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Lordoitagain
Member



Joined: 2008/5/23
Posts: 600
Monroe, LA - USA

 Re: Past, Present, and Future Forgiveness?

Quote:
All of them. There is no more condemnation.



The possibility of having "no more condemnation" is only for those who continue to walk in the Spirit:

Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
Rom 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
Rom 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
Rom 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
Rom 8:5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
Rom 8:6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
Rom 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
Rom 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
Rom 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.


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Michael Strickland

 2010/12/1 14:08Profile
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3228
Texas

 Re:

Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
______________________________________________

God did give us the gift of eternal life through Jesus Christ, so even though we may not know what our future sins are, it would appear, Jesus has them all covered.It's sort of like insurance, even thought you don't know what your future is, as you drive down the road, Jesus death on the Cross, gives us a peace within, that were covered,Past, Present, and Future.


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Mr. Bill

 2010/12/1 14:09Profile
Areadymind
Member



Joined: 2009/5/15
Posts: 1042
Pacific Ocean

 Re:

I don't think so Mr. Bill A true Christians confession, and his repentance are not mutually exclusive. A Crook's (if said crook is a continuing crook) confession is not regenerate either, so the argument is a bit of a straw one. (In my opinion, please don't take that in a spirit other than I meant it brother.)

Christianity is one phase of repentance leading into the next until the day our bones are buried.

"Having begun in the Spirit are you now made perfect by the flesh?"

The just shall LIVE by faith. (The emphasis from Galatians)

The way Galatians applies this scripture is in an rhetorically exhortational fashion. Indicating that the Galatian church had stopped growing in grace. More gas needed to be put into that churches generator. Get back to your origin of repentance. Live by faith.

Michale's commentary is how the bible talks about this issue, all the scriptures he quoted were the same that leapt to my mind when the question was raised. We have to discuss these kinds of questions only within the framework of how scripture states them. And according to my recollection (which is often really weak I might add) you will be hard pressed to find the section in scripture that addresses the forgiveness of future sin with bullet points. But Michale brought a well placed cornucopia from various passages for good consideration.

When we discuss this outside of scripture, we get into all sorts of confusing corridors and labyrinths.


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Jeremiah Dusenberry

 2010/12/1 14:15Profile
Lordoitagain
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Joined: 2008/5/23
Posts: 600
Monroe, LA - USA

 Re:

Brother MrBillPro,

If you can get to heaven with that theology, THANK GOD … we will all rejoice together when our faulty understanding is fully enlightened by the presence of Truth in heaven …

However, I caution you that if you go with that line of thinking you could get contaminated with “greasy grace” mentality where you conscience gets seared, and you continue in sin with the false assumption that ALL is forgiven regardless of how much you display fruits of unrighteousness.

1Jn 2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
1Jn 2:5 But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.
1Jn 2:6 He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.


If we don’t keep bearing fruit of righteousness, we get cut off of the vine:

Jua 15:1 I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
Jua 15:2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
Jua 15:3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
Jua 15:4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
Jua 15:5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
Jua 15:6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.


Beware of people who would try to deceive you into thinking that you can live a life that bears fruit of sin, and still be saved:


Mat 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
Mat 7:16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
Mat 7:17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
Mat 7:18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
Mat 7:19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
Mat 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.


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Michael Strickland

 2010/12/1 14:27Profile
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3228
Texas

 Re:

Brother MrBillPro,

If you can get to heaven with that theology, THANK GOD … we will all rejoice together when our faulty understanding is fully enlightened by the presence of Truth in heaven …

However, I caution you that if you go with that line of thinking you could get contaminated with “greasy grace” mentality where you conscience gets seared, and you continue in sin with the false assumption that ALL is forgiven regardless of how much you display fruits of unrighteousness.

___________________________________________________

I guess I should have said this from the beginning, sorry. "I do personally confess and repent after any sin" I started this thread, as I thought it might be something we all may have "some" reservations about, and through Jesus Christ, it might take any reservations away, from those who may not act on, or know how to act on sin as God wants us to.


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Mr. Bill

 2010/12/1 14:34Profile
UntoBabes
Member



Joined: 2010/8/24
Posts: 1031
Oregon

 Re:

First, I would like to thank the mind that dared to ask.

I know this is long and you are all caught up in defending your view points but please read it all.

As with any Biblical truth, there are two sides to the coin.

Justification is the act of being reconciled to God , and made children of mercy rather that children of wrath.
But there is a problem, God is holy and can not have a fellowship with any thing that is not.
There is another problem, God is infinite , does not have beginning or days or end of life. He lives outside of time. When a sin is committed, it is played before His holy eyes for eternity no matter how small this sin is. Nothing that man can do can stop the wrath of God from burning in anger against that sinner, not because God enjoys or find delight in being wrathful, but His holy nature and His very being is to be in opposition to anything unholy. He can not help it.

God in His wisdom and mercy had found away in Christ, Himself in human flesh to solve the problem of fellowshipping with man. In Christ, the God-man God the Father can stop sin committed by the redeemed from playing before him for eternity by laying it on the eternal Christ. Only Christ can purchase eternal salvation for man-kind because of his eternal nature.
This is really crucial and what makes Christianity different from other religions. People view God as holding a scale ( the old kind with two sides that you see in courtrooms ) and weighing their good deeds and bad deeds and the side that goes down is the winning side. If someone had done more good deeds than bad, then he is safe. This is a pagan perception of God. Our God is not that way, that is why a small sin like a lie committed by someone is sufficient to send this person to hell for eternity, even if it was the only sin he had ever committed in all his life, even if that person had done good deeds for the rest of his life to pay for that sin. It is not sufficient. Only Christ sacrifice and blood can pay for that sin, for the sins of the whole world if the whole world would believe on Him.

The conclusion of the first side of the coin is: No one will make it to eternal life without their sins past, present, and future laid on Christ.

This is the sweet half that everyone likes to hear, but wait, there is more truth that is hard to swallow, the bitter half.


The other side of the coin:

At the time of Justification, reconciliation with God is achieved, when a sinner believes in Christ sacrifice on the cross and repents of his sin( meaning to feel a great remorse for ever offending God’ s holiness and serving the Devil, His enemy ) Two things must take place. Restitution to man, and restitution to God. While Christ takes care of the latter when we come to Him by faith, we must take care of the former and make restitutions to those who were hurt by our sins, because that also gives glory to God in heaven when we proclaim to others that we are now followers of a holy God who hates sin.

At justification , out PAST SINS are taken care of.

But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his PAST SINS. 2 Pet 1:9

Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of the SINS THAT ARE PAST, through the forbearance of God; Rom 3:25

In that sense, to say to someone that if they believe on Christ, their past, present , and future sins are forgiven is deception and unbiblical language. If that was the case, the Christian life would have been a piece of cake.
The Bible says that all our sins were forgiven. Imagine your life a sheet of paper written all over with sins. At the moment of justification, that sheet of paper was wiped clean. In biblical language, the crimson stained garment was washed as white as snow. But that does not mean that the sheet of paper can not be filled again, or the garment stained a again, that does not mean that the washed sow can not go back to her wallowing places or the dog to his vomit.


Now the big question

How then can the two sides of the coin be reconciled? How is it true that no one can make it to eternal life without all the sins they have ever committed being laid on Christ due to His eternal nature and our inability to please God on our own due to God’s infinitely holy nature. And how is it that we are told by the Scripture that only our past sins are taken care of at justification.

First, it is assumed in the Scriptures that those who are washed will not go back to their old way of life. The Bible is filled with exhortations, warnings, and question marks to indicate the amazement of the author( the Holy Spirit) at how can someone desire again their old conduct of living after they have tasted God’ s goodness and forbearance. It grieves the heart of God to see a backslidden believer.

1ohn 1:2

My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye SIN NOT. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:

The way to reconcile the two sides is repentance, on the part of the sinner, and asking the Father to cover the sin with the blood of Christ, but that is for those who have a mind to SIN NOT. If they sin when they tried hard not to, they may come to God pleading the blood of Christ.

Friends,
There are many people who were justified but will not make it to eternal life because of a faulty understanding of the gospel they were given. We are given everything that we need for life and godliness. The warnings in the Scriptures about the impossibility to renew for a second time those who were once renewed are real. They are there to serve a function to bring the backslidden sinner to a climax of agony and remorse over his sin without which forgiveness will not be granted.

Many well meaning teachers have tried to explain away those passages to fit them with their theology to give sinners hope, but in reality it ended up creating a breed of believers with a harlot’s for-head , un ashamed, and un remorseful for offending God’s holiness.





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Fifi

 2010/12/1 15:13Profile
DirkW
Member



Joined: 2007/11/16
Posts: 88
Netherlands

 Re:

We must be aware we don't fall in a legalistic mindset about this topic. We just can't confess all sin everytime always because we don't know all in mind, acts, heart etc. We would be doing that all day if we knew all. We confess what God reveals. I think this link shows it biblically. If you truly are à christian i think this is à right way to live
http://www.gotquestions.org/confession-forgiveness.html


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Dirk

 2010/12/1 16:18Profile
Lysa
Member



Joined: 2008/10/25
Posts: 3393
East TN (for now)

 DirkW

Quote:
We must be aware we don't fall in a legalistic mindset about this topic. We just can't confess all sin everytime always because we don't know all in mind, acts, heart etc


This is true but "if our heart condemn us, God is greater than our heart, and knoweth all things. Beloved, if our heart condemn us not, then have we confidence toward God." 1 John 3:20-21

God bless,
Lisa


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Lisa

 2010/12/1 16:27Profile
UntoBabes
Member



Joined: 2010/8/24
Posts: 1031
Oregon

 Re: DirkW

For the sins we are not aware of, we may plead with the Psalmist" Search me O Lord and know my hear, try me and know my thoughts, and see if there be any wicked way in me, and lead me in the way everlasting."

For the rest, I think we know them pretty well, unless we have allowed our conscience to be de-sensitized. Very dangerous state to be in and a sign of God's judgment when He is resisted long enough.



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Fifi

 2010/12/1 16:33Profile
jimp
Member



Joined: 2005/6/18
Posts: 1481


 Re: sin

hi, i believe that the bible teaches free grace,cheaper to us who believe than greasy grace...i see that sin and all its penalty was taken care of by the finished work of Jesus on the cross...i see that He cut an everlasting covenant for God and for man on that cross for He is the God man...i see that He sits at the right hand of the father as the covenant cutter and the covenant keeper and the covenant maker and the covenant lawyer,ever making intercession for us.i also see Jesus taking the full wrath of The Father upon Himself on the cross so that there can be no condemnation for those in Christ Jesus.i see Him providing me the Comforter (latin with strength)to live inside me and guide me.i hear Him say that he will in no way cast me out and that He is able to keep me against that day... i see men trying to take some control of this situation so that they a gain responsibility for salvation and if the can they will fail.when one goes to an altar he goes to die...altars are places of sacrifice...places where you reckon yourself dead ... the baptism that flows from this is being buried with Jesus unto His death,burial and ressurection.dead men are dead and the life we live is Christ' life living in us.jimp



 2010/12/1 17:00Profile





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