| Andres Bisonni|
Hey guys so I came across I string of videos on youtube that my friends were sharing with me of Holy Spirit revival
It looked questionable to me, but after watching them I am having second thoughts that I was to wuick to judge. SOme of it looks like what Benny Hinn does but what is being preached sounds soli
I want to ask for help in discerning this please!
| 2012/1/12 23:00||Profile|
| Re: Andres Bisonni|
What I know about Andres and his ministry:
Andres is a humble Brother who loves Jesus Christ more than anything. His main message is about the blood of Jesus, repentance, holiness, baptism in the Holy Spirit and healing by the stripes of Jesus.
People cry because of their sins and because of love of God thats poured into their lives. Ive got many encounters with God in these conferences and felt like Charles Finney: I felt I die if that wonderful love keeps filling me. I found out how blessed it is to deeply repent and live holy life, and my prayer life has got deeper after these conferences with our dear brother Andres Bisonni. The Spirit that works there, is clearly and without a doubt, the Holy Spirit.
Of course some charismatic things can seem weird, but from the fruit we know the three. Good fruit is that people become christians, so-called christians repent deeply, people fall in love with Jesus and people are empowered to preach gospel and truly win souls for Jesus. People also testify about countless healings. I dont know why people fall down, but I also dont know why they weep while they repent. For myselfs, I fell because I couldnt stand the very presence of the Holy one, who loves me so much. I felt like dying and going to heaven, because God is so holy and loving. I just cant stand when God shows His holiness and love, I either fall on my knees or on to my face like dead. And I weep because.. Same reason. First it was because I felt how great sinner I am, then because I was so full of joy for being saved, then because I met God.
May God bless you as you seek His face with all of your heart, dear one.
| 2012/5/16 18:57||Profile|
"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11
| Re: |
I do not know this brother or his ministry but in light of any ministry that involves and promotes signs and wonders I feel we need to be very careful in light of scripture and the end times. I am going to post here 2 articles by Zac Poonen that I hope everyone reads:
Jesus and the apostles repeatedly warned that the last days would be characterized by widespread deception and a multitude of false prophets (Matt.24:3-5,11,24; 1 Tim.4:1) - and we have seen plenty of them in the last few decades.
Why are millions of Christians deceived by these false prophets and these counterfeit "revivals"? And why are so many preachers falling prey to immorality and greed?
Here are what I see to be some of the main causes:
1. Most Christians today are not aware of what the New Testament teaches, because they have not studied it carefully; and so they follow the teachings of their leaders and not the teachings of the New Testament.
2. Miracles (supernatural gifts) have become more important to them than their character (a supernatural life).
3. Material wealth has become more important to them than spiritual wealth.
4. They are unable to distinguish between soulish frenzy or psychological manipulation, and the genuine moving of the Holy Spirit; the cause again is ignorance of the New Testament.
5. They are unable to distinguish between psychosomatic healing (healing that comes by right attitudes of the mind), and supernatural healing in Jesus' Name.
6. Emotional excitement and strange physical manifestations have become more important to them than the inward joy of the Lord.
7. For the leaders, their ministry to people has become more important than their inner walk with God.
8. The approval of men has become more important to these leaders than the approval of God.
9. The number of people attending the meetings has become more important to these leaders than whether those people are totally committed to Christ.
10. Building their personal kingdoms and their financial empires has become more important to these leaders than building a local church and making themselves servants in that local church (Jeremiah 6:13).
All this is the VERY OPPOSITE of what Jesus taught. The opposite of Christ is called the "anti-Christ" in the New Testament. If Christians do not see this clearly, then when the Antichrist turns up on the world's stage, with his false signs and wonders (2 Thess.2:3-10), they too will blindly accept him. To be led by the Spirit of Christ is to have the very opposite spirit to that mentioned in the points above.
Here is a paraphrase of Jesus' words in Matthew 7:13-27 (read in the context of Matthew Chapters 5 to 7):
"Both the gate and the way to ETERNAL LIFE are very narrow - as I have just described (Matt. 5 to 7). But false prophets will come along and tell you that the gate and way are not narrow but easy and broad. Beware of them. You will be able to identify them easily by observing the fruit of their character: Do they live a life free from anger, free from lusting after women, free from the love of money and free from anxiously seeking after material wealth (as worldly people seek)? Do they preach against these things as I have done here? (Matt.5:21-32 and 6:24-34). These false prophets may exercise many supernatural gifts and do miracles and actually heal people in My Name, but I will still send them all to hell in the final day, because they did not know Me (as THE HOLY ONE) and they did not give up sin in their private lives (Matt.7:21-23). So if you want to build a church on a rock that will never shake or fall in time or eternity, be careful to do all that I have just spoken to you (Matt. 5 to 7) and teach your people to do all that I have commanded you too. Then I will be with you always and My authority will always back you (Matt.28:20, 18). But if you only hear what I say and don't do it, then what you build may look like a large and impressive church to men, but it will surely crumble and fall one day (Matt.7:25)."
How then shall we build an unshakeable church in these last days?
1. We must live the sermon on the mount (Matthew 5 to 7) and preach it constantly.
2. We must live in the new-covenant and not in the old-covenant. For this, we must know the difference between the two covenants clearly (2 Cor.3:6). We must also preach the new covenant.
When preachers fall into serious sin today, they justify themselves by (and find their comfort in) the examples of Old Testament saints who also fell into sin. And then they re-commence their ministry after a period of silence. They quote the examples of David who committed adultery, and Elijah who got depressed, and they say "But God still used them"! But they won't quote the example of Paul who lived in victory and purity until the end of his life.
What these preachers (and most Christians) have not seen is that the Old Testament saints are NOT our examples today. We have been given much more in this age of grace - and "to whom more is given, more is required" (Luke 12:48). Jesus is the Mediator of a NEW covenant and HE is our Example and the Author of our faith today - not David or Elijah. The distinction between the Old Testament saints (listed in Hebrews 11) and Jesus, is made very clear in Hebrews 12:1-4. But very few live in the reality of this. Very few have seen that "God has provided something BETTER for us" in the new covenant (Heb.11:40).
Any of us can fall in the way that many preachers have fallen, if we are not watchful and alert - for Satan is a cunning enemy. Our safety lies in obeying New Testament teaching exactly and in submitting to godly leadership. (And by "godly" leadership, I mean those who do not have even one of the wrong values listed in the ten points I mentioned earlier). If we learn from the mistakes of others, we can avoid making the same mistakes ourselves.
So let us keep our faces in the dust before the Lord at all times - for it is there that we will receive Divine revelation, as John did (Rev.1:17). If we humble ourselves, we will receive grace to be overcomers (1 Pet.5:5). And when the Holy Spirit shows us the truth in God's Word and the truth about ourselves, let us be totally honest and "love the truth, so as to be saved" from all sin. That way we will be protected by God Himself from all deception (2 Thess. 2:10,11). Amen.
The True Gospel And The False
Christians are generally speaking, categorized into two groups as follows:
(1) "Roman Catholics" and "Protestants" - depending on birth.
(2) "Episcopal" (conformist) and "Free church" (non-conformist) - depending on church-pattern.
(3) "Born again Christians" and "Nominal Christians" - depending on an "experience";
(4) "Evangelicals" and "Liberals" - depending on doctrine.
(5) "Charismatics" and "Non-charismatics" - depending on "speaking in tongues".
(6) "Full-time Christian workers" and "Secular workers" - depending on profession.
There could be other such categorizations too. But none of these categorizations deal with the root of the problem that our Lord came to solve.
Many know that "Christ died for our sins" (1 Cor.15:3). But many do not know that the Bible says that Christ also died "that we should no longer live for ourselves but for Him" (2 Cor.5:15). A more Scriptural way of categorizing Christians therefore would be as follows: "Those who live for themselves" and "Those who live for Christ"; or "Those who seek their own" and "Those who seek the things of Christ" or "Those who seek earthly things first" and "Those who seek the kingdom of God first"; or "Those who love money" and "Those who love God". (Jesus said it was impossible to love both -Lk.16:13). But I have never heard of such a categorization being used. This categorization deals with the Christian's inner life and private walk with God, whereas the methods mentioned earlier deal with the external details of his life. Yet it is in this latter way that heaven categorizes Christians. And if that be the case, then this is the only categorization that matters! In this method, others cannot categorize us. We have to categorize ourselves - for no one but we ourselves know our inner motivations and desires. Even our wives may not be aware what we are living for. Our Lord did not come primarily to give people a doctrine, or a church-pattern or to make them speak in tongues or even to give them an experience!
He came to "save us from sin". He came to lay the axe to the root of the tree. And the root of sin is : Being centered in ourselves, seeking our own and doing our own will. If we do not permit the Lord to axe and uproot this "root" from our lives, we will be Christians only superficially. Satan may however deceive us into imagining that we belong to a higher class than other Christians, because of our doctrine or our experience or our church-pattern! Satan doesn't care even if we have the right doctrine, experience and church-pattern, so long as we continue to "live for ourselves" (This, by the way, is just another phrase for "living in sin"!!). Christendom today is filled with Christians who seek their own and live for themselves, who are yet convinced that God views them as superior to other Christians, merely because of doctrinal differences or church-pattern or "experiences". This shows what a great work Satan has succeeded in doing in Christendom.
In John 6:38, our Lord said that He came from heaven to earth: (1) To deny His human will (that He had acquired, when He came to earth as a Man), and (2) To do the will of His Father, as a Man. Thereby He became our example. Throughout Jesus' earthly life -- during all His 33½; years - He denied his own will and did His Father's will. And He told His disciples clearly that those who wanted to be His disciples would have to go the same way. He came to hit at the root of sin in our lives - "doing our own will" - and to deliver us from that.
In the realm of science, for thousands of years, man made the mistake of imagining that the earth was the center of the universe. It looked like that to human eyes - because the sun, moon and stars did indeed appear to be revolving around the earth once every 24 hours. It took the courage of a man like Copernicus to question this popular notion, just about 500 years ago, and to show that it was utterly false and that the earth was not even the center of the solar system, leave alone the universe. The earth, he showed was created to be centered in the sun. As long as man had the wrong center, his scientific calculations and deductions were wrong - because his center was wrong. But once man discovered the right center, then these calculations and deductions turned out right.
It is the same with us when we remain "self-centered" instead of being "God-centered". Our understanding of the Bible and of God's perfect will (our calculations and deductions) will then be wrong. But just as men were convinced for over 5000 years that they were right (as we saw above), we too may imagine that we are right! But actually, we will be 100% wrong. This is what we see even among many "good Christians" today. They have so many different interpretations of the same Bible - and yet each one is convinced that his interpretation alone is right and everyone else's is wrong. The others, they will say are "deceived". Why is this so? Because they've got their center wrong. Man was created to be centered in God and not in himself. And when Christians have got their center wrong, their "gospel" will be wrong too. Basically, there are only two gospels being preached today - one man-centered and the other God-centered.
The man-centered gospel promises man that God will give him everything he needs to make his life on earth comfortable and will also give him a seat in heaven at the end of his life. Man is told that Jesus will forgive all his sins, heal all his diseases, bless and prosper him materially, solve all his earthly problems, etc., etc. Self still remains at the center of such a man's life, and God revolves around him - as his servant - to answer his every prayer and to give him whatever he wants!! All that he has to do is "believe" and "claim every material blessing in Jesus' Name"!! This is a false gospel, because no mention is made of "repentance". Repentance is what John the Baptist, Jesus, Paul, Peter and all the apostles preached first of all. And repentance, unfortunately, is what is not preached today, even last of all!!
The God-centered gospel, on the other hand, calls upon man to repent. It explains that "repentance" means: Turning FROM Self as the center of one's life, from doing one's own will, from walking along one's self-chosen way, from loving money, and from loving the world and the things in the world (the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes and the pride of life), etc., and Turning TO God, loving Him with one's whole heart, making Him the Centre of one's life and doing His will henceforth etc., Faith in Christ's death on the cross can forgive a man his sins only when he has repented. Then he can receive the power of the Holy Spirit empower him to deny himself daily so that he can live a God-centered life. This is the gospel that Jesus and the apostles preached.
The false gospel makes the gate wide and the way broad (easy to walk along, because one does not have to deny one's Self or stop living for one's own interests or stop seeking one's own gain). Millions attend meetings where such a false "gospel" is preached. And many enter through this gate and walk along this way, imagining that it leads to life. But it actually leads to destruction. The evangelists of this gospel however gloat in, and report about the large numbers of people who "raised their hands and made decisions for Christ" in their meetings!! But it is all a deception. Although some are indeed genuinely converted in such meetings, because of their sincerity, many such "converts" end up becoming "twofold children of hell" (Matt.23:15) - deceived about their true state.
The true gospel however, makes the gate small and the way narrow - not smaller or narrower than Jesus Himself made it, as some "super-spiritual" cultists do, but just the same size as Jesus made it. Few there be, that find this way to life. There is not much for the evangelists of this gospel to report about, and the statistics are not impressive. But this gospel leads people to the Lord Jesus and to heaven. "Be careful how you listen. Whoever obeys what he has heard, to him more light and understanding will be given. But whoever does not obey what he has heard, even what light and understanding he thinks he has will be taken away from him." (Paraphrase of Luke 8:18).
He who has ears to hear, let him hear.
SI Moderator - Greg Gordon
| 2012/5/16 20:06||Profile|
| Re: |
I understand the concern of counterfeit revivals, and the big problem in todays christianity that the signs and wonders have taken greater place in many ministries and lives than Jesus has, or fruit of the Spirit in character of christians, and I dont want to promote Andres or his ministry, but I want to tell something so someone would be blessed by taking closer look to his ministry and maybe listening some sermon.
Yesterday I listened a sermon from Andres, which is about the fruit of the Spirit. He says there that some christians focus on signs and wonders and forget character, so theres much people after signs and wonders but the other side of God's glory in christian life isnt appearing, the Christ-like character and life with full of good fruit, and Jesus tells about those who dont make good fruit, that He doesnt know them.
Also Andres said, that the other side is that, that people in muslim world wont believe your preaching if you say "the Bible says.." because they dont believe what it says, so for example for that signs and wonders are necessary as confirmation of the word that is preached. He said that some christians are focusing only on signs and wonders, and others only on character, while we should go for both.
His basic message is: repent, for the kingdom of God is at hand. God loved you so much that He sent His Son to be punished for your sins and my sins, and then Father resurrected Jesus so you and I can have new life, and He ascended to heaven to pour out Holy Spirit upon you and I. He is coming back for us, and it will be joyful day for us who believe, but very scary day for those who dont. So repent, believing in Jesus, and the blood of Jesus will cleanse you and you will receive new life.
To christians and so called christians he preaches the need of deep repentance and surrendering our bodies to God as living sacrifices, holy and acceptable, to have revival. He also tells that we must seek the face of God and we can personally know Him deeply, heart to heart.
He teaches how God will abundantly take care of our needs, if we first seek His kingdom and His righteousness.
In healing services, he clearly tells how it is Jesus who heals, and what kind of heart our God has for His children, how full of love and compassion He is and how powerful He is to heal. He preaches the gospel in every service. I've witnessed in some of those healing services 60-200 people coming to front testifying of healings, like short-sightedness healed, blind eyes opened, deaf ears opened, cancers and tumors disappeared..people weeping for joy. And those people were healed, not under hands of Andres, but while worshipping the Lord after sermon. I've also experienced small healings there, for example my shoulders had a problem that I couldnt rise my arms up to heaven, but then I could after 10 years. My back had terrible pains for 10 years also, and I couldnt stand more than 5min without the pain coming in so terrible way that I couldnt stand, and it hurted many days after standing even that 5min without moving, but also that was healed 4 years ago in conference where Andres preached. Glory to God! Im still so grateful to God for His goodness that He first saved me and sanctified me, then baptized me in the Holy Spirit while I was in my prayer closet and I began to speak different languages of the world and also unknown tongues.. And then He healed me of many things and used me to ignite other believers for Him and also win souls for our dear Lord, Jesus Christ! Glory to God, for He is good! :)
| 2012/5/17 6:58||Profile|
East TN (for now)
| Re: Andres Bisonni|
.... but in light of any ministry that involves and promotes signs and wonders I feel we need to be very careful ....
Im not trying to pick apart anything youve written but in love I want to address this sentence. It seems as a blanket statement this sentence can be very misleading to others and promote fear. I say that only because we have another thread by soulrider who is afraid of anything of the word coming out of a Christians mouth because it will involve and promote the word of faith movement. And someone gave him that fear; do you see what I am trying to get at?
Are ministries not allowed to say, We believe that God answers prayer through many outlets as in laying hands on the sick, as in calling for the elders, as in prophesy. As well as a ministry stating that, We believe all the gifts are for today and we speak in other tongues. etc. Im just asking but would that be promoting signs and wonders or being involved in it?
Can we be clear and possibly state what signs and wonders is? Because what may be involving and promoting to one person may not be involving and promoting to me or anyone else who has come from that type of ministry background. I am not trying to argue, my friend but I am concerned with statements like this because this is a global ministry and there are all different maturity levels and faith levels of the Christians that visit and read these forums.
If I am wrong, please forgive me because I am not trying to be argumentative brother; and if I didnt clearly make my point, I am sorry.
God bless you,
| 2012/5/17 9:02||Profile|
| Re: |
Thanks Lisa for your words!
I wonder sometimes if the words of "that that I feared the most came upon me" is happening to more people because they fear being deceived so much that they are actually be deceived into not being true doers of the word.
Blessings to all...from brother rbanks
| 2012/5/17 9:23||Profile|
| Re: |
Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheeps clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. You will know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thornbushes or figs from thistles? (Matthew 7:15,16)
It is a mistake to judge a man's ministry by the signs and wonders that are taking place or even supernatural manifestations. you have one camp that believes that any kind of sign and wonder that takes place in a man's ministry is of God. But there is also another camp that sees all signs, wonders, and supernatural manifestations as being of the devil. A major reason for this is because many have embraced the false teaching that God is not involved in healings, signs and wonders anymore. They believe that the gifts of the Spirit were for the early church and not for today.
So the presence of signs, wonders and supernatural manifestations in a man's ministry is no indication that he is operating from the Spirit of God, but it is also no indication that he is moving in counterfeit gifts.
Jesus said that "you will know them by their fruits". We are to be fruit inspectors. If you observe the ministry of those that are moving in signs and wonders it will become very evident after awhile as to what spirit they are moving in. Who is being lifted up through their ministry? What is the result that their ministry is having on others? Are they moving in a gentle, loving, meek spirit or one that is prideful and haughty that exalts self?
These are some of the questions that we should be asking when checking out some one's ministry.
Yes, we should test, prove, and try all things, holding on to what is good and turning away from what is evil.
There are some ministries that we are going to find varying degrees of mixture, and this doesn't necissarily mean that the man is not of God, but it could be a matter of his maturity which the Lord will certainly deal with.
| 2012/5/17 9:35||Profile|
| Re: |
Thanks Mike, I enjoyed your post!
Got to run for now.
| 2012/5/17 10:09||Profile|
| Re: Andres Bisonni|
Personally I know nothing about Andres Bisonni. As a private individual who lives in rural Missippi, it matters nothing to me. Andres has to answer to God and not to me.
However, there are a lot of preachers out there who preach, some true and others are false teachers. How does one discern?
When a preacher promotes himself, his ministry, advertises that signs and wonders characterizes his ministry I would run in the opposite direction.
Many pseudo preachers include truth in their teaching program and it is possible people will come to the LORD through their ministry. But this does not mean they are walking in the will of the Father.
As for me, I no longer pay any attention to the most up-and-rising preachers working to get your attention. Too many of them work for money. It is a business. They are making merchandise of the Gospel of the LORD Jesus. Disgusting. Don't give them the time of day...
Let Jesus words teach you in matters of discernment:
Mat 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
I have often thought that these teachers, workers of wonderful works must be the most tragic people come judgement day. Can you imagine? On the other hand, they will not be as innocent as we think - the Holy Spirit does work to convict but if they spurn his conviction, it is their own fault and no one else'. Lets not encourage them in their apostate walk.
I still know next to nothing about this Andres fellow. What I wrote are mere guidelines to assist one in discernment.
| 2012/5/17 10:27||Profile|
| Re: |
Our problem is we are operating in a reformation, rationalustic, western mindset. We have relegated the doctrine of Christ to presuppositions or rationalized arguments. Be it the fve canons of Dort, the Four Spiritual Laws, or the presuppositions of Cornelius Van Till: we have locked the gospel in a polemic declaration of truth. It is to be embraced with the mind and no heart chat.is involved. I might add that there is no supernatural element of the gospel.
Our western minds cannot grasp the fact that Jesus is appearing to the moslems in dreams and visions. Our western minds cannot grasp the fact that God is healing and delivering people in third world countries. Our western minds cannot grasp the fact that God is raising the dead. We hear the reports of these things and instantly we want to cry Mathews 7 and false prophets. We want to say this can't be true. This must be of the devil.
I posted on another thread about the miracle in Iran. The fact that in a little over 30 years the gospel exploded from 500 believers to 100.000 believers. Maybe upwards to 1 million believers. Yet our rationalistic minds say not true!!!! No move of God can do that! Must be the devil! Must be easy believism!!!!
If I were to post that evangelist quietly go on the streets of Tehran following the still small voice of the Spirit. These evangelist will ask a person, Do you know anyone who has seen the man in white. Tbses evangelist will be led to a person who has seen Jesus in a dream or vision. All the evangelist will do is tell them of Jesus and give them a Farsi New Testament. Yet our rationalistic minds say not true! Must be of the devil! False prophets!
Jim Rutz and Jerry Trousdale have written and documented marvelous moves of God in the Middle East. Whole mosque are turning to Christ. These men are not prophetic preachers. But authors sharing the move of God in what is called the 10/40 window. But I can hear it now. Not true! Must be of the devil!
The third world people do not have this rationalistic kinder. Their minds are open to a supernatural element of life. Granted it is demonic. But when confronted by a gospel of power. They readily believe Jesus and his miracles. They see power, signs and wonders. Meanwhile we in America still cry out with our rationalistic minds, not true! Must be of the devil! False prophets! Then you wonder why we in America see no revival or power?
| 2012/5/17 11:00|