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modominiko
Member



Joined: 2011/5/16
Posts: 1


 Pastors salary

Can someone please help me out, i want to know where in the Bible that says pastors are to be paid a salary..and if so by how much and any other information that will help me have a greater understanding of this issue..thanks

 2011/5/16 5:41Profile
EverestoSama
Member



Joined: 2010/5/17
Posts: 1175


 Re: Pastors salary

This a loaded question? Why not just come outright with what you'd like to say, friend?

 2011/5/16 8:09Profile









 Re: Pastors salary


Hi modominiko,

There isn't a 'place in the Bible' where it's that simple.

With the children of Israel, God gave them instructions for looking after the welfare of the priestly tribe (Levi) under the Old Covenant. Under the New Covenant, we are all priests.

So, traditions of various kinds have sprung up down the centuries, depending on the form of church governance approved within the denominations. Often a congregation will own a house which is rent-free to their pastor, and give him a 'stipend' (reviewed every year) to supply daily needs like food clothes and family.

In the early church, elders - more than one in each local church grouping - probably had a 'day job' to supply their family's needs.

The apostle Paul - although he could have asked for each new church to support him, preferred to work as a tentmaker while he also evangelised. He also went hungry sometimes - but he was a single man. Other times he had plenty. He took it all as from the Lord.

 2011/5/16 8:34
lylewise
Member



Joined: 2009/2/20
Posts: 494
Celina, Texas

 Re:

My brothers, I want to take no part in condemning one's support over another who may be unsupported. If we see a need and do not respond to it then it is to our negligence. However, i would appeal to the faith that we are supposed to exercise in this life. Each situation not being equal but if there are able men and in faith they will trust God to supply the need, He will deliver to them for that need. If there be Elders cannot God give them the feed for the sheep? If there be only one will He not raise and mature others to do the same. Will He leave a need unanswered if there be faith? Where is growth without faith? God would not have us infants forever. Will He not supply accordingly. I would always weight tradition by the trust it promotes or robs.

I have seen men afraid to rise to meet the need and it is all about trusting God. As for their support I would wager (though I no longer bet) that there are many a man born of God who immerse themselves in prayer and God's word spending more time in commune with Him (UNPAID) then many who are paid and who waste that which could support both widow and orphan.

For each situation God will supply. Maybe through men and maybe through one's dependence on God apart from the support of men. Not to be a contrarian but if the majority in a rebellious generation gravitate one way it may be wise to consider the other. Given the right motives can we ever error trusting God?

A horse that wears blinders must trust his rider.

 2011/5/16 10:01Profile
Oracio
Member



Joined: 2007/6/26
Posts: 2037
Whittier CA USA

 Re: Pastors salary

Greetings modominiko,
Here is a recent thread you may be interested in looking at:

http://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38867&forum=34&17


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Oracio

 2011/5/16 10:08Profile
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3228
Texas

 Re:

Here's a good start:

1 Tim. 5:17 Let the elders that rule well be counted worthy of double honor, especially they who labor in the word and doctrine.

1 Tim. 5:18 For the Scripture says, You shall not muzzle the ox that treads out the grain, and, The laborer is worthy of his reward.


_________________
Mr. Bill

 2011/5/16 10:17Profile
Enochh
Member



Joined: 2007/8/22
Posts: 116
Indianapolis

 Re: Pastors salary

@ Everestosama for such a young fellow why must you be so judgemental all the time. You judged my motives in another thread and now your judging modominkos motives. Chill.
@ Modominiko. I'm a former pastor. I knew when I was caught up in the salary it was wrong. (wrong for me). I knew who I was depending on....and it wasn't God. Scripture as a whole will bear witness to the fact (look at Israel)that the more we depend on any source other than God the more we depend on that source. George Mueller is a fine example of a man who relied on Gods provision alone. Maybe the reason more men don't rely on Gods sole provission is because its not Gods work/building/ministry to support. If its really Gods He'll provide...........


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Jeff

 2011/5/16 10:29Profile
sermonindex
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Joined: 2002/12/11
Posts: 37087
"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11

Online!
 Re:

Quote:
Can someone please help me out, i want to know where in the Bible that says pastors are to be paid a salary..and if so by how much and any other information that will help me have a greater understanding of this issue..thanks


First, welcome to SermonIndex. We ask that when people first register on the website that you post a welcome message here telling us about yourself: http://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewforum.php?forum=13&5828

As for your question it is a good question. The Scriptures are absolutely clear about leadership in the Church and in Israel and how those who are in leadership (pastors, etc) are taken care specially by God. Now alot of people already in this thread are having a hard time with the question not because the bible clearly says you are to be supported as a pastor but because of the "abuse" of this support and pastors taking too much or using it prodigally.

So yes, the bible is very clear in "many" places that support can be taken. For instance read the chapter in 1 Corinthians 9:

3 This is my defense to those who sit in judgment on me. 4 Don’t we have the right to food and drink? 5 Don’t we have the right to take a believing wife along with us, as do the other apostles and the Lord’s brothers and Cephas[a]? 6 Or is it only I and Barnabas who lack the right to not work for a living?

7 Who serves as a soldier at his own expense? Who plants a vineyard and does not eat its grapes? Who tends a flock and does not drink the milk? 8 Do I say this merely on human authority? Doesn’t the Law say the same thing? 9 For it is written in the Law of Moses: “Do not muzzle an ox while it is treading out the grain.”[b] Is it about oxen that God is concerned? 10 Surely he says this for us, doesn’t he? Yes, this was written for us, because whoever plows and threshes should be able to do so in the hope of sharing in the harvest. 11 If we have sown spiritual seed among you, is it too much if we reap a material harvest from you? 12 If others have this right of support from you, shouldn’t we have it all the more?

But we did not use this right. On the contrary, we put up with anything rather than hinder the gospel of Christ


---


But paul wants to with that specific church not be a burden at all so the gospel may be more obviously taught without hindrance. Hence for some in the body of Christ at times it will be better not to obtain a full salary or salary so they can preach the Gospel without hindrance.

But this is not a rule or command it is an example from Paul. At other times he took money from other churches.


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SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2011/5/16 10:46Profile
hoohoou
Member



Joined: 2009/12/11
Posts: 212
Texas

 Re:

Quote:
If its really Gods He'll provide...........



Enochh, this isn't really directed at you personally, or your post. It was a good post. I know where this is going to go and I'm just using that last line to build on my view.

It's true that if a ministry is of God then He will provide. I fully believe that. In another post was mentioned the fact that we are all a royal priesthood. However, if a Christian does work a secular job, this Christian would be an unwise steward of their talents if they simply applied for a job, was awarded said job, and then told the employer they would work for whatever the employer wanted to pay them. While a minister can't work for the money, it does however require money to live. Where that comes from makes no difference, it is a need. There is nothing wrong for salary to be a factor in where a minister might serve (as long as no clear direction from the Lord exists). No thinking person would move into a job without being satisfied and fully aware of what kind of money they would make. Factoring that into a decision and deeming it important does not make it and idol.

For church members to require their pastor to live paycheck to paycheck while these men devote their lives to the gospel and to them is un-Christlike in my opinion. Especially when most of those in the congregation are striving to make the most money they can for their own families, to provide the best for them. (1 Corinthians 9:11-14)

Please don't interpret this to mean I'm advocating ministers to live above those in the congregation or fly around in private jets. I mean only that there is no reason not to show financial appreciation for what it is that these men do. Here we go.


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Matt Smith

 2011/5/16 11:03Profile
EverestoSama
Member



Joined: 2010/5/17
Posts: 1175


 Re:

Quote:
for such a young fellow why must you be so judgemental all the time. You judged my motives in another thread and now your judging modominkos motives. Chill.



Not in the slightest. First time user posts a question, but they're not really looking for an answer, they just have something they want to teach on or they need sort of a roundabout way to get their foot in the door on a subject. Just back browse a few months and see for yourself.

Like Greg said, it's best to introduce yourself first. After you stick around for a bit you'll see this over and over again. I'm not judging their motives, I'm just curious to see what their motives are, lest we all waste time trying to share on something the initial poster had already quite made up his mind about. However IF the user is going to take the route that countless others have done in the EXACT same fashion, it's best to be upfront with it.

That's simply why I asked if it was a loaded question. Saves time. That's all. I'll just grab one from last week for an example. This is one of the less in your face, and loaded ones:

http://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=38831&forum=36&start=20&viewmode=flat&order=1

Threads started in this style pop up about once a week. You'll start seeing the pattern after a while.

I only have to mention the name Ronald Goetz, and many here will instantly remember how this stuff COULD play out.

 2011/5/16 11:09Profile





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