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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Christmas trees in Jeremiahs days.

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ChrisJD
Member



Joined: 2006/2/11
Posts: 2895
Philadelphia PA

 Re:

Heartsong,

This isn't about me. Yes, my conscience is absolutely clear.

It is a problem though, because we are discussing these things in a public forum, with people we may know something about, and with others of whom we may know nothing.




Dear Heartsong, I'm not going to reply to the other questions that you asked me. I reaslise that there is a way to ask probing questions that are genuinely spiritual.


I also know, from experience, that the same things can be an empty wind and our own hot air.


_________________
Christopher Joel Dandrow

 2008/12/27 10:59Profile
HeartSong
Member



Joined: 2006/9/13
Posts: 3156


 Re:

Quote:
It is a problem though, because we are discussing these things in a public forum, with people we may know something about, and with others of whom we may know nothing.


This is precisely where I got tangled up before. If I worry about what others think, or how they will take what I am saying, and let that dictate my actions or words - then my relationship with those people is an idol.

If my words are put forth with no malice of heart, and I have confirmed this by bringing it before the Lord - then who are you to judge what I have said? for you do not know my heart - but my Father does, and it is to Him that I am accountable.

I love you Chris, but I just do not get what you are saying. It will take the Lord to reveal this to me, so if you see that I have things wrong, please pray for me - that I might see any truth that is being hidden from me - for it is my desire to be obedient unto my Lord and to dwell within His Light.

 2008/12/27 12:33Profile
theopenlife
Member



Joined: 2007/1/30
Posts: 926


 Re:

May I hang a painting in my home?

May I frame it, too?

If the painting becomes old, make I keep the frame alone?

May it be a pretty frame?

May I appreciate it for the beauty of the woodwork done, and glorify God for the sensation of pleasure He has attached to aesthetic taste?

May I bring in a carved log, for the same artistic reasons?

How carved must it be?

May I bring in an uncarved bough or limb of driftwood, simply because it is beautiful to me, and glorify the Lord for it as Adam praised God for Eve?

May I, like David, exalt God like for the natural world, and not have some of it in my house, too?

In the worship at the temple one would find golden cherubim, candlesticks, and life-sized bulls. These were made by God's ordering. A serpent on a stick was ordained by God, and was preserved until people began to worship it. The object which was to one generation a blessed pointer to God, was to another a false sense of hope, and a curse.

 2008/12/27 12:51Profile
ChrisJD
Member



Joined: 2006/2/11
Posts: 2895
Philadelphia PA

 Re:

Hi again Heartsong,


And thank you again for your response.


"If I worry about what others think, or how they will take what I am saying, and let that dictate my actions or words - then my relationship with those people is an idol."


I think I can understand how you feel, but I disagree. I think that we might even be able to come to a better understanding together about this by what you mentioned here.


In Paul's letter to the Corinthians, there was a situation where:


Some believers, because of the knowledge they had of the true God, were now convinced that idols were nothing, and that they could without any grief of conscience, eat food that had been dedicated to the idol, because they themselves and in their own hearts did not regard it as such. 1Corinthians 8:1-6.



Others, who were believers themselves, still held that there was something to these idols, and, if they eat something that had been sacrificed to them, would perhaps feel a prick of conscience for doing so. Even though the idol was nothing(v4), because they thought it was something, it was sin unto their conscience.


Now then, if two of these differnt believers were together in the same place, and the one who felt liberty to eat those things was seen doing so by the other, who did not, and that other knew that the first was himself a beleiver, then Paul says will he not be emboldened to do that which his own conscience is accusing him of being wrong, because he sees the other brother eating it(v10)?


And then he suggests that he may even perish(KJV) in doing this.


So Paul says God forbid that anyone should use their own liberty when it may cause another to stumble. He even says that doing so would be to sin against Christ(v12).


And then he says, in order to avoid ever doing such a thing, if his eating such meat would cause his brother to sin, that he would not eat meat so long as the earth was standing(v13)!


And this is why I disagree, that changing our behavior, or being careful what we say to other believers, is nescessarily making an idol out of our relationship with them.


No, I don't think it is at all. I think that this passage is suggesting to us, that our relationship to other believers is woven together with Christ. And that our treating them one way may be treating Him that way as well.



And in this case, I think that we should be carefull not to create an offense or sin in anothers heart, if God is not holding this thing against them.



I hope that my very weak explanation of these passages will be sufficient and will not cause any confusion for anyone. Please forgive me if what I have written is not clear or in error in anyway.


Wish you all well,

Chris


_________________
Christopher Joel Dandrow

 2008/12/27 15:59Profile





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