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ginnyrose
Member



Joined: 2004/7/7
Posts: 7474
Mississippi

 Re: Lakeland garbage

Quote:
I am absolutely ashamed how the Pentecostal/Charismatic world has gone crazy



Logan, welcome to the crowd! :-( There are many of us who belong to a church whose name reflects some point in church history BUT has now apostatized so badly. Personally, I am reluctant to say the name of my church for this very reason. (Our church is not connected to the larger body.) IN my case it is the casting aside of the basic Biblical doctrines, e.g, the virgin birth, the necessity of the Blood of Jesus in saving my soul, acceptance of practicing perversion, non-resistance gone to seed - now called pacifism, women pastors, etc.

Given the times we are in one cannot depend on the larger church body - or church conference - to not have caved in on some point or another which renders it an apostate church. It is [i]everywhere[/i].

Did Jesus not tell us "to come out from among them and be ye separate and touch not the unclean thing"? And why is this? I would guess so we would not become contaminated which will lead one to callousness and eventually abandon the faith, or if not that, join the crowd...because after all they do [i]use[/i] the name God and do many wonderful works! Oh, and they can be so kind! so it can't all be bad!!!!

Yes, I can relate.....and blessings to you, brother..

ginnyrose


_________________
Sandra Miller

 2008/7/17 9:25Profile
FireinmyBones1
Member



Joined: 2004/1/17
Posts: 219
Michigan

 Re:

Dear brother,

My intent was not in any way, shape or form to split hairs. My intent was to point out the error of our ways and the pseudo-scriptural forms of criticism that are all to prevalent today. The point of whether or not Bentley only saw or spoke to this angel is VERY relevant. The original poster did not say that he spoke with her in this visionary experience, but that he spoke with her regularly. Changing the language from "he saw her" to he "CLAIMS" to "speak with her regularly" is a big deal and a big exaggeration. Whether or not you find scriptural basis for female angels is not my point here. My point is that since the words left Todd Bentley's lips they have been amplified quite generously by the all to eager "discernment" ministries out there. If someone simply quoted the story of Gehazi's eyes being opened to the host of angelic chariots surrounding he and Elisha that's one thing. However, if someone began to claim that Gehazi then had regular fellowship with those angels and spoke to them from then on, would be quite a stretch indeed.

Simply because we may feel that Bentley's words are false, does not give us the right to falsify them more. It's a lie even if you exaggerate a pre-existent lie. That is the point I am trying to make. And this is far from an isolated instance. If you would like I could give you a large list of examples, as I have made this a matter of study and research.

I hope that you are able to hear my point here...

God bless,
Jeff


_________________
Jeff

 2008/7/17 12:41Profile









 Re:

Quote:
Simply because we may [b]feel[/b] that Bentley's words are false



Feel...?? You've got to be joking, right?

Quoting his own words, which are available to anyone with access to youtube or TBN, and weighing them against scripture is not "feelings".

Observing the wierd "manifestations" taking place there, again available thru youtube and TBN, and showing how they are no where to be found in scripture... therefore making them by definition "unscriptural" is not "feelings".

And then from your lofty tower of self righteousness you accuse the brethren on here of exaggerating what you think is a lie... after you've accused them of basing their objections of Bentley on "feeling" (which is completely untrue... therefore a "lie") is perhaps the most hypocritical and judgemental thing I've ever read on this forum.

You ought to be ashamed of yourself.

Is this the fruit of Bentley's revival? I believe it is. It's an attitude of "I'm way more open minded than the rest of you...". It's the same attitude I see in New Agers ironically. We're more wise and smarter than the normal person because we're open minded... etc.

All open mindedness will get you is deceived. If it isnt scriptural, and doesnt stand the test of God's Word... then my mind is closed to it. Period.

Krispy

 2008/7/17 13:32
FireinmyBones1
Member



Joined: 2004/1/17
Posts: 219
Michigan

 Re:

Wow, that was not the response I was expecting. All that from a word? I'm sorry if you read anything into my words or attitude that I was not intend to project. If I'm coming across as sarcastic or "prideful", it is not my intent. If that is indeed the way it is being perceived than I'll bury the hatchet and end this back and forth. I really do apologize if I'm coming across as sarcastic as that is not my intent at all. I'm just looking for some honest responses to an honest question


_________________
Jeff

 2008/7/17 13:40Profile
FireinmyBones1
Member



Joined: 2004/1/17
Posts: 219
Michigan

 Re:

Krispy,
perhaps if you read my original post - which is the second post on this particular thread - you will see what my original intent was. I apologize for using the word "feel" as I did not intend for it to be heard in the way that you perceived it. Perhaps it would have been better stated as, "Because some have determined by study of scripture..."


_________________
Jeff

 2008/7/17 13:43Profile









 Re:

"The point of whether or not Bentley only saw or spoke to this angel is VERY relevant. The original poster did not say that he spoke with her in this visionary experience, but that he spoke with her regularly. Changing the language from "he saw her" to he "CLAIMS" to "speak with her regularly" is a big deal and a big exaggeration. Whether or not you find scriptural basis for female angels is not my point here"

Hi.

This is what was said in the post: "I am absolutely ashamed how the Pentecostal/Charismatic world has gone crazy for this guy! He is not of God. He has said that he speaks with an angel named Emma on a regular basis. He has also said that he has been possessed by a demon while saved, which is impossible for a child of God! I wish that the Pentecostals/Charismatics would please wake up!"


The original post was a generalization about disappointment of extra-biblical stories or what have you and wanted Pentecostals/Charismatics to wake up. If you take out what was said and subtititute 'he states that he met with an angel named Emma' which is accurate then the context of what was said is still the same. I'm not quite getting the Ghahezi analogy. That's misrepresenting the Bible which is inspired, I don't think that's the case with a Bentley quote. And your kind of making my point, exaggerating outside of the Bible is a serious thing which is I think the original point of the original post. Again I think accuracy is important, no dispute there, but so is context. Especially when the implication isn't just exaggeration but an out and out lie. I'm not here to justify exaggeration but I just don't see this situation with the same rigidity.

 2008/7/17 13:57
Jsanturce
Member



Joined: 2004/3/23
Posts: 2


 Bently is a character!!

This guy in the end is going to hurt the christian movement. We as christians definitely need much more discernment. One look at one of his services and I knew it was not of God. When he says "POW" when he touches someone is just plain silly. I am not saying that all the people that go to his outreaches are not christians but they are lacking in discernment. The shaking on the floor and all that is not from God the holy spirit works in order. I believe in the power of the holy spirit and we praise out loud and lift our hands in worship (which is definitely biblical) but this shaking on the floor and fainting I truly dont believe its of the Lord.

 2008/7/17 14:14Profile









 Re: Bently is a character!!

fireinmybones... perhaps my response was a bit stronger than it needed to be. I think I was a bit over the top with my "tower" comment, and I apologize also.

My thing is, I've read the original post... and I agree w/the sentiments of the person who posted it. It is a sad day, and it does reflect badly on those in Pentecostal churches who really do strive for doctrinal purity.

As for the Charismatic Movememnt (which is different from Pentecostals), it was only a matter of time before it got as far out as it has gotten. It's always been out there... ever since Katherine Kuhlman.

Anyway... I do get bothered when it has been shown time and again here that Bentley and his doctrine are not in line w/ scripture... and some ignore it and basically say we dont know what we're talking about.

We arent perfect, nor do we have the market on sound doctrine... but Bentley's errors are so painfully obvious. Maybe thats why he is so deceptive... maybe people cant believe someone could be so wrong that he must be right!

Krispy

 2008/7/17 14:56
ChrisJD
Member



Joined: 2006/2/11
Posts: 2895
Philadelphia PA

 Re:

Hi everyone,



Fireinmybones,


"Changing the language from "he saw her" to he "CLAIMS" to "speak with her regularly" is a big deal and a big exaggeration."



I agree.


Does the Lord Jesus Christ smile upon playing loose with qoutes and facts about others?


Is that what we have here, a license to play with others words?


Why should anyone trust what we say or write here if we handle things like this carelessly.


Attributing words to others, especially in this context, where the words are bring used to bring condemnation and charges of guilt against them, is serious. And the facts matter.



Chris




EDIT in regards to "...playing loose with qoutes and facts about others", I'm not suggesting this is being done in general, but am responding to what was referred to specifically by the qoute from the user fireinmybones.


_________________
Christopher Joel Dandrow

 2008/7/17 19:13Profile
ChrisJD
Member



Joined: 2006/2/11
Posts: 2895
Philadelphia PA

 Re:

Hi everyone,


Coley, about this,


"For example I hear or read that Bentley spoke with the Apostle Paul in a Cabin and I repeat it. If however what I read was technically not true and Bentley actually met with Paul in the home of a friend then this is splitting hairs."



It does matter, if being in the cabin incriminates him in having burned it down.


The facts and details(EDIT and how we present them) of public accusations matter.


Chris


_________________
Christopher Joel Dandrow

 2008/7/17 19:46Profile





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