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Discussion Forum : Revivals And Church History : A Christless Pentecost, a warning, by David Wilkerson & Frank Bartleman

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Earendel
Member



Joined: 2009/3/17
Posts: 308
Central Alberta, Canada

 Re:

Quote:

ccchhhrrriiisss wrote:
Hi Earendel...
Quote:
Are there really people focusing on the gifts rather than the Giver? I don't see how one can be touched by God and not be changed, permanently changed for the good. The things I used to do I can do no longer; repentance has befallen me, and I am forever changed.

Yes, there are. They meet each and every Sunday! I have known many charismatic believers who shout, dance, speak in tongues, prophesy...but also admittedly curse, gossip, indulge in pornography, sexual sin, divorce and even homosexuality! Remember Ted Haggard? Jimmy Swaggert? My own sister seemed to be a strong charismatic believer. As a teen, I used to wake up and see her quietly praying for me.

I am not passing judgment upon these men (or my sister)...because they may, indeed, by "brothers." However, there is something wrong when the same people who "prophesy" on Sundays are gossipping on Mondays. There is something wrong when the same people who claim to have visions on Wednesday are viewing pornography on Thursdays. There is a chasing of the "gifts" in the modern charismatic and pentecostal movement. It doesn't mean that ALL are doing this...but there is a problem. As a pentecostal believer, David Wilkerson knows this all too well.

All that Wilkerson is saying is that there is a danger in chasing after the wind (or the "effects" of the Spirit). How many people ran to Pensecola...Toronto...and the tattooed preacher (Todd Bentley) in Florida? Sometimes, God is not in the fire, earthquake or wind...but He is in the still, small voice (I KINGS 19:11-18). We can still endeavor the gifts of the Spirit (I Corinthians 12), but our eyes should always be on Christ and not the gifts (or the supposed demonstrations of such gifts).

:-)



Funny you should mention Bentley.

The Lord moves in mysterious ways sometimes. About two weeks before the news on Bentley came out, I wrote to Stephen Strader and told him that a Katrina class hurricane was coming his way and that it was coming because of sin. A couple of weeks after I gave Strader that word, Hurricane Fay flooded Florida with record rain fall (3-4 feet in some places) (Katrina was about flooding, which is what Fay did) it was the same time that news on Todd Bentley was revealed.

Please don't take it that I am boasting for telling you this, because I am not...God forbid. It was merely a demonstration of the power of God moving through the Holy Spirit. I have always been about repentance (it's been my witness/message to myself first before others) and that was my message to Strader (Repentance). God kept the word of prophecy I gave to Strader, and in so doing kept His word about the need for repentance in the body of Christ. Strader did not accept it, even after the fact, because I did not names names, or say what the sin was, and he said a true prophet would be able to do that. *sigh*

I want add here that I have prayed for Todd and his wife Shonna and their kids. Lord have mercy on them, and forgive Todd Lord, and give him repentance.


_________________
David

 2009/3/26 21:38Profile









 Re:

I agree. We can't condemn anyone - but His Word [i]may.[/i]

2Ti 3:16, All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: that the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

The bulk of the Epistles were written to Counter heresy. Poor Paul constantly battling heresy and John and Jude and Peter .. as folks "wrest the scriptures" today for "unity without sound doctrine."

Paul told Timothy to "watch his life And Doctrine Closely".

Never one above the other - but equal in importance.

That's where this present age church has gone off.

This verse would go along well with John 16:13

Joh 18:37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am king.
[b]To this end was I born,
and for this cause came I into the world,
that I should bear witness unto the truth.
Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.[/b]

In John 10 HE said that if we knew His Voice, we'd not follow 'another'. Who else could he mean but those he mentioned earlier that would deceive with false doctrines and lying signs & wonders and false prophesies.

Jesus warned repeatedly about "those days" which are "these days" where counterfeit everything is out there and only Sound Doctrine will tear it down.

"The Spirit of Truth" as mentioned in John 16:13 is mainly to lead us into Truth and not just make us nice folks. :-)


As far as David Wilkerson goes, or even the lead article - I'm not quite sure where you see fault.

This quote - just for one from the lead article hit another nail of these present days...

Quote:
Many are willing to seek power in order to perform miracles, draw attention and adoration of the people to themselves, thus robbing Christ of His glory, and making a fair showing in the flesh. The greatest need would seem to be for true followers of the meek and lowly Jesus. Religious enthusiasm easily goes to seed. The human spirit so predominates the show-off, religious spirit. But we must stick to our text - Christ.




Like Chris said - what of all these Manifestation-men in the last 20-30 yr.s?
They out-number us Brother - just as Jesus said they would.
"The most" fall away from The Truth and "The few" follow, even unto death" for The Truth.
Just like HE did - "For this cause I came" He said.


We are out-numbered by the counterfeit phenomena followers and Jesus warned us to be very watchful of that - that "we not be deceived."


GOD Bless.

 2009/3/26 21:44
Earendel
Member



Joined: 2009/3/17
Posts: 308
Central Alberta, Canada

 Re:

Quote:

Jesus-is-GOD wrote:
I agree. We can't condemn anyone - but His Word [i]may.[/i]

As far as David Wilkerson goes, or even the lead article - I'm not quite sure where you see fault.

GOD Bless.



I'm really not trying to see fault brother, just wanting to clarify some things about the post(making sure things are clear on why it was posted, and about where my own stand is concerning gifts - not all believe in them and speak evil).

I just sensed a real judgmental spirit, something God has really been dealing with me about in my own life...something I need to make repentance of myself.

It's the same kind of judgmental spirit that the Pharisees were guilty of. ...Swallow a camel and stain at a gnat.

When God makes a judgement concerning anyone in His Body, it is always in love...and it is in that Spirit that I need to preach repentance, not in condemning, but in a Godly manner that will reach people with the true nature of the Gospel of Jesus Christ...which is John 3:16

Go ahead and preach against sin, but do it love, and avoid a religious spirit. Can we love humanity the way that God does, and try and see this with His eyes?

I offer my repentance Lord Jesus for being judgmental to others in regards to their sins, and I choose to obey in love in following the leading of the Holy Spirit in regards to preaching salvation.

Awhile back, I was dealing with a person who is a an unrepented trans-sexual who claimed to be a Christian. I preached repentance against this sin of course, but I offended the Spirit of God with my approach to this person, because I did not do it in love for this person's lost state. I did it in a judgmental (condemning) way preaching against sin. I broke God's heart with this and I need to apologize to this person when I get the chance and offer the Lord my repentance. Forgive me Lord Jesus, I will make amends and apologize to this person publicly if you allow me.


_________________
David

 2009/3/26 22:20Profile





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