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flameoffire
Member



Joined: 2008/1/3
Posts: 189
Michigan

 Re:

Many of the arguments or debates on these type of threads upset me. It seems that the impersonal setting encourages people to argue. At any rate I believe that we all have a flesh that will not be redeemed and pure until death. However, I believe God can and does purify hearts according to James 4:8-10 and other verses. Ravenhill also believed this and has a number of sermons about acquiring a pure heart. I understand Paul West's concern over certain Charismatic/Pentecostal customs, and I agree that the presence of spiritual gifts will speak for itself. People shouldn't go around spouting about their gift of prophecy etc. I would say this not necessarily because we all have impure hearts, but rather because we all have sinned and fallen short and the gifts and callings of God do not make us more or less holy. A pastor is not necessarily any holier than anyone else just because of their calling. Anyway, my hope is to kind of bridge the debate so to speak. I understand where both sides are coming from, but I believe that inside I can be holy and pure despite fleshly desires which will always be impure until the redemption of this body (1 Corinthians 15).

I speak in tongues. I was raised charismatic, but I fell away. When I was born again I didn't want to rely on my parent's faith so I tested everything. I didn't try to speak in tongues. I told God that if it was real than I really wanted it. One day I was walking and praying to God under my breath. The presence of God was thick and I realized I was speaking in tongues. I stopped out of surprise (I was in public) but God told me that he gave me the gift and it bubbled out of me under my breath along with a holy joy. I agree with the previous post that I don't turn the gift on and off like a faucet but that God stirs it up in me, but I also stir it up on occasion.


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Jonathan

 2008/11/29 16:35Profile
flameoffire
Member



Joined: 2008/1/3
Posts: 189
Michigan

 Re:

erm, sorry I dont know how but it seems I posted twice...


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Jonathan

 2008/11/29 16:36Profile
int3grity
Member



Joined: 2008/10/24
Posts: 76


 Re:

1Cor 14:2 - for anyone who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to GOD. V4 - he who speaks in a tongue edifies himself...

If this is true it appears the gift of toungues builds us up and brings closer communion with GOD. I want this gift. I have seen so much phonyness and abuse of tongues that I have been tempted to become a hard cessationist but I won't let that experience cause me to throw the baby out with the bath water. Some of the dearest and most Biblically sound Saints I know have this gift. I don't think it is to be a public thing(without an interpreter) but rather a private prayer language.

I don't believe GOD gives this gift to all believers (Paul asks, "do all speak in tongues?") But I would love to have it so long as it wouldn't puff me up with pride or cause me to look down on brothers and sisters in CHRIST who don't have it.


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Ryan

 2008/11/29 17:15Profile
Lysa
Member



Joined: 2008/10/25
Posts: 3393
East TN (for now)

 Re:

Quote:

murrcolr wrote:
Thanks for your answer.

Do I love God with all my heart, do I love people like I love myself. Do I have any bitterness, am I slow to anger like God is slow to anger. Do I have any pride, do I forget about an evil done or do I hold a grudge.

The fruits of the spirit or pretending to have the fruits of the spirit, trying to be Godly in my own strengh or truly being Godly. Having a form of Godliness but deny God's power.

Can God do more for this sinful man than just justify me or do I have to wait until death until I am free from this sinful nature. Can death be my deliverer?

Who then can set me free from this inclination to sin?

These are some of the questions I have in my head. But for the time being I would like to know about anyone on here who talks in tounges or as you prefer prays in tounges.



Colin,

I'm sorry. I did not mean to disillusion you; but I misintrepreted your one sentence question... I was wrong to post like I did. Please forgive me.

I sent you a private message as well.

Quote:
Can God do more for this sinful man than just justify me or do I have to wait until death until I am free from this sinful nature. Can death be my deliverer?



God can do WAY more for us than we can ask or think!! And we do NOT have to wait until death to be free. Read the Word even more and radically believe it and apply it! And pray in the Spirit! Your testimony is awesome!

He loves you.


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Lisa

 2008/11/29 17:30Profile
AbideinHim
Member



Joined: 2006/11/26
Posts: 3463
Louisiana

 Re:

I was saved in the early 70's by going to some Catholic Charismatic prayer meetings and hearing the gospel preached. I learned about the Baptism of the Holy Spirit through these Spirit filled believers and I began to seek the Lord for this Baptism. I cannot tell you exactly when I was baptized in the Spirit, because early on in my Christian life, all that I wanted to do was to sit in God's presence, pray, and read His Word. One day I was sitting on my front porch, praying and praising God, and I began to praise God in an unknown tongue.

I became involved in Full Gospel Buisnessmen's meetings and was introduced to faith teachings. After about 10 years of being involved with the Word of Faith movement I became very disilushioned. My eyes were being opened more and more to many of the unscriptural teachings within the movement. We left the Word of Faith Church that we were in, and I began to get more immersed into books by Nee, Murray, Tozer, and later Sparks. The reason why I became involved in these forums is because there are many brothers and sisters here that love God and desire to walk a clean and sanctified life, which is also my desire. I knew that the Lord was calling me deeper, and I began to immerse myself in the truths of the cross, which I had never got in the Word of Faith Church that I had attended.

I can see why the devil causes all of this uproar and confusion about tongues, because this gift is precious, as are all of the Lord's gifts.

Tongues, prophesy, laying on of hands, and the casting out of demons have all been abused and misused in many Charismatic Churches and meetings, and the enemy loves this because it brings discredit to that which the Lord is wanting to do in the Church through the gifts. God only gives good gifts, and the gifts of the Spirit are of great benefit to the Church when used in the proper way.

Jesus Christ should always have the pre-eminence in the Church, and when gifts or manifestations are made to be the main emphasis, then that is when the problems begin, and the enemy will certainly come in with his counterfeit.

All of the gifts operate by the love of God, and the gifts are to build up the Body of Christ. Praying in tongues is the one gift that a believer can exercise and build himself up in his most holy faith.

Praying in the Spirit is used by the Holy Spirit in intercessory prayer, because many times we do not know how to pray as we ought to.

There has been much harm done by some Pentecostal groups teaching that you have to be baptized in the Holy Spirit and speak in tongues in order to be saved. I am still looking for that scripture.

The main thing that the Lord is after in our lives is that His own nature is being formed in us, and if I had the choice of having the gifts or the fruit of the Spirit, I would choose the fruit. But praise God that we don't have to pick and choose, when we can have both the fruit and the gifts.

Mike


_________________
Mike

 2008/11/29 18:25Profile
trxx
Member



Joined: 2006/1/27
Posts: 85
ON Canada

 Re:

re "Many of the arguments or debates on these type of threads upset me."

I have to agree with you on this. I steer away from the forums for the lack of edification in it. I tell lots of people about the good things that are available through SermonIndex but usually add to beware of the forums, discernment would be necessary. It does seem to digress into lesser things at times. But there are the times that truth and encouragement are found so I haven't completely given up.
As for the issue of tongues, its easy to agree that it is a gift given by the Holy Spirit as He chooses for the edification of the believer and the body, if there is an interpretation. My experience also includes that there is much flesh involved as well in the body of believers when it comes to this particular gift. It is good to seek the gift, and especially the greater gifts but remember to always seek the Giver and not to get too caught up in seeking the gift. The gift is not necessary for salvation. God uses both those that have the gift as well as those that do not.
There are the two extremes concerning the gift of tongues. Some would suggest that the gift is the evidence of the baptism of the Holy Spirt and therefore necessary to salvation even though not all would go so far as to say necessary for salvation. Then others would suggest that the gifts were only necessary for the beginning of the Church and as such are no longer needed or in evidence. Both views I would disagree with. The truth I believe would be somewhere in the middle as it often is when it comes to most of the things which we tend to debate as theological issues. In my best determination Scripture teaches that the gift exists even for today but that it is not for everyione though we are encouraged to seek after the gifts. But our priorities need to be in line; seek God first and not what He can offer us. Do not be dismayed if your brother or sister should speak in tongues and you do not. Pray and ask for the gift but leave it with the Holy Spirit to give as He wills. I know many who share the gift of tongues, some sought the gift and others did not including a dear little old white-haired lady who does not make much ado about it in the church because most in that particular denomination don't ever expect to speak in tongues. I have also known the other extreme where many spoke in tongues and some interpreted but I found sometimes that the message was inconsistent with the teachings of Scripture, more flesh than Holy Spirit.
For the record, I do not speak in tongues. I have asked for the gift according to the Scriptures. I do believe that the Lord has gifted me in other gifts.
Satan would try to distract us in two ways. He would try to make us think that without the gift of tongues we are useless or with the gift that we are better than others, a spiritual pride. Then he would have us to lose our focus, to take our eyes off of Jesus, to seek the experience rather than the Gift Giver. He would also have us to argue amongst ourselves so as to remove all potential for unity. He seems to do preety well with this one, getting us to argue amongst ourselves.
God will lead all into truth whose heart is set upon Him. That truth may or may not include the gift of tongues.


_________________
Bruce

 2008/11/29 22:20Profile
MJones
Member



Joined: 2008/10/31
Posts: 320
Missouri

 Re:

Since I hand-write my prayers, this may explain why I have trouble reading some of what I have written.


_________________
Mike Jones

 2008/11/30 13:39Profile
PaulWest
Member



Joined: 2006/6/28
Posts: 3405
Dallas, Texas

 Re:

Quote:
Is this my destiny to feel useless and unworthy all my life



John Newton confessed one thing: that he was great sinner and Christ was a great Savior.

He also said this:


[i]"...our holiness does not consist in great attainments--but in spiritual desires, in hungerings, thirstings, and mournings; in humiliation of heart, poverty of spirit, submission, and meekness; in hearty admiring thoughts of Jesus, and dependence upon Him alone for all we need. Indeed these may be said to be great attainments; but they who have most of them are most sensible that they, in and of themselves, are nothing, have nothing, can do nothing--and see daily cause for abhorring themselves and repenting in dust and ashes!"[/i]

- John Newton


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Paul Frederick West

 2008/11/30 14:08Profile









 Re: Who on Sermon Index speaks in Tounges

In answer to the original question, yes, I speak in tongues. God bless, John

 2008/11/30 14:54









 Re:

1Th 5:23 ¶ And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

 2008/11/30 14:59





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