SermonIndex Audio Sermons
SermonIndex - Promoting Revival to this Generation
Give To SermonIndex
Discussion Forum : General Topics : A New Reformation

Print Thread (PDF)

Goto page ( 1 | 2 Next Page )
PosterThread
tjservant
Member



Joined: 2006/8/25
Posts: 1658
Indiana USA

 A New Reformation

A New Reformation

I would like to see the beginning of a new Reformation in our day, and I hope you would like to see it too and are praying for it. I hope you have become nauseated with the tawdry entertainment that passes for the true worship of God in many of our churches and, like the saints of the past, are longing for more of the deep truths of the inerrant Word of God. We certainly need a reformation.

The most serious issue facing the church today is not the inerrancy of Scripture but its sufficiency. Do we believe that God has given us what we need in this book? Or do we suppose that we have to supplement the Bible with human things? Do we need sociological techniques to do evangelism, pop psychology and pop psychiatry for Christian growth, extra-biblical signs or miracles for guidance, or political tools for achieving social progress and reform? It is possible to believe that the Bible is the inerrant Word of God, the only infallible rule of faith and practice, and yet to neglect it and effectually repudiate it just because we think that it is not sufficient for today’s tasks and that other things need to be brought in to accomplish what is needed. This is exactly what many evangelicals and evangelical churches are doing today.- James Montgomery Boice


_________________
TJ

 2008/8/16 14:12Profile
Shoufany
Member



Joined: 2008/8/13
Posts: 5


 Re: A New Reformation

i would love to share this with you. here is John Piper talking about wasting the pulpit.
it is related to many of the points that you raised
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2xiad6nKJCw

God Bless You ! :-)

 2008/8/16 17:26Profile









 Re: A New Reformation

The new Reforamtion will come when there is a joining of those who are "Spirit Filled believers," or Pentecostals for lack of a better term and those who know that the Bible is the inerrant Word of God. There are "Conservative Pentecostals who do not believe that we need sociological techniques to do evangelism, pop psychology and pop psychiatry for Christian growth, extra-biblical signs or miracles for guidance, or political tools for achieving social progress and reform. There has been much damage been done by keeping people who are solid in the Word of God and Conservative Pentecostals apart. The weakness of Pentecostals has been their lack of knowledge of the Word of God and the weakness of the Baptists and others has been their attitde towards 1Cor 13. So, if both sides would humble themselves and join together, what a dynamic team they would make. The sword of the Spirit, the Word of God. Here is Matthew Henry"s take on what the Scriptures mean when it says "When the perfect has come."..........

III. He takes occasion hence to show how much better it will be with the church hereafter than it can be here. A state of perfection is in view (1Co_13:10): When that which is perfect shall come, then that which is in part shall be done away. When the end is once attained, the means will of course be abolished. There will be no need of tongues, and prophecy, and inspired knowledge, in a future life, because then the church will be in a state of perfection, complete both in knowledge and holiness. God will be known then clearly, and in a manner by intuition, and as perfectly as the capacity of glorified minds will allow; not by such transient glimpses, and little portions, as here. The difference between these two states is here pointed at in two particulars: 1. The present state is a state of childhood, the future that of manhood: When I was a child, I spoke as a child (that is, as some think, spoke with tongues), I understood as a child; ephronoun - sapiebam (that is, “I prophesied, I was taught the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, in such an extraordinary way as manifested I was not out of my childish state”), I thought, or reasoned, elogizomēn, as a child; but, when I became a man, I put away childish things. Such is the difference between earth and heaven. What narrow views, what confused and indistinct notions of things, have children, in comparison of grown men! And how naturally do men, when reason is ripened and matured, despise and relinquish their infant thoughts, put them away, reject them, esteem as nothing! Thus shall we think of our most valued gifts and acquisitions in this world, when we come to heaven. We shall despise our childish folly, in priding ourselves in such things when we are grown up to men in Christ. 2. Things are all dark and confused now, in comparison of what they will be hereafter: Now we see through a glass darkly (en ainigmati, in a riddle), then face to face; now we know in part, but then we shall know as we are known. Now we can only discern things at a great distance, as through a telescope, and that involved in clouds and obscurity; but hereafter the things to be known will be near and obvious, open to our eyes; and our knowledge will be free from all obscurity and error. God is to be seen face to face; and we are to know him as we are known by him; not indeed as perfectly, but in some sense in the same manner. We are known to him by mere inspection; he turns his eye towards us, and sees and searches us throughout. We shall then fix our eye on him, and see him as he is, 1Jo_3:2. We shall know how we are known, enter into all the mysteries of divine love and grace. O glorious change! To pass from darkness to light, from clouds to the clear sunshine of our Saviour's face, and in God's own light to see light! Psa_36:9. Note, It is the light of heaven only that will remove all clouds and darkness from the face of God. It is at best but twilight while we are in this world; there it will be perfect and eternal day.

 2008/8/16 20:00
murrcolr
Member



Joined: 2007/4/25
Posts: 1839
Scotland, UK

 Re:

Quote:

appolus wrote:

The new Reforamtion will come when there is a joining of those who are "Spirit Filled believers," or Pentecostals for lack of a better term and those who know that the Bible is the inerrant Word of God



Greetings I have heard of this what you mentioned in the quote above in a couple of meetings I attended. I just took them as fact at the time as I was new born christian. Know being older and that bit more cautious I like to know a bit more information.

Can you please let me know where you got this information and if there any scrpitures to support it.

Will you be in Greenock for the conference?


_________________
Colin Murray

 2008/8/17 17:49Profile









 Re:

Hi Colin

I would think a better question would be, is there any Scripture to support multiple division within the Body? Pride and ego have kept these two groups apart, that and 1Cor 13 and an intepretation that has shut of the minds of many to the sign gifts. On the other side, a lack of Biblical knowledge has led them into many snares and dangers. When both sides realize the dire state of Christianity, and start working together, then we will see the New Reformation.

It will take brave men from both sides to put their reputations on the line and become completely abandoned to the cause of Christ, and not to the cause of Calvinism or Pentecostalism or any other ism.

Am I coming to the conference? No. I think my input was finished early on, not neccecarily by my desire, but it has turned out that way. My initial vision of men of God coming to my home town of Greenock is coming to pass, and for that I am very grateful. Just the mere presence of so many Christians in this area will bring light into darkness. If it turns out to be just another conference, then I will be more bold the next time in bringing together brave men of God whose only desire is to see Christ glorified and the community and the country changed by the power of the Gospel and with men who have "katanusso," power. One without the other is impotent............Frank

 2008/8/17 19:21
passerby
Member



Joined: 2008/8/13
Posts: 742


 Re:

Enlightenment needed here:

What is new reformation? what are the elements of this concept. How are we going to accomplish this.

@ appolus,

In what areas of ministry can we (Reformed, Fundamentals, Pentecostals,Evangelicals, etc.) join our efforts without really being infidel to our doctrines.

Are we not better off if we will just do those ministries independenly.

In my understanding the concept of separation is a distinct principle in the bible.

In a side note, I can also remember that in the Book of Acts (Ch15) the church in Jerusalem had a conflict with Paul and the Galatian Christians, so that Paul and Barnabas had to personally brainstorm with them. The result we know was an agreement which was pleasing to both sides. I think there is a lot of wisdom to gain from it.

 2008/8/20 2:26Profile









 Re:

Hi....just to clarify a few points. The problem lay in the church at Antioch. Part of the story unfolds in the Book of Galatians. And in Galatians 2 we see that Paul refers to the Judaizers in verse 4 as "false bretheren." These were "proffessing Christians," who sought to make the Christians(first named so at Antioch) a sect of Judaism. Peter was afraid of these Pharisees and played the "hypocrite," which is why Paul felt the need to rebuke him publicly.(a very harsh move) Yet, the point was so important that it had to be done. Peters response to the situation is excellent and instead of defending his actions and the doctrines of the Pharisees, they call for a council, the first ever council, to be held in Jerusalem. This cleared up the issue.
You ask this question "Are we not better off if we will just do those ministries independently?"

In my home town of Greenock, in Scotland, a notoriously ungodly twon in Scotland, with a population of about 65,000, there is about 50 denominations. As in the rest of Scotland and Britain, these churches are in various stages of death in a Post Christian society. If this was 2000 years ago, there would be "The church of Greenock."

The truth is that we are all part of the one Body, and each part needs each other. The hand cannot say to the leg that it has no need of it. It is pride and ego that has kept the groups apart. In every major revival, local churches worked together. The state of the Church today is so dire, and the hour so late, that we do not have the luxuary of denominationalism, if we want to be effective.

Its incredible to me that a lot of this division could center on a single text of Scripture, 1st Cor13:10. So, the world is going to hell, literally, but these men are divided and conquered and proud of it, I can only imagine how they will feel when they stand before the living God and announce that, even although their community was untouched for Christ, they stood firm on their "interpetation," and refused to work with their brothers and sisters for the cause of Christ.

As for Calvin and Arminius, this is a non-essential to the slavation of souls. Its a great debate to have between good brothers and sisters, but to allow it to divide and conquer us, only serves the purposes of the enemy. Pre-tribber, mid or post? Who cares? Another non-essential, another interesting debate among good brothers and sisters.

As far as seperation beinb Biblical? Not at all. The opposite is true. Unity is Biblical.

Col 3:11 where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision and uncircumcision, foreigner, Scythian, slave or freeman, but Christ is all things in all.

 2008/8/20 9:17
eternalvalue
Member



Joined: 2006/11/16
Posts: 26
Boaz, Al

 Re: A New Reformation

I agree we need a new reformation. I believe it is in the area of renewing the message of the cross. The preaching of the cross is severely missing from most of the church. It has been replaced with a sublt form of humanism. These are messages focus on "me, me".


_________________
James Nugent

 2008/8/20 9:17Profile









 Re:

I completely agree with you eternalvalue. In this new reformation, the cross will be central. The worship of a Holy God, and His majesty and His vastness, and His awefulness(full of awe) will be central because this is what happens when we get a deeper revelation of Calvary and who God is and what He has done for us. If the church's that exist today will not do this, then they will die(merely going through the motions) and God will raise up a new witness(also meaing martyr) in these last days........Frank

 2008/8/20 11:01
Ruach34
Member



Joined: 2006/2/7
Posts: 296
Beijing

 Re:

I agree with you eternalvalue and Frank...

The quote about the New Reformation being those "Spirit filled believers" really caught my attention.

I think the greatest danger that has beset the church at large or 'churchdom' is labelling believers "Spirit-filled" when they are in fact not.

There is no way for me to qualify or quantify that statement, but we have allowed whomevers and whatevers into our assemblies.
The church building is not what it is about, in fact the church building has become the 'field' as referred to in the parables. Yet, the church building is all that many have and will attain to. That is it, and that is all.

The church in Acts was an ekklesia, an assembly of 'called-out ones.' There was a depth of discernment as shown by Ananias and Saphira. They added to their numbers daily...
They continued in the fellowship daily...
They earnestly heeded the teaching of the disciples...

Will this New Reformation only occur when we become the 'called out ones' and separate from the status quo.

Should we fellowship with unbelievers, day after day, and not bring the cross of Christ to bear upon their minds.

I may be way off here, cuz of the parable Jesus spoke of letting the tares grow with the wheat. Is what we see in the 'churchdom' of the world and the masses that attend church buildings every weekend this parables fruition?

Is there a need to separate physically from these church buildings?

How can darkness come to the light, if the light has removed itself...

Yet what association does light have with darkness:

Quote:
Or what harmony has Christ with Belial, or what has a believer in common with an unbeliever? 2 Cor 6:15 (NASB)



I seem to be rambling now, but what has happened in 'churchdom?'

It appears we have grown accustomed to the dark, so much so that the Holy Spirit has been grieved away and we go on with business as usual.

The New reformation may be just this; the saints pick up on the fact that they are the 'called-out ones' and meet in houses, fields and caves so that there will be true worship, true recognition and deference to the Holy Spirit.

Kinda like in China...

But they are being persecuted and must meet like this...we simply are tired of the mixture and the lack of the Holy Spirit!

Quote:
"Therefore, COME OUT FROM THEIR MIDST AND BE SEPARATE," says the Lord. "AND DO NOT TOUCH WHAT IS UNCLEAN; And I will welcome you. 2 Cor 6:17 (NASB)



What thinkest thou...


_________________
RICH

 2008/8/20 14:03Profile





©2002-2024 SermonIndex.net
Promoting Revival to this Generation.
Privacy Policy