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 Salvation

This subject is so vague sometimes. Some people say, if you say the prayer and meant it, you are a christian, which I disgree too. You have to be changed and repent. Some say if the Holy Spirit is in you, you will change automatically.

But I think most of question our salvation from time to time especially when you were good at controlling your sin but when you fall, you might feel that you were never saved in the first place. Even Franis Chan sometimes questions his salvation. So what is the definitive answer?

It's very hard to talk about this at church where everyone has to act perfect, not because of God but for people.

So, here is an example. Lets say you do drugs or smoke or any other sin. The church frowns upon this so around christians you have to act like you just quit cold turkey. But most of the time, you just can't quit cold turkey. This goes for any sin: sex, masturbation, hatred, anger, impatience, etc.

And many times you question your salvation because you still are doing the sin. You tell yourself that if you were really saved Holy Spirit would not allow you to sin.

So is there a good site or anything that dictates the in's and out's of salvation?

 2010/2/14 21:51
jimp
Member



Joined: 2005/6/18
Posts: 1481


 Re: Salvation

hi, the bible says;whosoever calls upon the name of the Lord will be saved.anything you do that you could be proud of is not part of salvation. repentance is laying your life on the altar and choosing Him as Lord...alost man cannot change for he is at enmity with God and vice versa we need to be born of the spirit not of our flesh..jimp

 2010/2/14 22:39Profile









 Re: Salvation

Quote:
you have to act like you just quit cold turkey. But most of the time, you just can't quit cold turkey. This goes for any sin: sex, masturbation, hatred, anger, impatience, etc.



This gave me an idea. There are Two Ways to Stop Sinning: Way to stop sinning number one is Cold Turkey. Way to stop sinning number two is Hot Turkey - in hell.

 2010/2/14 23:22
Logic
Member



Joined: 2005/7/17
Posts: 1791


 Re:

Quote:
benjoseph said:
There are Two Ways to Stop Sinning: Way to stop sinning number one is Cold Turkey. Way to stop sinning number two is Hot Turkey - in hell.

There are two ways to Stop Sinning:
One way to stop sinning is to just stop.
The other way is to [b]NOT[/b] stop sinning untill you're dead and in hell.

Quote:
codek said:
But most of the time, you just can't quit cold turkey. This goes for any sin: sex, masturbation, hatred, anger, impatience, etc.

There is no reason that you just [b]can't[/b] quit sinning cold turkey.

Let's get serious; what is stopping you?

 2010/2/15 0:15Profile









 Re:

Pick any one of those. It should apply to all. I'm not a crazy sinner or anything. Just your average Joe.

Let's pick drugs. Let's say you're addicted to crack and you get saved. Holy spirit gives you power to never do crack again from that moment on in all cases? You can use smoking in this example.

What about the sin of gluttony? Our body is a temple of God. But how many people do you see quit all normal foods and go on a strict vegan diet cold turkey to never go back?

How about pornography or even lust. What if you saw a pretty girl walk by? Even Francis Chan said that those temptations don't go away from you because you are saved. Isn't it a constant war between flesh and spirit for all the days of my your life?

What about anger? Someone deliberately tried to hurt you or your family? Or you just caught your wife cheating on you? after you were saved. Someone just raped someone close to you and they show up next to you?

I'm not understanding the responses so please clarify. So everyone saved would have stopped cold turkey? Then we would be perfect after salvation?

 2010/2/15 0:44
jimp
Member



Joined: 2005/6/18
Posts: 1481


 Re:

hi,Jesus already paid the price for ALL of your sin. Heis the last sacrifice.IT IS FINISHED.if you are in Jesus...john 3 16...jimp

 2010/2/15 1:25Profile









 Re:

I think people confuse temptation with sin a lot.

It is not wrong to have temptations or feel certain emotions if we have no choice about it. Sin is only when we choose to do something wrong.

Sin we have to stop cold turkey because sin is rebellion against God and it dishonors him. Temptation is something we pray to be kept from but remember Jesus experienced great temptation. Temptation is something we will have but sin we must forsake completely.

 2010/2/15 2:45
IWantAnguish
Member



Joined: 2006/6/15
Posts: 343
VCU @ Richmond, VA

 Re:

I do not agree with the idea that people stop sinning once in hell.

Hell is the full depravity of man in sin without the Holy Spirit to restrain the natural fallen tendency of man...

Thus people can finally hate God with the totality of their entire being for the first time in their lives...

=========

And as for the topic of salvation...

Although I do not agree that people can make a choice to stop the inward sins of pride, bitterness, lust, envy, jealousy, hate, arrogance, deceitfulness, selfishness... I believe that the grace of God is more than able to change the direction and leanings of the heart in such a way that would be so supernatural, that only God could receive the glory for the change in the individual.

For He takes out the heart of stone, and puts in a heart of flesh with His commandments written upon them... The natural tendency of the born-again believer is towards God, as much as his flesh groans and wrestles under the weight of sin, the believer yearns for the day to shuffle off this mortal coil and fly free, uninhibited towards God, his magnificent obsession.


_________________
Sam Yoon

 2010/2/15 3:40Profile
bible4life
Member



Joined: 2009/1/21
Posts: 1559
Locport, Illinois

 Re:

I recommend a book for you it is real cheap about six dollars but it is a very good book on explaining what has happened through the cross of Jesus to the believer. The book is called the Normal Christian Life by watchman nee, trust me it is real good and real deep. If you are truly a believer your old self and sin nature has been crucified to the cross with Jesus, it was all judged on the cross. The book of romans is great at explaining that we as believers are dead to sin, we have to know this, we are no longer a slave to sin but to God and righteousness. We are now in the spirit and Christ is working in me now, i now overcome the deeds of the flesh because of Jesus Christ he has defeated sin, satan and death. As Christ rose from the dead we also have been rose to new bodies in Christ, we must know and reckon this and now live in the spirit, he has set you free if your a believer. Do not sow to the flesh but to the spirit, satan wants you to do the things of the flesh so he will tempt you and bring everything at you to defeat you but you must be strong in the word of God and do as james ch.4 says to resist satan and submit unto God, your a new creation if you our saved. The spirit and flesh war against one another but choose the spirit. When Christ died on the cross you have to realize your old self died with him on the cross, your a new man. I will say this about the believer according to scripture you look at the church of corinth and they were at a time living in carnality, but through the sanctifying work of the holy spirit in them they grew and matured in the walk. In hebrews it says that God chastizes his children but the ones he doesn't chastize over their sin they are considered bastards. If God has saved you, you will have a desire to live for righteousness and to obey the holy spirit, if you sin and you will you will be convicted and will want to repent. One thing we have to understand is that we are saved by Christ through faith in him, even that gift of faith is given by God.When we believe in Christ as our saviour of our sins and our life and on his finished work on the cross we are given the very righteousness of Jesus, his perfect righteousness in which is the only way to stand before a holy God. We are justified or made right in Gods eyes and i guess you can say considered sinless because of Christ's righteousness. You are given an A plus from the beginning because it is nothing you can do but what Christ has done. If you sin you do not lose your salvation you our still cleansed by his blood if you our saved. In hebrews it says that he died as a sacrifice once and for all for all sins and we must believe that it was past, present and future because otherwise we would be saying that it is something we had to do to maintain it. You need to get a proper understanding of God's hatred towards sin, study it in scripture and though whatever way possible so you can understand how much God hates sin in so much that his only begotten son Jesus Christ had to die for us by bearing our sins upon himself. God's hatred and justice against sin is shown at the cross. He does not tolerate sin. Read habakuk, spelled it wrong ch. 1 verse 13. It says the Lords eyes are to pure to behold evil. Everytime we sin we are taking the side of satan over God. Christ shed his blood for us because sin was heineous before a holy God. It took his death to save us.I hope i helped.


_________________
John Beechy

 2010/2/15 4:25Profile









 Re:

@IWantAnguish

First off, I want to tell you I appreciate your posts. They really are insightful and help me out a lot.

about this:

And as for the topic of salvation...

Although I do not agree that people can make a choice to stop the inward sins of pride, bitterness, lust, envy, jealousy, hate, arrogance, deceitfulness, selfishness... I believe that the grace of God is more than able to change the direction and leanings of the heart in such a way that would be so supernatural, that only God could receive the glory for the change in the individual.

Do you agree with some posters here that God should do this instantaneously when you get saved and the Holy Spirit resides in you? And that the inward sins of pride, bitterness, lust, envy, etc are forever gone?



 2010/2/15 5:21





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