| Just what exactly is the "Book of Enoch"|
I am not interested in reading or purchasing this book, I am just curious as to what exactly is it and what is it about? Could anyone share any insight on this matter for me-thanks. :-)
| 2008/7/30 14:42||Profile|
| Re: Just what exactly is the "Book of Enoch"|
Funny that you ask this. I have also come across this question in the last few days as well.
I too am interested.
| 2008/7/30 14:57||Profile|
| Re: Just what exactly is the "Book of Enoch"|
Good article is [url=http://www.heaven.net.nz/writings/enoch.htm]here[/url]
| 2008/7/30 15:01||Profile|
Interesting. I read through the article. It sounded like a pro-Enoch article. Is there anything that someone can point to (besides a biased example for or against it) article on how the book of Enoch came to leave the bible? I am not sure if it exists and do not wish to run through all of Google to find something.
Also, do people view this book as a complementary tool to the bible? What are opinions about its usage altogether?
Very interesting. Thanks in advance for the replies and patience.
| 2008/7/30 16:26||Profile|
Here is the book:
You can browse through all 5 chapters
Jude quoted Enoch in verse 14-15.
His main topic is the bliss of the righteous and the dammnation of the sinners. I can imagine his burning righteous indignation against the ungodly just 7 generation after Adam. He shared 308 years with Adam, and Adam must have told all his living siblings about his walk with God before the fall. Enoch must have been fascinated with Adam's description of the paradise and must have asked Adam everything about God. When his own son Methuselah was born, he developed the walk with God that Adam had lost.
Result: His Great...great Grandfather Adam was kicked out of paradise.
Enoch experienced the reverse, he was TAKEN without tasting death, a fate that was only granted to Elijiah afterwards.
Some say that Enoch and Elijiah will be the 2 witnesses in Rev. 11. Both lived through times of great apostacy and have a proven track record as God's spokesman.
I found a striking clue in the name of his son Methuselah. Check this bible timeline:
Seth's great-great-great grandchild, Enoch, son of Jared was born. Enoch lived 365 years and fathered sons and daughters. ("The Arabian name of Enoch is Edris, and their traditions of him are that he was an eminent astronomer, mathematician and prophet of God.")
Seth's great-great-great-great grandchild, Methuselah, son of Enoch was born. Methuselah lived 969 years, making him the oldest of the ancient ones, and the oldest man to ever live. (Methuselah's name means, "At his death, it will come." Methuselah died the year of the flood.) Methuselah fathered sons and daughters.
After Methuselah's birth, the Bible records that Enoch developed an especially close relationship with God leading to his translation to heaven at the age of 365. "And Enoch walked with God 365 years and begat sons and daughters," Gen. 5:22 "And he was not for God took him." Gen. 5:24
Is Enoch inspired? Perhaps. I find Enoch one of the most fascinating characters in the bible. Unlike all the other giants of the faith, not a single flaw is recorded about this man. Being the seventh from Adam, which is a symbol of completenetss and born in sin he is a forerunner of a saint completed in Christ.
Gen 5:22 And he was not for God took him."
This is the consummation of Gal 2:20
"No longer I live but Christ in me"
| 2008/7/30 18:44||Profile|
Edmonton Alberta Cda.
I have been slowly reading through the book of Enoch that I found online. If I had to choose between Hinn, Swindol, Stanly, or Enoch, Enoch wins because he was respected enough by the Apostles to be called a prophet in their writings, so that is enough for me.
Jud 1:14 And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,
Jud 1:15 To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.
| 2008/7/30 21:10||Profile|
The one thing that I will say about Enoch; (and Elijah) is that yes I believe he was "translated" and "taken"-but I do not believe that he was taken to Heaven, as in where God dwells. The reason I say that is because of Jesus words in John 3.
John 3:13 [color=FF0000][b]And NO MAN hath ascended up to heaven[/b], but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.[/color]
I know in the account of Elijah's life, it mentions the chariots of fire taking him to heaven-but after reading Christ's words in John 3:13, I have often thought maybe this only spoke of the 2nd heaven, and not the 3rd Heaven where God dwells. I believe that Christ himself, had to be the first man to ascend into heaven because to him was given the Premeninence of all things.
Christ's words seem very clear to me: "[color=FF0000]And no man hath ascended up to heaven...[/color]"
To me, this would even include Enoch(and Elijah).Because it is even very clear or evident, that even the righteous after Enoch, such as Abraham, Joseph, David, Isaiah, Job, Jeremiah upon death did not ASCSEND up into heaven, but as it spoken of Lazurus in Luke 16, it is believed they went to Abraham's bosom. I also find it strange, that the Bible actually never says that he was translated up to heaven-it just said that he was translated-it never said where God took him, it just said that God took him. Considerably, you could even say that Job had the same testimony as Enoch. Enoch walked with God, Job was a perfect man and eschewed evil-yet even Job died and it is not accounted that he ascended up into the heavens.
Just some of my thoughts....again, I do belive the Bible account of Enoch, I just also think some of the things we have attributed to it, does not line up with the rest of Scripture. Maybe God took him (and hid him) like he did with the body of Moses
Rom 5:14 [b]Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses[/b], even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.
It said death reigned from Adam to Moses-is not Enoch in between Adam and Moses?
Perhaps even Heb 11:13 gives us some insight. Many of my close collegues do not agree with me on this point-but Heb 11 lists all the heroes of faith, Abel, Enoch, Noah, Abraham, Sarai, etc...then in verse 13 it says:
Heb11:13 [b]These ALL DIED in faith[/b], not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.
Would not verse 13 even include Enoch spoken of in verse 5?
:-) Just curious...just something to possibly think about.
| 2008/7/30 22:23||Profile|
You make some good points that I have thought about in the past as well. In fact, I have used John as well in other converstations.
Granted I am not well versed in Enoch or its meanings, but I think you did a good job of explaining it better than I can :-)
Abraham's bosom...Now there is a fun topic discussion!
| 2008/7/31 11:04||Profile|
Enoch didn't "leave" the Bible...it was never there to begin with.
And just because Jude "quoted him" doesn't mean a thing. It doesn't even mean there was a book. Secular poets and philosophers are quoted by Paul and that doesn't suddenly inspire them.
Interesting, but not part of canon.
| 2008/7/31 18:40||Profile|
Secular poets and philosophers are quoted by Paul and that doesn't suddenly inspire them.
Where in the New Testement did Paul quote from sources that are not in our own scripture? And in what context? I mean, did he quote simply to quote so he has reference or does he quote in agreeance with those documents like Jude did to expand on and support his point?
| 2008/7/31 18:53||Profile|