reformation where eternal security gained traction.

This simply is not true. Many believed in Predestination. Included among them is Jesus, Paul, Peter. Predestination means God foreknew who would be saved.

Additional info is given in the post above on the Early Church Fathers under 'Free-will and predestination' in the URL in post 2 by the moderator.

Augustine also believed in Predestination.

In 428 a youth from Hippo named Hilary and the theologian Prosper wrote to Augustine from Gaul that people in Marseilles were disturbed by his "new theory" which they believed made preaching useless. How could the number of the elect be fixed? Does it not depend on human free will? If God already has determined salvation and damnation, would that not undermine all human effort? Augustine replied to them in The Predestination of the Saints and The Gift of Perseverance, holding to the idea that people do not believe in order to be elected but that they are elected to believe, usually quoting Paul for support. He argued that Paul believed as he does and yet continued to preach.

Jesus on Predestination:

Jn 10:22-30

At that time the Feast of the Dedication took place at Jerusalem; it was winter, and Jesus was walking in the temple in the portico of Solomon. The Jews then gathered around Him, and were saying to Him, "How long will You keep us in suspense? If You are the Christ, tell us plainly." 25 Jesus answered them, " I told you, and you do not believe; the works that I do in My Father's name, these testify of Me. But you do not believe because you are not of My sheep. My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me; and I give eternal life to them, and they will never perish; and no one will snatch them out of My hand. My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand. I and the Father are one." NASU

This is why we preach the gospel of Jesus Christ, so that His Sheep hear His voice, and His sheep recognize His voice, and they follow Him.


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Arthur Biele

 2012/1/31 13:42Profile
pilgrim777
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Joined: 2011/9/30
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 Re:

If God did not know who would be saved then He would not be God.

But, because God is God, He chooses to be self-limiting and allow us to exercise free-choice that He has given us. But, yes, He knows who will exercise their free-choice and choose Him.

Pilgrim

 2012/1/31 14:04Profile









 Re:

And so we Jesus and the New Testament behind and depart to the writings of men.

Blaine Scogin

 2012/1/31 14:28
pilgrim777
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Joined: 2011/9/30
Posts: 1211


 Re:

Hey Blaine,

Quote:
And so we leave Jesus and the New Testament behind and depart to the writings of men.



That's exactly what I'm saying. And nowhere do I see the Apostles referring to each other as "Church Fathers".

The very term "father", denotes a relationship either through adoption, genetically or spiritually.

Pilgrim



 2012/1/31 14:53Profile





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