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repentcanada
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Joined: 2005/5/9
Posts: 659


 Is this statement True or False and why?

GOD doesn't change HIS mind because HE already knows the future. Prayer doesn't change things, prayer changes people. If it changed 'things' it would be changing GOD who knows all things. We don't change GOD, HE changes us!

 2008/12/1 2:24Profile
enid
Member



Joined: 2006/5/22
Posts: 2667
Nottingham, England

 Re: Is this statement True or False and why?

I can see where this is heading, but I'll try to avoid it.

Acts 15v18, 'Known to God from eternity are all His works.

It also tells us in Isaiah 46v10 that God knows the end from the beginning, and from ancient times things that are not yet done.

Jonah 3 tells of the people of Nineveh fasting and repenting, and verse 10 says, 'Then God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way, and God relented from the disaster that He said He would bring upon them, and He did not do it.'

Malachi 3v6 says God does not change.

So a point blank true of false to that statement isn't so available.

Just food for thought.

 2008/12/1 3:20Profile
psalm1
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Joined: 2007/1/30
Posts: 1230


 Re: Is this statement True or False and why?

When the apostles penned the apostles creed.They were establishing what they could and couldn't say.

If God operated in his foreknowledge most everything would be pointless. Most every statement pointless.
I am thankful God operates in the present.
This is why God DOES NOT intervene in most circumstances. He allows things to unfold.
Otherwise everything would be robotic.

The problem with those statements you are asking about is; if I find one objection then they are false.

Didn'T moses stay the hand of God?

 2008/12/1 10:38Profile
PaulWest
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Joined: 2006/6/28
Posts: 3405
Dallas, Texas

 Re:

Quote:
When the apostles penned the apostles creed


The apostles did not pen the Apostles' Creed.


_________________
Paul Frederick West

 2008/12/1 10:51Profile
MrBillPro
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Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3283
Texas

 Re: Is this statement True or False and why?

Quote:

repentcanada wrote:
Prayer doesn't change things, prayer changes people. If it changed 'things' it would be changing GOD who knows all things. We don't change GOD, HE changes us!



Well the Bible does say prayer changes things, well this is the way I understand this scripture anyway,I could be wrong but there a first time for everything.:-P James 5:16 says, "The effectual, fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much.


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Bill

 2008/12/1 13:55Profile
boG
Member



Joined: 2008/5/21
Posts: 349
Las Vegas, NV

 Re: Is this statement True or False and why?

I would say the most important thing to remember is that God is both Just and Merciful. When we read anytime that God relented from sending sudden destruction; we shall also find the people repented from their wicked ways or that God raised up a man, a mediator, to stand in the gap between the living and the dead so that the people should not be utterly consumed. This is not a change, this is according to the eternal promise of God.

[b]Ezekiel 22
29.[/b] "The people of the land have practiced oppression and committed robbery, and they have wronged the poor and needy and have oppressed the sojourner without justice.
[b]30.[/b] "I searched for a man among them who would build up the wall and stand in the gap before Me for the land, so that I would not destroy it; but I found no one.
[b]31.[/b] "Thus I have poured out My indignation on them; I have consumed them with the fire of My wrath; their way I have brought upon their heads," declares the Lord GOD.

[b]Numbers 16
44.[/b] and the LORD spoke to Moses, saying,
[b]45.[/b] "Get away from among this congregation, that I may consume them instantly." Then they fell on their faces.
[b]46.[/b] Moses said to Aaron, "Take your censer and put in it fire from the altar, and lay incense on it; then bring it quickly to the congregation and make atonement for them, for wrath has gone forth from the LORD, the plague has begun!"
[b]47.[/b] Then Aaron took it as Moses had spoken, and ran into the midst of the assembly, for behold, the plague had begun among the people. So he put on the incense and made atonement for the people.
[b]48.[/b] He took his stand between the dead and the living, so that the plague was checked.
[b]49.[/b] But those who died by the plague were 14,700, besides those who died on account of Korah.
[b]50.[/b] Then Aaron returned to Moses at the doorway of the tent of meeting, for the plague had been checked.

God never "changes"; He only acts just as He has promised He always will.


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Jordan

 2008/12/1 15:50Profile









 Re:

boG beat me to it... The Bible clearly states that God repented in regards to planning the destruction of Israel in the desert due to their disobedience and rebellion. "Repent" in this context very simply means He "changed His mind". Moses' petition to God is what changed His mind.

The original post of this thread is clearly [b]false[/b].

God is sovereign... which means if He wants to change His mind, He can! The problem with hyper Calvinism is that it is man trying to understand the mind of God with man's mind, and it's impossible.

Krispy

 2008/12/1 15:56
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3283
Texas

 Re:

Quote:

KrispyKrittr wrote:
God is sovereign... which means if He wants to change His mind, He can! The problem with hyper Calvinism is that it is man trying to understand the mind of God with man's mind, and it's impossible.Krispy



Awesome post Brother! As one here that also believes God can do what he wants I can relate. I find it very hard to believe the one who made "everything happen" is limited, of course this is only my opinion.


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Bill

 2008/12/1 16:05Profile
boG
Member



Joined: 2008/5/21
Posts: 349
Las Vegas, NV

 Re: Is this statement True or False and why?

Quote:
boG beat me to it...


:-P sorry!

Quote:
The Bible clearly states that God repented in regards to planning the destruction of Israel in the desert due to their disobedience and rebellion. "Repent" in this context very simply means He "changed His mind". Moses' petition to God is what changed His mind.

The original post of this thread is clearly false.

God is sovereign... which means if He wants to change His mind, He can! The problem with hyper Calvinism is that it is man trying to understand the mind of God with man's mind, and it's impossible.



I don't think "changed His mind" is a clear way of understanding God's dealing with His creatures. If we should say God can do whatever He wants because He is God! Well, that is not necessarily true. God cannot lie, it is impossible for Him. God is just therefore He cannot be unjust. God is likewise merciful therefore He cannot be unmerciful; yet, even such that His mercy is also a just-mercy. So there in no contradiction if we say
[b]James 2
13.[/b] For judgment will be merciless to one who has shown no mercy; mercy triumphs over judgment.

For it would be unjust for God to be merciful to those who shall be cast into the lake of fire. Thus, God's holy attributes of lovingkindess and mercy shall be of no benefit to them; all that shall remain for them is the overwhelming, omnipotent presence of God, who is a consuming fire, and He shall mock them in their distress.

How then would I describe the verse which reveals "mercy triumphs over judgment"? Does this mean Mercy is greater than Judgment? No, these are both equal in God. God is merciful and just: these attributes cannot be greater or less than the other without corrupting perfection. Therefore they are each of infinite, maximum potentcy. The reason God's mercy may triumph over judgment is because, as I mentioned, His mercy fulfills His justice; as Christ did not come to abolish the law, or set it aside, but to fulfill the law.


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Jordan

 2008/12/1 16:42Profile
rbanks
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Joined: 2008/6/19
Posts: 1257


 Re:

Let's just say that the earth since Adam is around 6000 years old. The bible says that God planned redemption in Christ before the foundation of the world and predesignated those He foreknew. Ok, for 6000 years people have been born on this earth living out their time here. All have sinned that are born on the earth.

Now keep in mind that God has already elected those He foreknew and they included Abraham, Noah, Moses, David, Peter, Mark, and you and me that have been born again. We have all sinned and made mistakes since we got saved but God still worked in our life according to His plan. Our little minds can not comprehend all of this. We don't understand how God can know everything before it happens and still let his people make mistakes but He does. We don't understand how He can work with us humans on our level and yet be so much above us. We know he does not keep us from making mistakes because none of us is perfect.

He wants us to make the right choices but He stands by and let's us make them whether right or wrong. We can pray and ask God for wisdom or we can just decide with out praying. He works with us desiring us to see that we need to acknowledge him in all our ways and He will direct our paths. It truly pleases Him when we seek Him and trust Him to lead and direct our lives. We know that God cannot sin, but He will let us sin, until we trust and obey Him, who is able to keep us from sinning.

I also believe that his elect do make mistakes but are kept by his grace from completely falling away from Him. We are not able to keep ourselves but only through the grace of God are we kept from being lost in sin.

 2008/12/1 16:50Profile





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