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 Re:

Oracio and Julius.

There was a reason I asked if you all were cessationists. I did not get a clear answer on that. But I would like to draw some parallels.

You meet a former Muslim who has come to Christ through a vision of the Lord Jesus Christ. This brother is convinced that he has had a credible experience, an encounter with the living God. This encounter has had an impact on his life. However you hold to a theology of cessationism. You are convinced that this man is the victim of a hoax. You try hard to convince him that his experience was a delusion. You keep telling him that he is the victim of a hoax. Yet this man knows that event he experienced is true.It happened in time and space. Nothing can convince him otherwise. The burden of proof rest on you to prove this man's experience to be false. Yet you have no credible evidence to prove his experience to be false.

This is the same with Sandy Hook. The event actually happened in time and space. The event impacted the lives of people. The testimony of people confirm this event happen. People's lives were impacted. But they were impacted in the most grievous horrible way. Two people in this forum have testified that they knew people who were impacted by this tragic event. I believe it is very shameful to the victims of this tragedy to suggest that the grief that they experience was a result of a governmental hoax. This I think this is taken conspiracy theory to the lowest denominator.

If anybody in this forum had lost a child at Sandy Hook or any other tragic event. Imagine how they would feel to hear someone say their child was actually the victim of a hoax.

I challenge anybody in this forum to call Sandy Hook. For that matter call their parents. And if you have the guts tell them that really what occurred. That what they went through was some hoax orchestrated by the government. And then come back to this forum and report the results.

If anybody has any decency in this forum. This discussion should be put the rest out of respect for those that have lost loved ones. But then maybe decency of something this forum does not have.

I have tried to be conciliatory in my responses. But I believe that this conspiracy theory has been taken to an extreme. And it is disrespecting those who have lost loved ones.

Is that this discussion be put the rest. About the memory of those who have lost loved ones not be tarnished are disrespected by the lies of a hoax.

I am also writing Greg and ask him that he lock this thread down.

Blaine Scogin






 2015/12/7 20:59
Oracio
Member



Joined: 2007/6/26
Posts: 2094
Whittier CA USA

 Re:

Chris, I'm on my phone out and about but I'll try to briefly answer your question. From what I gathered back when I looked into it it seemed like there were likely no deaths, bottom line. Again, I'm open to changing my mind if I see enough evidence. My concern is with this sentiment of outrage against me, as if I have no valid reasons for being skeptical.


_________________
Oracio

 2015/12/7 21:13Profile









 Re:

Quote:
by bearmaster on 2015/12/7 20:59:18

Oracio and Julius.

There was a reason I asked if you all were cessationists. I did not get a clear answer on that. But I would like to draw some parallels.

You meet a former Muslim who has come to Christ through a vision of the Lord Jesus Christ. This brother is convinced that he has had a credible experience, an encounter with the living God. This encounter has had an impact on his life. However you hold to a theology of cessationism. You are convinced that this man is the victim of a hoax. You try hard to convince him that his experience was a delusion. You keep telling him that he is the victim of a hoax. Yet this man knows that event he experienced is true.It happened in time and space. Nothing can convince him otherwise. The burden of proof rest on you to prove this man's experience to be false. Yet you have no credible evidence to prove his experience to be false.



What do you think my response communicates? I said, "on the contrary."

Surely, you know what that means. "Just the opposite!"

Respectfully, your parallel is not very good. You just came back here so you have not seen where I have spoken about the dreams and visions Muslims are having or being baptized in the Holy Spirit. Don't be so quick to judge, my brother.

 2015/12/7 21:23









 Re:

Sorry Julius. I apologize. You and a Oratio seem to be an agreement on SandyHook and other issues. I assumeed you both were Calvinistic and cessationists. I was quick to judge. Again I apologize.

But I think the analogy holds. I believe Ravenhill said that the person with an experience is not at the mercy of the one who has an argument. There are those who were tragically impacted by Sandy Hook. There are those who lost loved ones particular children in that tragedy. I doubt very seriously if anybody can convince them that Sandy Hook was a hoax.

Blaine

 2015/12/7 21:33









 Re:

I thought there was something in the Sermonindex Guidelines about posting conspiracy theories. If so. Then the direction of this thread has really gone out of line of the guidelines.

Blaine

 2015/12/7 21:35









 Re:

Quote:
by Oracio on 2015/12/7 21:13:09

My concern is with this sentiment of outrage against me, as if I have no valid reasons for being skeptical.



Blane, I never said it was a hoax, I am just wondering why it seems to be wrong to have questions and doubts?

The outrage does seem "over the top." What is the explanation for it?

The world bullies people into not disagreeing with them. Christians should not engage in this same activity. There is something wrong with that.

I am not saying it did or did not happen. I am commenting on the lack of grace lately in wanting to shut people up whenever some disagree. Christians of all people should be forbearing and patient and let others make their case or have their doubts and never, ever attack anyone verbally or physically.

That's all I'm going to say. Close this thread if you wish.

 2015/12/7 21:52
proudpapa
Member



Joined: 2012/5/13
Posts: 2936


 Re: Manhattan Project

Manhattan Project

a weapon that atomic scientists had nicknamed "Gadget." The nuclear age began on July 16, 1945, when it was detonated in the New Mexico desert.Early in 1939, the world's scientific community discovered that German physicists had learned the secrets of splitting a uranium atom. Fears soon spread over the possibility of Nazi scientists utilizing that energy to produce a bomb capable of unspeakable destruction.

Scientists Albert Einstein, who fled Nazi persecution, and Enrico Fermi, who escaped Fascist Italy, were now living in the United States. They agreed that the President must be informed of the dangers of atomic technology in the hands of the Axis powers. Fermi traveled to Washington in March to express his concerns on government officials. But few shared his uneasiness.


Leaving nothing to chance, Los Alamos atomic scientists conducted a pre-test test in May 1945 to check the monitoring instruments. A 100-ton bomb was exploded some 800 yards from the Trinity site where Gadget would be detonated a few weeks later.Einstein penned a letter to President Roosevelt urging the development of an atomic research program later that year. Roosevelt saw neither the necessity nor the utility for such a project, but agreed to proceed slowly. In late 1941, the American effort to design and build an atomic bomb received its code name — the Manhattan Project.

At first the research was based at only a few universities — Columbia University, the University of Chicago and the University of California at Berkeley. A breakthrough occurred in December 1942 when Fermi led a group of physicists to produce the first controlled nuclear chain reaction under the grandstands of Stagg Field at the University of Chicago.


Enrico Fermi, a physicist who left fascist Italy for America, encouraged the U.S. to begin atomic research. The result was the top-secret "Manhattan Project."After this milestone, funds were allocated more freely, and the project advanced at breakneck speed. Nuclear facilities were built at Oak Ridge, Tennessee and Hanford, Washington. The main assembly plant was built at Los Alamos, New Mexico. Robert Oppenheimer was put in charge of putting the pieces together at Los Alamos. After the final bill was tallied, nearly $2 billion had been spent on research and development of the atomic bomb. The Manhattan Project employed over 120,000 Americans.

Secrecy was paramount. Neither the Germans nor the Japanese could learn of the project. Roosevelt and Churchill also agreed that the Stalin would be kept in the dark. Consequently, there was no public awareness or debate. Keeping 120,000 people quiet would be impossible; therefore only a small privileged cadre of inner scientists and officials knew about the atomic bomb's development. In fact, Vice-President Truman had never heard of the Manhattan Project until he became President Truman.

Although the Axis powers remained unaware of the efforts at Los Alamos, American leaders later learned that a Soviet spy named Klaus Fuchs had penetrated the inner circle of scientists.


This crater in the Nevada desert was created a 104 kiloton nuclear bomb buried 635 feet beneath the surface. It is the result of a 1962 test investigating whether nuclear weapons could be used to excavate canals and harbors.By the summer of 1945, Oppenheimer was ready to test the first bomb. On July 16, 1945, at Trinity Site near Alamogordo, New Mexico, scientists of the Manhattan Project readied themselves to watch the detonation of the world's first atomic bomb. The device was affixed to a 100-foot tower and discharged just before dawn. No one was properly prepared for the result.

A blinding flash visible for 200 miles lit up the morning sky. A mushroom cloud reached 40,000 feet, blowing out windows of civilian homes up to 100 miles away. When the cloud returned to earth it created a half-mile wide crater metamorphosing sand into glass. A bogus cover-up story was quickly released, explaining that a huge ammunition dump had just exploded in the desert. Soon word reached President Truman in Potsdam, Germany that the project was successful.

The world had entered the nuclear age.
http://www.ushistory.org/us/51f.asp

 2015/12/7 23:29Profile









 Re: Manhattan Project

Good article but it misses an important link, the connection with the Bohemian Grove and the demonic powers.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=salf-D33zmM (1min. 20)

God and prayer are our only hope against satanic forces.

 2015/12/8 4:19
sermonindex
Moderator



Joined: 2002/12/11
Posts: 39795
Canada

Online!
 Re:

Saints,

I believe it is fair that a request to see this thread locked is honoured. We also ask that saints do not perpetuate or focus on conspiracy theories on this website which in the end are not fruitful nor promote biblical thinking or edification of believers in Jesus Christ in the Church.

This thread is now locked.


_________________
SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2015/12/8 4:27Profile





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