We can get lost in terminology between justification, sanctification, salvation etc etc. The bottom line is if you (we, us) still sin or have yet to learn the things of God that establishes harmony with God witnessed by the fruit produced, then there is still a learning process going onChristians are told to be holy and sin no more and Jesus did not give impossible commands........ but how many shepherds actually teach their flock that besides forgiving us of our sins Jesus has provided a way for sin to be overcome.God does not change and the only reason the church is not doing the same miracles that Jesus and the Apostles did is because man has changed the church founded on the truth to something that God can no longer work with...... therefore we do not see signs and wonder....... some prayers we see answered because God has mercy on whom He chooses to.Now if everything was done at the moment someone says yes to Christ or gets baptized in the Holy Spirit why is the church today different from the church of the Apostles?Not to long ago I saw at the a sign outside the church at the corner of my street asking the community to pray for a young daughter of the one of the pastors who had unfortunately fallen and sustained a head injury...... In the old days the members called on the elders to heal them but now you have the elders calling upon the members to ask God to do what the elders should have already seen too and accomplished...... Something is seriously wrong with that picture because as the scriptures say God does not change.If there is not a linear progression and what we see is all there ever will be for the church then the Bible is wrong......... and that is something I cannot acceptBlessingsDoug
I'm not sure if this thread is nearly over. I hope not!About the Greek word 'en' which has been translated (legitimately) as 'by' in the NASB, I, personally, find 'in' much more helpful, because of all the 'in Him' references in the New Testament.We have already seen that it's the 'blood of the everlasting (age-during [YLT]) covenant' and that the sacrifice was 'once for all' to put away sin (Hebrews 9:26), and so the translations which convey by the use of 'in', the new state of being continuously 'in the Spirit' by that eternal sacrifice of the 'blood of sprinkling of Jesus Christ', do - for me at least - remove completely the sense of progression which 'by', suggests, as if it's something which the Spirit conveys, without entering us. Whereas the Spirit is 'in' us, and we are 'in' Christ.