SermonIndex Audio Sermons
Image Map
Discussion Forum : Articles and Sermons : All Israel will be saved - Understanding Romans 9-11

Print Thread (PDF)

Goto page ( Previous Page 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 Next Page )
PosterThread









 Re:

Here is where I am going. When the word Jehovah is used it almost always refers to the Son of God. As I said before, there are a few places where it is ambiguous, but in general the thousands of times it is used it is referring to the second person of the Trinity, the eternal Son of God, the LORD Jesus Christ.

OJ

 2011/5/19 11:55









 Re: All Israel will be saved - Understanding Romans 9-11

Quote:
Here is where I am going. When the word Jehovah is used it almost always refers to the Son of God. As I said before, there are a few places where it is ambiguous, but in general the thousands of times it is used it is referring to the second person of the Trinity, the eternal Son of God, the LORD Jesus Christ.

What makes you single the Son out of the Godhead in this one name?

 2011/5/19 13:41









 Re:

Study it through, who did Abraham see in Gen 17:1? Father, Son, or Holy Spirit? Or likewise, who is "the word of the Lord"? There is so much more! This is what it means when the Bible says Jesus is Lord.

His full title "LORD Jesus Christ" represents the Son of God in His three ministrations:

LORD- the Son of God in the OT
Jesus- the incarnate Son in His earthly ministry
Christ- the resurrected and anointed Son of God

OJ

 2011/5/19 14:34









 Re: All Israel will be saved - Understanding Romans 9-11



Hi Joe,

Thanks for your reply.

Genesis 17:1 And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, YHVH appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the SHADDAY EL; walk before me, and be thou perfect.

2 And I will make my covenant between me and thee, and will multiply thee exceedingly.

3 And Abram fell on his face: and ELOHIYM talked with him, saying,


All the way to the end of the chapter, only ELOHIYM is named.


EDIT: In Deuteronomy 4, there are TWENTY references similar to 'YHVH thy ELOHIYM' - like, 'YHVH your ELOHIYM', 'YHVH my ELOHIYM'.

This is the last one:

40 Thou shalt keep therefore his statutes, and his commandments, which I command thee this day, that it may go well with thee, and with thy children after thee, and that thou mayest prolong thy days upon the earth, which YHVH thy ELOHIYM giveth thee, for ever.

 2011/5/19 15:20









 Re:

Ah yes, but considering John 1:18 and the others mentioned, who did Abraham see?

 2011/5/19 17:56









 Re: All Israel will be saved - Understanding Romans 9-11


Hi Joe,

I guess I don't think it's that simple. There is nothing in the meaning of Jehovah which limits him to 'the Son', because Elohiym is the plural of Eloah.

John 1:18
No man hath seen ELOHIYM at any time, the only begotten Son, which IS IN the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.


I do think that there is more going on in John 1:18 than that John saying no-one has seen ELOHIYM.

The use of the title 'only begotten Son' carries both the uniqueness of Jesus Christ, and, Him being 'the brightness of [Elohiym's] glory, and the express image of Elohiym's person.' (Heb 1:3)

This Son is like His Father - to the extent that the Son can say 'I and my Father are ONE'. Indeed, He left His glory to come as a Man, but without losing any of His nature as being One with Elohiym.


John 1
29 The next day John seeth YAHSHUA coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of ELOHIYM, which taketh away the sin of the world.

34 And I saw, and bare record that this is the Son of ELOHIYM.

49 Nathanael answered and saith unto him, Rabbi, thou art the Son of ELOHIYM; thou art the King of Israel.



Exodus 24:9 Then went up Moses, and Aaron, Nadab, and Abihu, and seventy of the elders of Israel:

10 And THEY SAW the ELOHIYM of Israel: and there was under his feet as it were a paved work of a sapphire stone, and as it were the body of heaven in his clearness.

11 And upon the nobles of the children of Israel he laid not his hand: also they saw ELOHIYM, and did eat and drink.


Now here (at Sinai) Elohiym was almost invisible (clearness) but they SAW that 'clearness'.

The point John identifies with his comment is that of Elohiym's better-defined appearance and nature (grace and truth), which was evident upon meeing Jesus Christ in person.

 2011/5/19 19:05
davidc
Member



Joined: 2010/8/15
Posts: 272
France

 Re: All Israel will be saved - Understanding Romans 9-11

A777. Sorry, going back to Kevin Daleys interpretation of Romans 9 - 11. He writes:

"While we rejoice at the hope of an extensive re-grafting of natural stock as we near the end, this cannot come except as the result of a faithful witness to the Jews at the present time"

Is this extensive regrafting, or revival among the Jews in the last days just a personal hope of the writer, or are there scriptures which confirm that just before the end, there will be many Jews added to the church? I certainly can not find any such scriptures.

David


_________________
david

 2011/5/19 19:27Profile









 Re:

Great question! I have asked Kevin directly, so we can see what he had in mind. I will post his answer when I receive it.

A777

 2011/5/19 19:41









 Re:

Quote:
John 1:18
No man hath seen ELOHIYM at any time, the only begotten Son, which IS IN the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.


I do think that there is more going on in John 1:18 than that John saying no-one has seen ELOHIYM.



Elohiym is Hebrew and not to be arbitrarily inserted into a text translated from Greek, the word is the Greek "Theos" which when parsed is masculine SINGULAR not plural as is Elohiym.

Who has never been seen by a mere man? According to John 5:37 and John 6:46 it is God the Father. Who has been seen of man? God the Son. Who then could Abraham have seen? None but the Eternal Son of God.

It is just that simple.


OJ

 2011/5/19 20:01









 Re:

Davidc

Heb 8:7-10 is a good place to start.

OJ

 2011/5/19 20:09





©2002-2020 SermonIndex.net
Promoting Genuine Biblical Revival.
Affiliate Disclosure | Privacy Policy