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 Slain in the Spirit

This has not been discussed in some time, and I was wondering what y'alls take is on the idea of being "slain in the Spirit".

Krispy

 2008/11/20 8:44
savannah
Member



Joined: 2008/10/30
Posts: 2009


 Re: Slain in the Spirit

Slain: Past participle of slay

Slay: transitive verb 1: to kill violently, wantonly, or in great numbers ; broadly : to strike down: kill

intransitive verb: kill, murder

synonyms see kill

Those who are in rebellion to God seem to fall backward in Scripture as a sign of judgment.


The Holy Spirit does not "slay" a believer; He gives life.

Rom 8:11 If the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, he who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit who dwells in you.

From an article by Tony Warren,

"Shakti Pat or Divine Touch Robert Walker described what takes place in Kundalini yoga: 'Few Christians realise that for thousands of years gurus have operated with gifts of healing, miracles, gifts of knowledge, and intense displays of spiritual consciousness as they stretch out and connect with a cosmic power which, though demonic in origin, is very real. The meetings which mystic Hindu gurus hold are called 'Darshan'. At these meetings devotees go forward to receive spiritual experience from a touch by the open palm of the hand, often to the forehead, by the guru in what is known as the Shakti Pat or divine touch. The raising of the spiritual experience is called raising Kundalini. The practice is quite intricate but is brought on by Shakti Pat in conjunction with the repetition of mantras or religious phrases and by holding physical positions for a long time. After a period when the devotee has reached a certain spiritual elevation they begin to shake, jerk, or hop or squirm uncontrollably, sometimes breaking into uncontrolled animal noises or laughter as they reach an ecstatic high. These manifestations are called 'Kriyas'. Devotees sometimes roar like lions and show all kinds of physical signs during this period. Often devotees move on to higher states of spiritual consciousness and become inert physically and appear to slip into an unconsciousness when they lose sense of what is happening around them. This state is called 'samadhi' and it leads to a deeper spiritual experience.'

This phenomenon is usually declared to be the product of the act of 'laying on of hands,' which is the belief that a person receives the Holy Spirit of anointing when this is done. The subsequent falling down backward is defined as the physical response to the strong power of the Holy Spirit coming upon these people.

These curious events are known by many different names, including, 'falling down backwards, falling out, drunk in the Spirit, sleep in the Spirit, going down, slain in the Spirit, overcome by the Spirit, resting in the Spirit, and the sleep blessing..'

As best we can tell, Maria Beulah Woodworth-Etter, a woman who preached in the holiness movement of the 1880’s, started this practice by falling out in her popular services of the time. She would often go into a trance-like state and fall down during her performances. She died in 1924, but her legacy of falling down backward in Church services has lived on. In modern times, it was brought back to great popularity by people in great numbers falling down in a small church in Toronto Canada. From this resurgence, many have also labled this, The Toronto Blessing,' where it is mixed with what is termed holy laughter."


Two false prophets of their own have this to say on the issue and related issues,


"There's nothing in Scripture that supports these kinds of phenomena that I can see, and I can't think of anything throughout the church age that would,' Wimber writes. 'So I feel no obligation to try to explain it. It's just phenomena. It's just people responding to God.'"

"There is no place in the Bible where people were lined up and Jesus or Paul or anyone else went along and tapped them on the head and watched them go down, one after another, and somebody else ran along behind. Can you picture Peter and James -- "Hold it, hold it, hold it!" -- running along behind trying to catch them? And so the model that we're seeing, either on stage or on television, is totally different from anything that's in Scripture." (John Wimber, "Spiritual Phenomena: Slain In The Spirit -- Part 1," Vineyard Christian Felllowship, Anaheim, CA, 1981, audiotape)

"You have so much today that is pure flesh, yet people have labeled it as the Spirit. It's not the Spirit, because it's not centered on Christ. It's pure emotionalism. Some of what is happening today, some of these manifestations where people are barking, making sounds of animals - I can tell you, that is not the Holy Spirit. It is purely demonic. The Holy Ghost does not bark. Only a devil barks. If somebody barks in my meeting, I'll cast the devil out of that man."

"You watching TBN here. If you're doing such nonsense, get back to the Bible. And don't you dare experiment with what is not Scriptural, checking out if God is in it. My brother, if it's not in the Bible, He's not in it!! If it's not in the Word of God, He is not in it. (Benny Hinn Condemns Toronto Blessing/Pensacola Phenomena Praise The Lord July 4, 1997 videotape transcript)

Noteworthy it is that one fruit of the Spirit is self-control.

Apparently,and from the testimony of those who have experienced this spiritism of sorts,there is no self-control but rather the lack thereof.

1 Timothy 4:1

"Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;"

1 Thessalonians 5:21

"Prove all things; hold fast that which is good." Amen!

I am in agreement with the Spirit and the Word that such is not the work of the Holy Spirit but another.

Any who are favorable to these teachings/practices ought to be directed to His Word 2 Tim. 3:16:

Every Scripture is inspired by God and is useful for teaching, for convincing, for correction of error, and for instruction in right doing; (WNT)

All scripture that was written by the Spirit, is profitable for instruction, and for confutation, and for correction, and for erudition in righteousness; (James Murdoch N.T.)

For the whole Scripture is giuen by inspiration of God, and is profitable to teache, to conuince, to correct, and to instruct in righteousnesse, (Geneva Bible)

Any who teach/do such things ought to be rebuked sharply and marked out as false teachers and false brethren.

 2008/11/20 10:36Profile
Joshh
Member



Joined: 2008/8/26
Posts: 62


 Re:

Truly being slain in the Spirit is very rare. Although what you see on TV is over 99% of the time going on because the person before them in line fell.

 2008/11/20 12:43Profile
narrowpath
Member



Joined: 2005/1/9
Posts: 1067
Germany NRW

 Re:

What I have seen of people being slain in the Spirit was flesh at best if not demonic. In the last 3 meetings where this phenonomen occured I felt an oppressive spirit hovering over the assembly. I left these meetings to avoid "contamination" and in great anger. I warned those which I met there that I believe it is not of the Spirit. People reacted with bewiderment; one got mad at me. It is strange. You look into the face of a fellow Christian and see yourself in completely opposite camps. It is a delusion for those who do not walk with God and do not normally have close fellowship with Him. God the allows the devil to cater for their fleshly desire for an experience.

I believe that there is a place for it when people are falling forward on their faces in conviction as seen in previous revivals or they are knocked down by God because they are raving against Him like Saul bevore he became Paul. The only other example I can think of is Annanias and Saphira.

 2008/11/20 13:13Profile









 Re:

So what are we to make of folks who seemingly walk with the Lord, are believers in the Word of God... and yet participate in this?

You said...

Quote:
It is a delusion for those who do not walk with God and do not normally have close fellowship with Him.



...but I'm not sure we can make such a blanket statement like that. Granted, I dont know another's heart, but I have known people who I am convinced are born-again and walking with the Lord who go for this sort of thing.

So what do we do this? What about serious Christians who believe and participate in this sort of thing? I believe completely that it is unscriptural... but is it spiritually detrimental?

When I was in Charismania I had no problem with it. Once we left I had a real problem with it, and for the last few years it's been completely off my radar. But now I'm revisiting this issue, and I'm not sure what to make of it now.

Krispy

 2008/11/20 13:20
AbideinHim
Member



Joined: 2006/11/26
Posts: 3499
Louisiana

 Re: Slain in the Spirit

There are instances of being slain in the Spirit or falling under the power in the Word of God as well as in revival history. Greg Gordon has an article on Sermon Index on the subject.

Probably, if you are Charismatic you have experienced or witnessed the falling under the power many times, and if you are not from a Charismatic background you might have a less favorable opinion of it.

I have both seen and experienced what I believe to be true manifestations of falling under the power, in which the person was overcome by the power and presence of God, as well as much flesh, and even what I would consider demonic manifestations. So again, discernment is needed. People greatly err that claim that all falling under the power is a work of the Holy Spirit, or the opposite extreme is also true, that it is always the flesh or the devil.

This is a quote from Jonathan Edwards on bodily manifestations:

"A work [of God] is not to be judged of by any effects on the bodies of
men; such as tears, trembling, groans, loud outcries, agonies of body,
or the failing of bodily strength. . . . We cannot conclude that persons
are under the influence of the true Spirit because we see such effects
upon their bodies, because this is not given as a mark of the true
Spirit; nor on the other hand, have we any reason to conclude, from any
such outward appearances, that persons are not under the influence of
the Spirit of God because there is no rule of Scripture given us to
judge of spirits by, that does either expressly or indirectly exclude
such effects on the body, nor does reason exclude them. . . . It is not
at all strange that God should sometimes give his saints such foretastes
of heaven as to diminish their bodily strength. . . . Indeed all such
objections from effects on the body, let them be greater or less, seem
to be exceeding frivolous; they who argue thence, proceed in the dark;
they know not what ground they go upon, nor by what rule they judge."
.


_________________
Mike

 2008/11/20 14:54Profile









 Re:

Quote:
there is no rule of Scripture given us to judge of spirits by, that does either expressly or indirectly exclude such effects on the body, nor does reason exclude them. . .



So if we are to believe this, then should we also say that the Word of God is not the final authority on all matters pertaining to faith and practice?

Krispy

 2008/11/20 15:09
AbideinHim
Member



Joined: 2006/11/26
Posts: 3499
Louisiana

 Re:

The Scripture Verses

Here are the main verses from Scripture showing people falling to the ground whenever God would manifest His presence to different people. The first verse is from the Original King James Version of the Bible, the rest are from the New King James Version.

"... that then the house was filled with a cloud, even the house of the Lord; so that the priests could not stand to minister by reason of the cloud; for the glory of the Lord had filled the house of God." (2 Chronicles 5:14)

Jesus said to them, "I am He." And Judas, who betrayed Him, also stood with them. Then when He said to them. "I am He," - they drew back and fell to the ground." (John 18:6)

"And when I saw Him, I fell at His feet as dead. But He laid His right hand on me, saying to me, "Do not be afraid; I am the First and the Last." (Revelation 1:17)

"And when the disciples heard it, they fell on their faces and were greatly afraid." But Jesus came and touched them and said, "Arise, and do not be afraid." (Matthew 17:6)

"And as he journeyed he came near Damascus, and suddenly a light shone around him from heaven. Then he fell to the ground, and heard a voice saying to him, "Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me?" (Acts 9:3-4)

"So I arose and went out into the plain, and behold, the glory of the Lord stood there, like the glory which I saw by the River Chebar; and I fell on my face." (Ezekiel 3:23)

"Then the Lord opened Balaam’s eyes, and he saw the Angel of the Lord standing in the way with His drawn sword in His hand; and he bowed his head and fell flat on his face." (Numbers 22:31)

"And behold, the glory of the God of Israel came from the way of the east. His voice was like the sound of many waters; and the earth shone with His glory. It was like the appearance of the vision which I saw - like the vision which I saw when I came to destroy the city. The visions were like the vision which I saw by the River Chebar; and I fell on my face." (Ezekiel 43:2-3)

"Then He brought me by way of the north gate to the front of the temple; so I looked, and behold, the glory of the Lord filled the house of the Lord; and I fell on my face." (Ezekiel 44:4)


_________________
Mike

 2008/11/20 15:24Profile









 Re:

These verses do not describe what we're seeing today in the "slain in the spirit" phenom.

Quote:
"... that then the house was filled with a cloud, even the house of the Lord; so that the priests could not stand to minister by reason of the cloud; for the glory of the Lord had filled the house of God." (2 Chronicles 5:14)



I admit… I’m not clear on this one. I’ll have to look into it.

Quote:
Jesus said to them, "I am He." And Judas, who betrayed Him, also stood with them. Then when He said to them. "I am He," - they drew back and fell to the ground." (John 18:6)



Here it was unregenerate people who fell… not believers. Apples to oranges.

Quote:
"And when I saw Him, I fell at His feet as dead. But He laid His right hand on me, saying to me, "Do not be afraid; I am the First and the Last." (Revelation 1:17)



Here John was in control of himself, which is evident by the fact that Jesus put His right hand on him and said “Do not be afraid…”. John fell to the ground in fear, not by the power of the Holy Spirit. Apples to oranges.

Quote:
"And when the disciples heard it, they fell on their faces and were greatly afraid." But Jesus came and touched them and said, "Arise, and do not be afraid." (Matthew 17:6)



Why did they fall (on their faces, by the way)? Because they were afraid. And what did Jesus say? “Arise!” Apples to oranges.

Quote:
"And as he journeyed he came near Damascus, and suddenly a light shone around him from heaven. Then he fell to the ground, and heard a voice saying to him, "Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me?" (Acts 9:3-4)



At this point in time Saul was an unregenerate man. Apple to oranges.

Quote:
"So I arose and went out into the plain, and behold, the glory of the Lord stood there, like the glory which I saw by the River Chebar; and I fell on my face." (Ezekiel 3:23)



He’s not falling (on his face again, by the way) under the power of the Holy Spirit. He did this willingly out of fear and respect for God. He’s essentially bowing down. Apples to oranges.

Quote:
"Then the Lord opened Balaam’s eyes, and he saw the Angel of the Lord standing in the way with His drawn sword in His hand; and he bowed his head and fell flat on his face." (Numbers 22:31)



Again, this is not the same as what the “slain in the spirit” people claim is going on. Apples to oranges.

Quote:
"And behold, the glory of the God of Israel came from the way of the east. His voice was like the sound of many waters; and the earth shone with His glory. It was like the appearance of the vision which I saw - like the vision which I saw when I came to destroy the city. The visions were like the vision which I saw by the River Chebar; and I fell on my face." (Ezekiel 43:2-3)



Again… not the same thing. He is essentially bowing down under his own power. He’s swooning and then uncontrollably falling over backwards. (He’s falling on his face again… unlike “slain in the spirit) Apples to oranges.

Quote:
"Then He brought me by way of the north gate to the front of the temple; so I looked, and behold, the glory of the Lord filled the house of the Lord; and I fell on my face." (Ezekiel 44:4)



Same as the last few… apples to oranges.

Krispy

 2008/11/20 15:56
boG
Member



Joined: 2008/5/21
Posts: 349
Las Vegas, NV

 Re: Slain in the Spirit

Krispy, I think Edwards was saying there are no particular verses we can look to that expressely forbid "falling down" in the manner that we call "slain in the Spirit."

I agree, it is not of God. The only times anyone fell down as dead -- they died -- or as is assumed because of the Glory of the Lord. However, the latter, in most every case, the one who fell down as dead was strengthened and stood upright.

What I see today in all of this is lack of self-control, drunkeness rather than soberness of mind, emotion rather than devotion, the flesh rather than the Spirit, etc.

No lasting fruit -- no reformation of lives -- no increase of knowledge or wisdom -- no conforming to the image of Christ, etc.

All benefits in the lives of those Christians involved in these things are not because of this stuff but rather besides these things. It is no different than being foolishly entertained for the day but still being diligent to take some time for studies. I guess at the very least you are "emotionally" high on "positive affirmation" when you start your studies ... hey, it's organic!

Interesting references, Krispy. Seems to be more so a "fear" thing.


_________________
Jordan

 2008/11/20 16:57Profile





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