Santa Clara, CA
Great dialogue here brethren.
Some random thoughts.
Another possible term is "harassment".
Could give quite a few examples of pre-conversion, drug induced demonic activity. The drugs being not only a conduit but also gives it all a nice muddiness to the deception, but that would only add to moving this further off topic.
Would say that I am with Ron on this and appreciate the caution which he deals with this area. The other thread mentioned [url=http://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=782&forum=36]physic soul links[/url] is on the mark and should be noted. Also, really appreciate this frank and honest comment;
Of course, all this may be nonsense. As I said these are just my opinions, observations and personal experience.
Because the devil is a liar and his minions ape their master, deception is deceptive, speculation is speculative...you get the idea. To err on the side of caution is not a cop out, but wisdom. Think it also carries over into other areas like 'prophecy', we have to keep in mind that we may be redeemed but we are still damaged and prone to our own brains mis-firings.
To finish the quote;
Here comes the Bible bit...
THIS is the only safeguard against the 'extra' bit's of speculative and wanton meanderings that are out there. Would think it would be plain enough but...
Evil interference occurs in all the greater measure as man declines accountability. A large part of severe counselling situations reveal mans unwillingness to stand up to moral requirements in social life.
One may not blame demons for mans behaviour. Man is obliged to take control remember Cain
Amen! First in order.
Along that line and to the house cleaning, might we add this?
2Pe 2:1 Now there were false prophets among the people, just as there also will be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies and even deny the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction on themselves.
2Pe 2:2 Many people will follow their immoral ways, and because of them the way of truth will be maligned.
2Pe 2:3 In their greed they will exploit you with deceptive words. The ancient verdict against them is still in force, and their destruction is not asleep.
2Pe 2:4 For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but threw them into the lowest hell and committed them to chains of deepest darkness to be kept for judgment;
2Pe 2:5 and if he did not spare the ancient world but protected Noah, a preacher of righteousness, and seven others when he brought the flood on the world of ungodly people;
2Pe 2:6 and if he condemned the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah and destroyed them by burning them to ashes, making them an example to ungodly people of what is going to happen to them;
2Pe 2:7 and if he rescued Lot, a righteous man who was greatly distressed by the immoral conduct of lawless people-
2Pe 2:8 for as long as that righteous man lived among them, day after day he was being tortured in his righteous soul by what he saw and heard in their lawless actions-
2Pe 2:9 then the Lord knows how to rescue godly people from their trials and to hold unrighteous people for punishment on the day of judgment,
2Pe 2:10 especially those who satisfy their flesh by indulging in its passions and who despise authority. Being bold and arrogant, they are not afraid to slander glorious beings.
2Pe 2:11 Yet even angels, although they are greater in strength and power, do not bring a slanderous accusation against them from the Lord.
2Pe 2:12 These people, like irrational animals, are mere creatures of instinct that are born to be caught and killed. They insult what they don't understand, and like animals they, too, will be destroyed,
2Pe 2:13 suffering wrong as punishment for their wrongdoing. They take pleasure in wild parties in broad daylight. They are stains and blemishes, reveling in their deceitful pleasures while they eat with you.
2Pe 2:14 With eyes full of adultery, they cannot get enough of sin. They seduce unsteady souls and have had their hearts expertly trained in greed. They are doomed to a curse.
2Pe 2:15 They have left the straight path and wandered off to follow the path of Balaam, the son of Bosor, who loved the reward he got for doing wrong.
2Pe 2:16 But he was rebuked for his offense. A donkey that normally cannot talk spoke with a human voice and restrained the prophet's insanity.
2Pe 2:17 These men are dried-up springs, mere clouds driven by a storm. Gloomy darkness is reserved for them.
2Pe 2:18 By talking high-sounding nonsense and using sinful cravings of the flesh, they entice people who have just escaped from those who live in error.
2Pe 2:19 Promising them freedom, they themselves are slaves to depravity, for [b]a person is a slave to whatever conquers him.[/b]
2Pe 2:20 For if, after escaping the world's corruptions through a full knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, [b]they are again entangled and conquered by them, then their last condition is worse than their former one[/b].
2Pe 2:21 It would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness than to know it and turn their backs on the holy commandment that was committed to them.
2Pe 2:22 The proverb is true that describes what has happened to them: "A dog returns to its vomit," and "A pig that is washed goes back to wallow in the mud."
Responsibility first and foremost. Too many instances and directives to "stand your ground", "resist", "take up", "put on" and ironically another word that seems to not only lost favor but even definition:
1Co 9:26 So I do not run aimlessly; I do not box as one beating the air.
1Co 9:27 But I discipline my body and keep it under control, lest after preaching to others I myself should be disqualified.
Now for some grace. Even boxers eventually lose a fight or at least get pummeled in the course of a bout, that's where we can come into the corner and give some water, some eyesalve and encouragement.
Now for a big giant wrench to throw into all of this. I just picked up a book given to me awhile back that I recalled challenged me on this whole issue. Stranger yet, I 'flipped' right to the section that I was looking for 8-) ... It's a bit long and it deals with someone who was entangled with and coming out of astrology. I found that it applied personally in a number of ways, one being an ill-advised visit to a physic even though my Catholic upbringing somehow had implanted this was a bad idea, I went with the thought of "if this 'feels' wrong I will just leave". Looking back on it, she was very accurate but just as well not much help. I was in a very bad way, despondent, lonely, doing drugs but had recently come off the 'speed'. Vulnerable. She told me I would come across a blonde woman who had a child and that it would be MY decision whether or not to get involved with her. It wasn't until many months later and many months after that it all dawned on me now that I was involved in a relationship with a married (though separated) women with a young child who just happened to be blonde, just how accurate she was. Quite a mess and a lot of unnecessary pain to all who were involved for many years afterwords. Dangerous hardly expresses what can come about meddling in this realm. Hope to post the prior thoughts before this digression at a later point.
Sorry for the length...
| 2004/10/8 8:56||Profile|
Slightly off topic here but,
Is anyone familiar with the Writings of Rebecca Brown, she has published 4 books (that I know of) on Spiritual Warfare, and I was wondering if anybody has read or found them usefull.
| 2004/10/9 20:11||Profile|
yes i have read 3 of her books.
no they went the best of help they opened my eyes to other things in the spirit but i also got a weird check in my spirit when i read them.
but if you type in her name you will find there is alot said about her in a bad way in that she still is a witch writing to confuse christians & that her stories dont add up at all.
so there is something for you to consider?
i have read a book by a lady called doreen irvine now hers was helpful, aswel as a book by another lady called "destroying the works of witchcraft through prayer & fasting ruth brown"
| 2004/10/10 10:44||Profile|
The reason I was asking is that the books are really popular right now around here among our Christian youth. And I have some problems with some of what is being tought, eg. generational curses, christian demon possesion, demons "legal" right to posses you etc... Mabye someone could expound on what constitutes a legal right.
I have looked her up on the internet, however the internet is not the most reliable source of information. And the few sites that I did check out all seem to get their information from the same source, so I am a little leary just accepting what is being said there. That being said she does seem to generate a fair share of criticism.
| 2004/10/10 14:48||Profile|
And I have some problems with some of what is being tought, eg. generational curses, christian demon possesion, demons "legal" right to posses you etc... Mabye someone could expound on what constitutes a legal right.
we have touched on some of these things. There may be some thoughts here which are worth re-thinking? Generational Curses
| 2004/10/11 8:39||Profile|
"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11
I have begun to start taking a look at a small paperback volume called: The Strategy of Satan by Warren W. Wiersbe
So far its very simple and straight forward and heavily uses the scriptures. His intent is for meditation on the scriptures to unravel the lies the enemy has sown in our minds. I am appreciating his view on issues a subtitle to the book is 'How to detect and defeat Him'.
SI Moderator - Greg Gordon
| 2004/10/11 9:30||Profile|
| Re: Christian Demon Possession|
I believe the more accurate rendering is demonized.I believe a christian can be oppressed----oppression is like the pressing in.I believe sometimes christians can allow themselves to be vexed with the filthy lifestyles of the world around them.But possession is a total loss of will and once born again I believe it would take an aweful alot to turn away and become reprobate.
| 2004/10/16 9:38||Profile|
To as many as recieved Him he gave the power to become the sons of God????would that count?
| 2004/10/19 23:37||Profile|
| Re: Christian Demon Possession|
Just a thought for everyone to considerin reguards to demon possession.Have any of you ever cast out a demon?I mean a real manisfestation of a person demonically possessed?At that moment all the theology all the greek and hebrew won't help you.If you genuinily believe christians---including yourself can have demons---don't ever even try to cast out a real demon,you won't like the results.I'm not the brightest light on the tree but I've alot of experience here and to say that binding the strong man and spoiling his house is talking about christians?sorry thats just not true.I've seen demons levitate people and things and just the simple faith of a simple believer who loves Jesus will prevail over it.As to the childrens bread?Jesus was the childrens bread---all he was and did---all he spoke and taught ---to the jews first as it were then to the gentiles.As christians we must be willing to except the fact that our flesh is to be crucified and not cast out.Sin is to be repented of and we shouldn't blame it on the devil.We are hid in Christ in heavenly places and I know that Christ doesn't have a demon in any form residing in him. Perfect love casts out all fear and while we can be vex with spirits like Job who said an evil spirit passed by and his hair stood on end we can't be possessed.We can give place but thats not in us.
| 2004/10/20 0:16||Profile|