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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Judas lost his salvation

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 Judas lost his salvation

I have studied this issue for a while and am very confident that Judas was a genuine believer who lost his salvation. This issue is very important to me so I wanted to know what everyone else on this forum thought.

[u][b]THE APOSTLE JUDAS LOST HIS SALVATION[/b][/u]

[b]THE TESTIMONY OF LOGIC[/b]

- Betrayal implies previous friendship, loyalty, and trust.
- Judas betrayed Jesus
- Therefore Judas was previously a loyal and trusted friend.

[b]THE TESTIMONY OF ORTHODOX CHURCH HISTORY[/b]

"Judas was sincere, when Christ chose him to the apostleship." John Fletcher

"Judas was at first a child of the kingdom and heard it said to him with th disciples, 'You shall sit upon twelve thrones' but at last he became a child of hell" St. Chrysostom

"For both Saul and Judas were once good...Sometimes they are at first good, who afterward become and continue evil; and for this respect they are said to be written in the book of life, and blotted out of it." St. Ambrose

[b]THE TESTIMONY OF SCRIPTURE[/b]

Anyone who is a disciple of Jesus Christ is saved. That is because in order to be a disciple of Jesus a person need to forsake everything and follow Him (Luke 14:33), they need to love God more then family (Luke 14:26), they need to pick up their cross and die (Luke 14:27).

Judas was a disciple of Jesus Christ (Matt 10:1). Therefore Judas forsook everything to follow Jesus. Judas loved God more then his own family. Judas picked up his cross and decided to live a crucified life.

Judas was not only a disciple, but Judas was an Apostle who Jesus chose specifically to preach the gospel, heal the sick, and cast out demons (Matt 10:1). That was the mission Jesus picked Judas for.

In fact, scripture says Judas was a friend of Jesus in whom Jesus trusted (Ps 41:9, John 13:18). And that is also evidenced by the fact that Judas was the money keeper (Jn 13:29)

But somewhere down the line Judas became a backslider. Judas began to steal and abuse his position (John 12:6). Judas choose to forsake Jesus and thereby forsake his own salvation.

Jesus Himself said that He lost Judas (Jn 17:12) and Acts 1:25 even said that Judas fell from His apostleship by transgression. Judas failed to accomplish and fulfill His Apostleship, failed to do what Jesus picked him to do - to take the gospel to the world like the rest of the Apostles (Matt 10:1). It would have been better for Judas if he was never born (Matt 26:24)

Jesus was deeply troubled by these new developments in Judas (Jn 13:21) and even expressed surprise that someone he picked would become a devil (Jn 6:70). Nevertheless the Sovereign Lord was able to adopt these new circumstances into His plans (John 13:27). (Sovereignty is not that God causes all things, but that God is able to work with all things, that God can use all things, that God can incorporate all things into His plans. That is the genius of God.

Jesus told Judas that there was a throne in Heaven for him, upon which Judas would sit with the other twelve to judge the tribes of Israel (Matt. 19:28). Jesus told Judas that He was shedding His blood for him (Lk. 22:14-20), and previously told Judas that His name was written in the Lambs book of life (Lk. 10:20). But then later, after having his name written in Heaven, we see that Judas became a devil (Jn. 6:70), and therefore it would have been better for him to have never been born (Mk. 14:21). Judas fell from his Apostleship by his transgression (Acts 1:25) and his name was blotted out of the book of life (Ex. 23:33; Rev. 3:5). So we can see that the atonement does not automatically or unconditionally save anyone. Many of those for whom Christ died will ultimately perish for their sin because they choose to continue in their sin (Heb. 10:26-31) instead of sinning no more. It’s possible to deny the Lord that bought us and thereby fall into condemnation (2 Pet. 2:1). The wrath of God is impartial (Deut. 10:17; Col. 3:26; 2 Pet. 1:17), so anyone who willingly and knowingly sins is under condemnation (Rom. 1:18, 2:6-11) because God must uphold and enforce His Laws as long as He is loving and caring, as long as He hates sin because He’s benevolent.

Judas is a terrible example of how a genuine disciple, even an Apostle, still has a freewill and therefore can backslide into sin, forsake the Lord, abandon the faith (Jn 6:66), and thereby forfeit his salvation, and become cut off (Romans 11:21-22) after being adopted in.

If Judas could lose his salvation (not only a disciple but also an Apostle) then any Christian could lose their salvation.

Therefore let us work out our salvation with fear and trembling (Php 2:12). Let us continue in the love of God (John 15:9). Let us persevere unto the end (Matt 24:13). Let us continue in the faith (Acts 14:22). Let us continue in the grace of God (Acts 13:43).

 2009/11/21 10:36
NSCalvinist
Member



Joined: 2009/11/9
Posts: 18


 Re: Judas lost his salvation

This is a very challenging post....

 2009/11/21 11:39Profile
jimp
Member



Joined: 2005/6/18
Posts: 1481


 Re: Judas lost his salvation

hi, read john 6 70,71...than editjimp

 2009/11/21 12:22Profile









 Re:

Jesus called Judas a devil but that doesn't mean Judas was always that way.

Just as Jesus calling Peter Satan doesn't mean that Peter was always that way.

By picking Peter and Judas to be Apostles, to preach the Gospel, heal the sick, and cast out devils, Jesus was putting his public approval upon these men.

 2009/11/21 13:03









 Re:

Somebody directed me to this video:

[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0iKT5V24yfA]Judas Was Saved[/url]

I am very happy to see others have learned this truth from Scripture like I have.

 2009/11/21 14:26









 Re:

Judas was never saved and you really need to twist the scriptures to suggest he was,

He was after all the "son of perdition". John 17:12.

what rubbish

 2009/11/21 17:02









 Re:

John 17:12 says that Jesus was given to him by God and he lost him. In other words, Judas lost his salvation.

If Judas was never saved, Jesus never would have given him public approval by making him an apostle.

If Judas was never saved, Jesus would have never sent him to preach the Gospel, heal the sick, and cast out devils.

If Judas was never saved, Jesus never would have told him that he had a throne in Heaven.

 2009/11/21 17:53
roaringlamb
Member



Joined: 2003/6/11
Posts: 1519
Santa Cruz California

 Re: Judas lost his salvation

So now the REAL question becomes, "how many personalities does Jesse Morrell have?"

I wonder if he is not only NSCalvinist, BUT also TheArminian?

That to me is more important!


_________________
patrick heaviside

 2009/11/21 18:01Profile









 Re:


you must be a real heretic to believe such nonsense.

 2009/11/21 18:24
Leo_Grace
Member



Joined: 2009/6/14
Posts: 703


 Re:

I believe you are both correct. I think he is Jesse Morrell now here as NSCalvinist/TheArminian. He believes that he can live a sinless life (see his other thread by NSCalvinist) just like Jesus Christ. He consistently misreads Scripture (like he does above) and presumes to explain the Lord's unspoken thoughts to us in order to serve his own agenda. He would glorify himself rather than accept the truth of Scripture.

Under his recently-banned JMorrell account, he said:

Quote:
I would sooner become an atheist than to become a Calvinist.


This speaks volumes about his spiritual condition. He loves his personal doctrines more than he loves God.

 2009/11/21 18:48Profile





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