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philologos
Member



Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 do all in the name of the Lord Jesus

I was chatting to someone recently about patterns of posting on sermonindex. I have some ideas about the people dynamics evidenced on the site and thought I would share them here. I would be interested to know if others have thought about the format of the forums and the interactions that take place there.

sermonindex is an amazing mix of people, ideas and burdens. We have much in common but we also have areas of interest and passion which are not shared by all to the same degree. Sometimes people talk about skill-sets; the little bundle of abilities that each one has uniquely. I have my own burden/interest-set. At times sermonindex comes very close to my own mix of ideas and burdens and at other times it moves away and, I presume, closer to someone else's little burden-set. With some of the posters the burden/interest-set is very clearly defined. Such a post-er’s contributions to the forum in Lounge etc are usually when a thread intersects his burden-set; I think we all do this to a lesser or greater degree. You, reader, have your own burden-set too.

If you imagine all these burden/interest-sets as circles intersecting you will see that sometimes there would be a large overlap between two circles; some smaller and some hardly at all. When there is little overlap there will be little interaction between one person and another. However, there may be a lively interaction if someone else’s burden/interest-set collides with my/our own. Sometimes it is not easy to see what sparks such a ‘lively interaction’. Usually an invisible line has been crossed and the poor trespasser doesn’t even realise he has crossed it until the shells start flying.

Sometimes we may feel that another post-er is somewhat ‘cool’ to my posts. I think this will not usually be because 'he doesn't like me' but because different circles sometimes don't have a lot of things in common. The expected pattern would then be to 'ignore' the thread. "I have more important things on hand". but if that thread "trespasses" onto 'my territory" I may wake from my indifference and respond vigorously. Hence the saying ‘who rattled his cage’?

Emails and forums are a brand new way of interaction and in some ways they combine the worst features; the instant reaction of an ordinary conversation with the permanence of a written letter. The dynamics of forums are very complex and we should endeavour to put the kindest construction on everything we read.

What I must not do is try to impose my burden/interest-set upon the website. It is not honest to come to the forum with my own agenda. Greg is the host and we are guests. We have a very tolerant host who usually allows guests to chat about all manner of things but it would not be the role of the guest to guide the direction of the website. This is Greg's responsibility before God and he will be held accountable.

For myself I have benefited greatly from this format. Iron sharpens iron and I really appreciate thoughtful challenge to my ideas. Paul has a word for all users of sermonindex, I think…

So, as those who have been chosen of God, holy and beloved, put on a heart of compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness and patience; bearing with one another, and forgiving each other, whoever has a complaint against anyone; just as the Lord forgave you, so also should you. Beyond all these things put on love, which is the perfect bond of unity. Let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts, to which indeed you were called in one body; and be thankful. Let the word of Christ richly dwell within you, with all wisdom teaching and admonishing one another with psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with thankfulness in your hearts to God. Whatever you do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks through Him to God the Father. (Col 3:12-17 NASB)


_________________
Ron Bailey

 2004/7/9 5:23Profile
Gideons
Member



Joined: 2003/9/16
Posts: 474
Virginia

 Re: do all in the name of the Lord Jesus

Good thoughts brother.

Here's a couple of verses from Ephesians 2 from the NLT as to how I see SermonIndex: "19So now you Gentiles are no longer strangers and foreigners. You are citizens along with all of God's holy people. You are members of God's family. 20We are his house, built on the foundation of the apostles and the prophets. And the cornerstone is Christ Jesus himself. 21We who believe are carefully joined together, becoming a holy temple for the Lord."

We're all carefully joined together and we're all part of the body of the Christ. Thank goodness we're not the same part! (It would be a very messed up body...)

That being said, I do believe we can learn from each other and I pray that there's no hidden agenda in my own heart and encourage others to do the same.


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Ed Pugh

 2004/7/9 6:23Profile
crsschk
Member



Joined: 2003/6/11
Posts: 9192
Santa Clara, CA

 Re: do all in the name of the Lord Jesus

Thank you Ron.

Quote:
What I must not do is try to impose my burden/interest-set upon the website. It is not honest to come to the forum with my own agenda. Greg is the host and we are guests. We have a very tolerant host who usually allows guests to chat about all manner of things but it would not be the role of the guest to guide the direction of the website. This is Greg's responsibility before God and he will be held accountable.



There is the rub. As a moderator and one who is still learning a great deal day in and day out often times the tension is between behaving as a cop or a bouncer. This morning found me very agitated, indignation began to rise and quickly turned to grieving.

[i]"If the world hates you...[/i] has no real effect as it is to be expected. When it comes from one of our own 'kind' it is truely saddening.
Misunderstandings are to be expected as well and so the exercise to patience.

But to those that want to carry an agenda with no intention of learning, no humilty, no concern for opinions other than their own, who behave rudely and throw around accusations...There is no reason to come here and they will not be tolerated.


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Mike Balog

 2004/7/9 9:10Profile
Jimm
Member



Joined: 2004/4/27
Posts: 498
Harare, ZIMBABWE

 Re: The same anointing teacheth you

Philologos

That was a very interesting post Philo! I came to a similar conclusion although not quite so eloquently put. The thing that sparked it off was a former speaker on the forum who was somewhat hostile in demeanor. He sparked off so much controversy in a short time that it made me question my own motives for being on the forum. The episode left me somewhat deflated but it did realign my paradigms of perspective. As you said, we all have our interests and to an extent that influences the manner in which we write and respond.

Most of the readers and posters here are students of a particular school of thought, even if it is only subconsciously, or if this school of thought is not fully developed with the appropriate knowledge. I did not realize this until I once found myself writing a set of very similar responses to a set of very similar posts. It then occurred to me that, my views had been expressed more than adequately. It is not my place to continue to coerce people into my way of thinking, thereby creating dissention among those who do not agree. It is a lesson I was very slow to pick up, but our opinions run far deeper than we do my care to admit. A friend used to say to me, “there are none as foolish as those who will not learn”.

Ultimately, we are all the students of the Holy Spirit. “1John2:27But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.”

In light of this, if I have provided an obstacle to anyone’s learning, I would like to apologies for this. The site itself is growing in leaps and bounds and everyday we are being edified with more people who have the anointing. For me this is a wonderful fellowship and a point of learning, even if it appears that my opinions have not changed. Thank you Greg for providing this service at the expense of your own time and sometimes peace-of-mind. You have also resisted the lure of making a profit on the word of God. God bless you for this selfless act! This site in itself is a huge blessing for me and I am sure for many others.

James


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James Gabriel Gondai Dziya

 2004/7/9 9:34Profile
philologos
Member



Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re:

Quote:
It is not my place to continue to coerce people into my way of thinking, thereby creating dissention among those who do not agree.



James
You have no idea what joy this little sentence gives me! It took me decades to learn this! :-)

Even if I am right I cannot force my revelation on another. Nor, even if I am right, can I blame them for not having 'revelation'. I am challenged by the way that Paul would never push his point beyond the other man's conscience. If you force a man to believe something beyond his conscience you forcibly recalibrate that instrument; it may not work properly for him the next time he really needs it.

I have quoted this before but it is one of my favourites... and it is the last sentence that arrests me everytime I read it...

what a blessing it is that the Lord's heart is so large, that He can help whenever He sees some good thing; whereas man withdraws, because he sees some evil thing, which is generally found to mean something that wounds his own self-love in the little scheme he had set up as perfection. Anthony Norris Groves


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Ron Bailey

 2004/7/9 9:42Profile
crsschk
Member



Joined: 2003/6/11
Posts: 9192
Santa Clara, CA

 Re:

Thanks James.

Quote:
A friend used to say to me, “there are none as foolish as those who will not learn”.



Love that quote. Can I borrow it? Thinking I might use it below my signature and will give proper credit...'[i]A friend of James[/i]' :-)
Quote:
In light of this, if I have provided an obstacle to anyone’s learning, I would like to apologies for this.



Haven't seen it brother, as to most that fellowship here, your and their comments, shared experience and love for the truth has been edifying. Even in our 'disagreements' for the most part it is an opportunity to learn and grow.

Why would anyone want to hold on to anything that is detrimental to becoming more Christlike? We all have our blind spots and I am truely thankful for those that would point them out.

Isa 1:18 Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD:

Someone said that in a sense we should come to our bibles everyday as if for the first time, without our presuppositions. It seems not only proper but an incredible truth. I have been amazed how often I have been wrong, how much I missed, were my own attitude is skewered...

And as it is here amongst ourselves I thank God that there is those who would not leave me in ignorance be it by subtle suggestions or outright rebuke. I welcome it wholeheartedly!

Too be completely honest I often feel like I don't know the the Lord Jesus at all, even after all this time...don't know if it's from the damage I inflicted upon myself by killing off large quanity's of brain cells as a former heathen or just because...who knows? I most often feel that to honestly answer the question 'When were you saved?' I would have to say. "Today"
Every day is the first day, (kind of like the movie "Groundhog Day" :-) )

Have spent about 6-7 years now on this incredible journey, the first half learning a large quantity of bad doctrine and then unlearning it...In the past year since being led to this incredible site with it's vast amount of teachers and preachers, incredible brethren with big hearts and loads of experience, the transparency, the love, the striving for truth....Mind blowing and life changing. I am so utterly thankful.

Will go out with this thought that Greg had mentioned before and will take the liberty of gotten to know him fairly well will turn it around a bit:

Me and Greg are a couple of fools ... :-)

I can't finish the quote it sounds to pious, but if there is a need of proof that their is a God in Heaven...We kid each other calling ourselves 'Dumb and Dumbmer' and we still can't tell which is which and yet the Lord still use's a couple of goofballs.

Quite amazing when you think about it.


_________________
Mike Balog

 2004/7/9 10:28Profile
Jimm
Member



Joined: 2004/4/27
Posts: 498
Harare, ZIMBABWE

 Will not the judge of the earth do right.

Mr. Balog

You have made my day Mike! By all means take the quote but there is no means to add my name to it. You have just reminded me of a joke the same friend would tell me. He used to say to me, “you know, even in heaven someone has to take out the garbage!”

Obviously, this is not true but he would use this to exhort us to aspire for more than just being saved, and making it to heaven by the skin of our teeth. I guess an appropriate verse would be:
1 Corinthians3: 11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; 13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. 14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. 15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. 16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? 17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are. 18 Let no man deceive himself. If any man among you seemeth to be wise in this world, let him become a fool, that he may be wise. 19 For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness. 20 And again, The Lord knoweth the thoughts of the wise, that they are vain.

Sometimes I cringe at the job of the poor moderators here. And as you said, “"If the world hates you... has no real effect as it is to be expected. When it comes from one of our own 'kind' it is truely saddening...”

I guess we sometimes have to turn the other cheek and even offer our coats. The judge of the earth will do what is right and for us the reward is in heaven. Thank you guys for keeping the streets of SI clean!

James
:-)


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James Gabriel Gondai Dziya

 2004/7/9 10:45Profile
moreofHim
Member



Joined: 2003/10/15
Posts: 1632


 Re: Will not the judge of the earth do right.

Quote:
It is not my place to continue to coerce people into my way of thinking, thereby creating dissention among those who do not agree.


Quote:
Even if I am right I cannot force my revelation on another. Nor, even if I am right, can I blame them for not having 'revelation'. I am challenged by the way that Paul would never push his point beyond the other man's conscience.


Quote:
I guess we sometimes have to turn the other cheek and even offer our coats. The judge of the earth will do what is right and for us the reward is in heaven.


Ron (and James),

Thank you for your wise advice. I truly admire your humility and self-restraint (i know there is another word for this but it is not coming to me right now :-) )

For me, the Lord keeps showing me how I am to learn to get over "offense". That it is just pride and "self" that gets in a ruffle and many times not truly the Holy Spirit. I am learning to welcome and appreciate these times now. I can actually see some progress (slow as it may be).

Thanks again for your "pastoral counseling". :-)

In His perfect love, chanin


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Chanin

 2004/7/9 12:39Profile
Jimm
Member



Joined: 2004/4/27
Posts: 498
Harare, ZIMBABWE

 Re: Be still and know that he is God

"For me, the Lord keeps showing me how I am to learn to get over "offense". That it is just pride and "self" that gets in a ruffle and many times not truly the Holy Spirit. I am learning to welcome and appreciate these times now. I can actually see some progress (slow as it may be)."

Moreofhim

That is something that has been really been hitting home for me of late and you have just expressed the idea in words. My signature Jude1:9-10 has been thrown at me so many times that it has become almost impossible for me to ignore with a clear conscience. I can be so sensitive about people’s attitudes or displays of extreme disdain and disregard that it short-circuits my spirituality. I quickly turn into a complainer, and I am quick to point out the wrongs of the world’s system and “people of the world”. The following scripture shows the fallacy of my thinking very clearly:

2 Corinthians 9:6 But this I say: He who sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and he who sows bountifully will also reap bountifully. 7 So let each one give as he purposes in his heart, not grudgingly or of necessity; for God loves a cheerful giver. 8 And God is able to make all grace abound toward you, that you, always having all sufficiency in all things, may have an abundance for every good work.

I do forgive people who hurt me but sometimes it is VERY grudgingly. In complaining about the things of the world I do not edify anyone. Giving cheerfully is not just a matter of giving money but of yourself too; your time, your patience, your understanding, your kindness…your love. I exalt my position in Christ beyond what I should. I have been slowly learning to smite my chest and say to the Lord, “have mercy on me, a sinner” rather than to thank God that I am not “of the world”. Not that I say so with physical breath, but my attitudes sometime proclaims this on rooftops! The spirit has been very tender with me in teaching me this. It has not been shoved down my throat- a method that I sometimes use, wrongly, in teaching. God has so much to teach us if we will take the time to be still and listen.

James


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James Gabriel Gondai Dziya

 2004/7/9 14:06Profile
sermonindex
Moderator



Joined: 2002/12/11
Posts: 37103
"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11

Online!
 Re:

Quote:
sermonindex is an amazing mix of people, ideas and burdens. We have much in common but we also have areas of interest and passion which are not shared by all to the same degree. Sometimes people talk about skill-sets; the little bundle of abilities that each one has uniquely. I have my own burden/interest-set. At times sermonindex comes very close to my own mix of ideas and burdens and at other times it moves away and, I presume, closer to someone else's little burden-set. With some of the posters the burden/interest-set is very clearly defined. Such a post-er’s contributions to the forum in Lounge etc are usually when a thread intersects his burden-set; I think we all do this to a lesser or greater degree. You, reader, have your own burden-set too.


Brother Ron, what wonderful observations of the community at SI. Yes I have looking back many times and have noticed how peoples different burdens and bents in theology come out in different ways and at the same time compliment many other peoples. Its truly a marvel to see people from a diversity of backgrounds and learning coming together and really being the body of Christ in this online textual communication scenario.

Quote:
What I must not do is try to impose my burden/interest-set upon the website. It is not honest to come to the forum with my own agenda. Greg is the host and we are guests. We have a very tolerant host who usually allows guests to chat about all manner of things but it would not be the role of the guest to guide the direction of the website. This is Greg's responsibility before God and he will be held accountable.


I do try to the best of Gods strength in me to convey and led people into right directions of discussion and also tapping into resources in the downloads and articles section. I do appreciate your recogination of the fact that I am at times trying to lead people according to a burden that God has placed on my heart. And I have been in awe many times how God has allowed something that has burdened my heart to be transfered to another person through written format or audio/video resources. But with that said I do think that its very important for people to honestly share what is on their heart and in most cases this lends to the spirit of God leading us into all truth, but as we have seen and noticed there are some who will share things and impose their thoughts on other without regard to any prior workings of God in these community. I have to say that this ministry is in Gods hands and its a joy to be able to be a caretaker for this site.


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SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2004/7/10 14:42Profile





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