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MaryJane
Member



Joined: 2006/7/31
Posts: 3057


 Re:

Greetings Mr. Bill

I wanted to respond to your post asking why some people do not observe Christmas. Dear brother I am not sure if you meant your post to come off as funny but I must say that it did not. It came off as mocking and demeaning. Truthfully is there not a better way to have this discussion then to make fun of others. Perhaps this was not your heart in this matter but as some have said before we must be watchful of how we write and respond to one another. Many have stated that they feel strongly from Father that it is sin for them to take part in this holiday. Many have shared that after heart filled prayers they know that they are not to take part. It is not because they are jealous that you celebrate but because they love the Lord and want to obey Him. Just as I am sure that you do as well.

You also wrote that your family for generations has always celebrated Christmas and that you do not know any different. That is why you celebrate Christmas? That is interesting to me, see in my family there were other man made traditions that have gone on for generations, such as attending the Catholic church, but I don't follow in their traditions any longer. When Jesus opened my eyes and heart to His truth, those lies and traditions from the church died with self and I have been a new creation in Him since. Perhaps it is time for some of us to ask why it is we take part in the things that we do? Not trying to give any answers for anyone but I am asking why. The Bible has a lot to say about the traditions of men, shouldn't we be diligent to heed those warnings in our daily walking with Him. For me I long to hold on to my Lord and Saviour and not to traditions that I may have held for years as a child and into adulthood. There are many traditions, habits, and sins that Father is daily weeding out of my heart, and I pray as each days comes and goes that He will continue to do so and that I will have the ears to hear Him and the eyes to see His truth. That is why I am seeking Him and asking “Why is it that I am doing the things I am in December as well as every other day out of the year?”

Thank you for your consideration
God Bless you
MJ

 2008/12/18 11:32Profile









 Re: a reply to two Brothers in Christ

[b]Bill[/b]... calm down, brother. I appreciate your passion, but I fear you may be getting too personal with some of your statements.

[b]White_stone[/b]... you need to chill out too.

You said:

Quote:
It pains me to see you have to work so hard to justify your ManMade holiday. Especially to the length you go to use Scripture to do it.



That is a very judgemental attitude on display for the whole world to see. Since when does scripture mandate that sort of judgement among the brethren? You dont know me.

I laughed when I read that because it shows that you are agenda driven, and it doesnt matter what I say... you think you know what this is all about. You think I'm fighting so hard to justify something, as if giving gifts to my children was some great sin. As if singing Christmas Carols at the local retirement homes were some great sin. As if serving Christmas dinner at the Rescue Mission on Christmas afternoon were some great sin. That, sir, is generally the main thrust of our Christmas.

How foolish to condemn that.

But the fact is, if you read everything I've written concerning Christmas this year... I have not defended my position one bit. I have not tried to justify anything.

The clarion call I've put out is for brethren to come together and say "we may not agree on this issue, but I love you just the same."

[b]Bill[/b], you seem to be having a hard time grasping that. Who cares if some here dont celebrate Christmas? If thats their conviction, fine. I'm not here to convince them that they should.

[b]White_stone[/b], you're worse about this than Bill is. Time for a reality check... you're not a voice crying in the wilderness. You're not Elijah or John the Baptist. Of all the things to be spending your time doing I hardly think God has called you to condemn all Christians who celebrate Christmas.

What a despicable witness to the world at large.

I have not justified what I do for Christmas one bit. What I have done here is try to get both sides to see that there is grace and mercy to be had in this issue. Love is the issue with me, not some holiday. And there is a general lack of love in your most recent posts.

God has not called you to act with malice and judgement toward your brethren. If you think He has then prehaps it was the devil who whispered in your ear.

Just for the record... Spurgeon is not scripture.

This whole issue would be a joke if the dissention some of you are causing (on both sides) wasn't hellish to the core.

As for the other thread about Christmas memories... you are showing that your reading comprehension is severly lacking. You have not heart or soul if you read that thread and think we're just trying to stir up some "magical" feelings.

Krispy

 2008/12/18 12:19
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3228
Texas

 Re:

Quote:

MaryJane wrote:
Greetings Mr. Bill

Dear brother I am not sure if you meant your post to come off as funny but I must say that it did not.
Thank you for your consideration
God Bless you
MJ



Boy what is up with folks! I was about as sincere as I can possibly be in my post I "was not" trying to be funny, that really was personal slam I do not appreciate it much at all, trust me I do have a serious side, but when you can't even ask a question here in all sincerity and you get these off the wall slams I guess it's best I bow out of this miserable thread.
God Bless
Mr. Bill


_________________
Mr. Bill

 2008/12/18 12:22Profile
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3228
Texas

 Re:

Quote:

KrispyKrittr wrote:
Bill... calm down, brother. I appreciate your passion, but I fear you may be getting too personal with some of your statements.

Krispy



Don't worry I will not post on this thread again. :-(


_________________
Mr. Bill

 2008/12/18 12:24Profile
HeartSong
Member



Joined: 2006/9/13
Posts: 3156


 Re:

Krispy, you may not realize it, but you just keep fanning the flames . . .


I really wish someone would lock these treads. They are not edifying to anyone and only serve to degrade the name of our Lord, and Saviour, Jesus Christ. :-(

 2008/12/18 12:38Profile
MaryJane
Member



Joined: 2006/7/31
Posts: 3057


 Re:

Dear brother

I was not trying to slam you.I wrote and asked if you were trying to be funny because I did not want to presume anything about your post or the intention of your post. Perhaps if you feel led to read over what you posted you might see that to someone who does not celebrate Christmas your words sounded mocking. It is difficult to know ones heart from a post on pubic forums so I caution myself and all of us to use care with what we type. Brother I hope you have a good day and that all of our focus would be centered on Him at this time and every day. I have no ill feelings for you or anyone else so please do not think that. I hope you will receive this in the heart it is being written.

God Bless you
MJ

 2008/12/18 12:40Profile
MaryJane
Member



Joined: 2006/7/31
Posts: 3057


 Re:

Greetings

If any of my post have caused anyone to stumble or sin then please forgive me. I do not want to do anything to bring shame to the name of my Lord. I just want to say that I love you all and pray that Father would show each of us what His heart is and that we will walk in that.

God Bless you brothers and sisters
MJ

 2008/12/18 12:47Profile









 Re:

Quote:
Krispy, you may not realize it, but you just keep fanning the flames . . .



No no... I'm not going to accept the blame for this. I have consistantly tried to bring both sides together under the banner of 1) understanding, 2) love & 3) mercy. Thats been my message. You will not find one post I've made where I have mocked anyone, accused anyone, or even tried to convince anyone that they are wrong.

And even in the midst of this currect uprising of stirred up passion... my message is the same... stop judging each other!

So no, don't point the finger at me. I know I am an easy target and not well liked by some here, but try to resist the urge.

It's become so rediculous on this forum that I've received a couple of PM's from people wanting to share their Christmas memories on the other thread... but won't for fear of getting attacked by certain individuals. What a pathetic shame and disgusting witness.

I am not upset over the annual Christmas debate. Not at all. But I am shocked and discouraged and ashamed of the way people who call themselves serious believers in Christ treat each other. Some of you have murder in your hearts and you dont even realize it. (Thats not aimed at you MJ)

Krispy

 2008/12/18 12:57
crsschk
Member



Joined: 2003/6/11
Posts: 9192
Santa Clara, CA

 Re:

Quote:
To have a thread dedicated to Christmas Memories only serves to lift up the holiday in peoples minds and hearts, making it have a 'magical' importance it has not been given by God.



Contrasted with ...

Quote:
See she had gotten saved before me. We both lived very sinful lives when we met. We lived together and then got married. Just after I came back from Desert Storm she got saved. She had been attending this church while I was gone. While I loved her tremendously, I ridiculed her faith and critisized the church at every change I had. But after much prayer on her part (and long suffering), and the influence and witness of several others, I finally surrendered to the Lord.

I just kinda looked at her wiping back tears. She said "This time last year I was here by myself. I prayed that this year you would be here beside me... and you are. Thats' the best Christmas present I could ever hope for."



I grieve for you sister, seriously. What sort of spirit is it that can be this disconcerted, this cruel, this ... heartless? It's way over the top.

This is yet another thread destined to be locked. I am about to say some things generally that will likely not sit very well with some but must be stated ...

There are many misunderstandings. There is much that is brought in like baggage and casually thrown on the floor of this setting from those newer to this whole surrounding. There is a rudeness of character and conduct, and great sweeping presumptions ...

Over the course of 5 some odd years here we have these uprisings, these seasons where things begin getting out of control. Newer members are welcomed and the odd thought that those trying to moderate matters have some mandate other than to keep things cordial is just as presumptuous and ridiculous.

Does all this apply here? Not necessarily and this may become something of a redundant rant elsewhere. We have been locking posts left and right for some time now and I am hard pressed to recall it ever getting such extremes.

This site is rich in depth and heart searching matters yet we continue to see this sort of divisive sparring, contention, ill-will - personal assaults and attacks - Disregard for some very simple and common place attitudes expressed as guidelines to the benefit of everyone.

The striking thing, the overt, is what is [i]overlooked[/i], not the gears of the mechanism, the topics or discussion at hand.

Dear Brethren, [i]these things ought not to be.[/i].

It is pride. It is presumption. It is harsh, brash, obstinate attitudes. It is down right rude. Defending ourselves when we ought to be pitying them - Boasting when we ought to be humiliated.

I have failed. I have been caught up in it attempting to mitigate it. Do these things not get under our skin? Get something stirred up within us. It's all very, very grievous ...

Whitestone, you were perfectly clear and I have no animosity. My only note was in the odd way that you setup the comment with preconditions - Show me in scripture, just don't use ... these scriptures?

I read Charles Surgeon's notes there as well. I also have been siting on one of his ... Christmas sermons for Dec. 25th of this year. Suffice it to say, this is not all he had to say on the matter over his long history, and to draw a comparison so it is with many things here on SermonIndex.


_________________
Mike Balog

 2008/12/18 22:45Profile
TroyorTakoda
Member



Joined: 2008/12/13
Posts: 46


 Re: Christmas

Since when has celebrating Christ been a pagan practice? And since when do we take the word of men over the Word of God?

Again ...

Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of a feast day or a new moon or a sabbath day

The kingdom of God does not lie in the observance of outward things, but in internal ones, in righteousness and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.

If someone says to me that they don't celebrate a day called "Christmas" but rather they celebrate Jesus every day of the year, I have absolutely no problem with that. I will go on celebrating Christmas on December 25th, and I will go on loving my brother who does not celebrate that day.

Romans 14:1 says Accept him whose faith is weak, without passing judgment on disputable matters and James 4:11 says Speak not one against another, brethren.

and that is all I have to say.


_________________
Troy A Lasseigne

 2008/12/19 1:25Profile





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