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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Was Judas a true believer at one point?

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 Re: Was Judas a true believer at one point?

Quote:
Judas was a disciple of the Lord and therefore he left ft all to follow Jesus (Lk. 14:33). He picked up his cross (Lk. 14:27) and even loved Jesus more then his own family (Lk. 14:26). Judas was picked by Jesus specifically to cast out devils, heal, and preach (Matt 10:1-27). Judas was a friend Jesus trusted (Ps. 41:9; Jn 13:18), so Judas kept the money (Jn. 12:6; 13:29). Jesus told Judas that He was shedding His blood for him (Lk. 22:14-20), and previously said that His name was written in the Lambs book of life (Lk. 10:20). Jesus even said that Judas was one of His sheep (Matt. 10:1-4, 16), who received His truth (Matt 10:1-4, 8), who’s Father was God (Matt 10:1-4, 20), who even had a throne in Heaven upon which he would judge Israel (Matt. 19:28; Lk. 22:30). But then later we see that Judas became a devil (Jn. 6:70) and therefore it would have been better for him to have never been born (Mk. 14:21). He even began to steal money from the group (Jn. 12:6). Judas fell from his apostleship by his transgression (Acts 1:25) because He failed to do what Jesus picked him for. His name was blotted out of the book of life (Ex. 23:33; Rev. 3:5). (Jesse Morrell)



Very good!

Quote:
The role of Judas was prophesied in the OT as the betrayer, a necessary ingredient



Where?

There a few passages that people try to use to say that Judas was prophecied in the OT. "My own familiar friend in whom I trusted" but this is talking about the situation of David and his counselor. It is applicable to the situation of Judas and Jesus through similarity. Jesus and Judas were genuine friends, but Judas betrayed Jesus, therefore Judas fulfilled this OT passage through similarity. Also, "Let his habitation be desolate and let another take his place" which is actually two seperate Scriptures that Peter merges and modifies. The original says "let their habitation be desolate". These are called parallel scripture fulfillments, not prophetic prophecy.

We see this also with "out of Egypt I called my son". This is originally talking about Israel in the OT, but it is applicable to Jesus' situation through similarity.

I am absolutely convinciced that there was absolutely no prophetic passages in the OT that talked about Judas. The only actual prophecies about Judas were in the New Testament by Jesus Christ, which were given after Judas backslide from being a genuine disciple.

 2009/8/4 22:03





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