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Joined: 2009/12/4
Posts: 1860

 Its just so bitter!

This past Sunday we had a prayer service instead of a regular someone preachs and we all go home type thing. But something very discouraging happened amoung the encouragment that is religion, UGH How bitter of a taste this one thing can leave, while Christ takes that which is unpleasant and turns it into something beautiful religion takes something beautiful and sweet into something that is ugly and bitter. I enjoyed the praying most of all to pray for someone and bring encouragement is one of my favorite things to do but its certainly hard to pray for those that have no need, who aren't "cold, naked, and blind" this might need to be in the Miracles that follow the plow section. How long must I tarry in a religious institution the "church"

I go and sing and clap my hands, sit and watch someone talk for 30 to 45 minutes then get up and leave. I would like to note that I have nothing wrong with the church persay what my major issue is ME in the church. How I act and react in that kind of atmosphere? Everything is just peachy keen and HEAVEN FORBID I struggle and have problems that wrath of the church and their judgment may fall on my if I do. But they won't let you know that, simply smile and give some halfhearted encouragement. Where is the reality of the Church? I weep with Keith Green when I hear the song "Asleep in the Light"

But the most horrible thought that I had was this, I am just like them, though I don't want to be apart of that religious mind set every time I step in a church building there it is. And since I am just like them and do the very things they do I can't judge but have to forgive and be merciful. I am not above the religious stink and bitterness but Lord willing I will be freed from the religious chains and truly serve the Lord for His glory in action and in Truth and Spirit not out of obligation and falsity.

Sorry if this seems ranty I was just very discouraged by some of the attitudes on Sunday and needed to get this off my chest. I ask that people pray for me to give me some direction on how to handle these thoughts and feelings, to handle them in a Godly manner. I would deeply appreciate it.

Matthew Guldner

 2010/9/14 1:46Profile

Joined: 2005/6/18
Posts: 1481

 Re: Its just so bitter!

hi, my advise to you is too never go to church alone... go find a homeless person to take tochurch and to lunch and minister to that person for a few hours...many will come to Christ and it is hard to moan and groan when angels are rejoicing...jimp

 2010/9/14 6:09Profile

Joined: 2009/12/4
Posts: 1860


great suggestion but I live in a small town and our homeless people are pretty scarce, I will be going to the local nursing home soon to minister there through music and just spending time with the people. Something that I thought of at the approval of the person was to record their story onto my computer talk about their life, love, losses, etc. To save that story for the next generation and bring peace to their mind that their story won't be forgotten. Something that I love is music and when my grandpa was dying with cancer I would play my guitar for him and it was so awesome to see his face smile and brighten up. Hopefully these endeavors are what the Lord is leading me to, to break out of the religious spirit with some very much needed reality. Thank you very much for the suggestion, I will look to minister to the Homeless as well when they come through town.

Matthew Guldner

 2010/9/14 6:58Profile


You could always start a home fellowship with a few close brothers and sisters and join together that way. This type of atmosphere lends itself to transparency and honesty as opposed to what you normally see in a "church". But it's just as legitimate in God's eyes, and many times probably more so.

My advice is to make sure you are walking with God daily on your own. Too many well meaning people are out there having a relationship with their church, but not a relationship with Jesus. As a man is when he is alone, so is he. I was in a spot at one point (still am sort of) where church was just a routine I did, the real meat of my faith was alone and away from everyone. It's funny how we can be a part of a "fellowship" (and I use that term loosely) and still feel as though we are in a desert.

I'm not saying this next part because I think I am all that (for I am a wretch!), but I think the deeper a man or woman goes in Christ the more out of place they will feel in 95% of the churches out there.

 2010/9/14 7:05

 Re: Its just so bitter!

HI Matthew, as you know, there is a movement around the world who is just simply tired of church as ususal. Most Christians that you run into believe that the Lord is coming soon, they at least say that. Then there are two basic groups. There is one group who believe that the church is in crisis and in a deep sleep. They believe that since judgement begins at the house of the Lord that He has has witdrawn His corporate presence. Go to SI archives and check out the messages from Brian Long and David Legge from the Welsh conference. The other group do not see such a crisis, therefore it is business as ususal.

Here is a message form Tozer............

By A.W. Tozer

Most of the World’s GREAT SOULS have been lonely. Loneliness seems to be one price the saint must pay for his saintliness.

Enoch, Noah, Abraham and Moses all walked a path quite apart from their contemporaries even though many people surrounded them.

The prophets of pre-Christian times differed widely from each other, but one mark they bore in common was their enforced loneliness.

Jesus died alone in the darkness hidden from the sight of mortal man and no one saw Him when He arose triumphant and walked out of the tomb, even though many saw Him afterward and bore witness to what they saw.

The cheerful denial of loneliness proves only that the speaker has never walked with God without the support and encouragement afforded him by society. The sense of companionship that mistakenly attributes to the presence of Christ may and probably does arise from the presence of friendly people. Always remember: you cannot carry a cross in company. Though a vast crowd surrounds a man, his cross is his alone and his carrying of it marks him as a man apart. Society has turned against him; otherwise he would have no cross. No one is a friend to the man with a cross. “They all forsook Him and fled.”

The loneliness of the Christian results from his walk with God in an ungodly world, a walk that must often take him away from the fellowship of good Christians as well as from the unregenerate world. His God-given instincts cry out for companionship with others who can understand his longings, his aspirations, and his absorption in his love for Christ; and because within his circle of friends there are so few who share his inner experiences he is forced to walk alone.

The man who has passed on into the divine Presence in actual inner experience will not find many who understand him. A certain amount of social fellowship will of course be his as he mingles with religious persons in regular activities of the church, but true spiritual fellowship will be hard to find.

The truly spiritual man is indeed something of an oddity. He lives not for himself but to promote the interests of Another. He seeks to persuade people to give all to his Lord and asks no portion or share for himself. He delights not to be honored but to see his Saviour glorified in the eyes of men. His joy is to see Jesus promoted and himself neglected. He finds few who care to talk about that which is the supreme object of his interest, so he is often silent and preoccupied in the midst of noisy religious shoptalk. For this he earns the reputation of being dull and over-serious, so he is avoided and the gulf between him and society widens. He searches for friends upon whose garments he can detect the smell of myrrh and aloes and cassia out of the ivory palaces, and finding few or none he, like Mary of old, keeps these things in his heart.

It is this very loneliness that throws him back upon God. His inability to find human companionship drives him to seek in God what he can find nowhere else. He learns in inner solitude what he could not have learned in the crowd-that Christ is All in All.

Two things remain to be said about the man that is in this state of loneliness. First, he is not a haughty man, he is not holier-than-thou, and he is not an austere saint. He is likely to feel that he is the least of all men and is sure to blame himself for his loneliness. He wants to share his feelings with others and to open his heart to some like-minded soul who will understand him, but the spiritual climate around him does not encourage it, so he remains silent and tells his grief to God alone.

The second thing is that the lonely saint is not the withdrawn man who hardens himself against human suffering and spends his days contemplating the heavens. The opposite is true. His loneliness makes him sympathetic to the approach of the brokenhearted and the fallen and the sin-bruised. Because he is detached from the world he is all the more able to help it.

The weakness of so many modern Christians is that they feel too much at home in the world. In their effort to achieve restful “adjustment” to an unregenerate society they have lost their pilgrim character and become an essential part of the very moral order against which they are sent to protest. The world recognizes them (modern Christians) and accepts them for what they are. This is the saddest thing that can be said about them. They are not lonely, but neither are they saints.

- A.W. Tozer

 2010/9/14 9:09

Joined: 2010/6/26
Posts: 483


That quote from A.W. Tozer refreshed my soul.
Thank you so much!

 2010/9/14 9:24Profile

Joined: 2007/6/27
Posts: 1573
Omaha, NE

 Re: Its just so bitter!

Matthew, you hunger for the presence
and the purpose and the power of GOD!
You won't be satisfied with anything
else!! Don't seek the experience in
the church; seek the Savior!!

Martin G. Smith

 2010/9/14 12:13Profile

Joined: 2004/7/7
Posts: 7472


Excellent article, Frank. However, I take exception to the following statement:

His joy is to see Jesus promoted and himself neglected.

True, a person wants to see Jesus glorified. BUT a female wants and needs companionship. We are made social creatures, females needing it much more so then males. It would be a credit to the males to recognize this need in women. Too many males are blind to disturbing things simply because most are not given to detail like a female. And these disturbing things are unsettling to a female, robbing her of close intimacy with others, hence the loneliness.

Females find loneliness harder to deal with then males: this is my point - in case anyone missed it!


Sandra Miller

 2010/9/14 13:09Profile


Hi Sister Ginnyrose,

I definately bow to your expertize on what a woman wants :)And yet I have to say that a Spiritual woman will suffer the same lonliness that men may, perhaps to a greater degree because their need in this particular area is greater for fellowship. I agree that females find lonliness harder to deal with than males, point taken, yet there are things that are harder for men to deal with yet deal with it they must.( I was specifically thinking that men are more " visually wired," than woman, in general, therefore lust of the eyes may be a bigger issue for men, but still the standard, Gods calling, is the same, meaning that you dont get a pass because you are wired differently) Frank

 2010/9/14 14:13

 Re: Its just so bitter!....DIVINE DISCONTENTMENT.

" Lord willing I will be freed from the religious chains and truly serve the Lord for His glory in action and in Truth and Spirit not out of obligation and falsity."

"Sorry if this seems ranty I was just very discouraged by some of the attitudes on Sunday and needed to get this off my chest. I ask that people pray for me to give me some direction on how to handle these thoughts and feelings, to handle them in a Godly manner. I would deeply appreciate it."..............mguldner

I believe that the true Church is seated in Heaven, but salted upon the Earth. I believe that the entire holy and true body of Christ, throughout every nation and tribe upon the Earth, is being drawn out unto the Lord during this Harvest Time, the end of the age.

"The Bride has made herself ready..." There is an unseen process happening throughout the Earth now, of Divine Discontentment, expressing the failure of Churchianity, the One man show, the Professional ministry, Nicolaitanism, and the ever present Pharisee spirit that drives us to perform, but abandons the least of the brethren and equal love and ministry for all.

Traditional, Pew and Pulpit based churches, that operate on this system, are doomed to failure; to dry up, and blow away...for the Hand of the Lord is performing His Word in this Harvest hour. To find and live a life walking by faith in the Spirit, to find Jesus to love and serve in a real functioning body, to discover your ministry heart and FUNCTION, as a child of God, man or woman.

One body, One faith, One spirit; and the joy of life; this is our hunger, our obsession. It is, in my opinion, an act of God in your life, an obscure discipline, that is driving you out....even into the wilderness...and as Pilgrims, meet somewhere in the foothills before the City of God.

Millions have stepped away from meager Churchianity, where man is honored, and reality is lost within the confines of "THE SERVICE", and the body is left alone, and starving to death, while the Pastors boast of great glory. So, rejoice, and remember that the Father has not forsaken you, and will never forsake you as long as you seek after Him, no matter what.

Your isssue now is bravery; Do you have the courage TO BELIEVE THAT GOD HAS A PLACE FOR YOU IN HIS kINGDOM?....and walk away by faith knowing that He does, and He will provide. Some have starved to death, believing that their lot is to suffer, and wait it out in the system....and they perish there, not knowing that they MUST OBEY the Word to find Him.

He that saves his life SHALL lose it, and He that loses his life, FOR MY NAMES SAKE.....SHALL.......FIND IT. It is lonely. Matthew 10 says that to obey, means you must pay the price of being hated by ALL, rejected by most of your loved ones...[ usually..], and persecuted....kind of a bleak faith promise. It is here though, that YOU ARE DRIVEN INTO THE WILDERNESS TO FIND YOUR PLACE...TO HONOR JESUS AND TO LEARN HOW TO LOVE.

This is the only way for all true sons and daughters, and the end is a stripping, a humbling, and understanding, that a faith walk is always alone, yet always attached to the true body..[ often from time to time..], and always attached intimately to our Lord Jesus.

Man will always fail you...everytime, but not Jesus. Cry out to God and trust Him with your life to lead you to His Promise land, that you know is in you, and you will never be content until He plants you there.

 2010/9/14 17:34

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