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Discussion Forum : General Topics : the "Shack" reviewed by Tim Challies

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Lonny
Member



Joined: 2008/12/18
Posts: 12
UK

 Re: A combined reply to 4 posters

Oh good grief! Time is too precious to waste on fiction? Lighten up!

Paul himself used his knowledge of books that weren't scripture when evangelizing so why shouldn't we? God can speak to us through a myriad of ways - not all of which are through the Bible - he speaks to me through nature, through the actions and attitudes of others, through worship, through sermons, through the fun that children have - I am not comparing them to God's Word as given to us in the Bible and I am not comparing The Shack to that either but God can still speak to us through it.

:-(


_________________
Richard Lonsdale

 2008/12/24 10:21Profile
JoanM
Member



Joined: 2008/4/7
Posts: 797


 Re: I, with many, have posted on The Shack before.

Proverbs 21:16 The man that [b][i]wandereth[/i][/b] out of the way of understanding shall remain in the congregation of the dead.

Should we wonder if imaginations lift themselves up against the [u][b]knowledge of God [/b][/u]? this particular imagination? against the knowledge of God?

Should we seek the dead on behalf of the living? Should a man not seek God?

Clear evidence it is revival or ruin.

 2008/12/24 10:50Profile
Miccah
Member



Joined: 2007/9/13
Posts: 1752
Wisconsin

 Re:

Lonny, what heresy is acceptable for you and others to read?


_________________
Christiaan

 2008/12/24 11:07Profile
HeartSong
Member



Joined: 2006/9/13
Posts: 3156


 Re:

The Lord has left it to us to choose what we take in, be it for good, or be it for evil. If we rely upon our human intellect, it is likely that we will choose wrong, for we do not know the truth of the matter.

It is like the eating of food. For years we were unaware of the poisons that were resident in the fruit - pesticides that were tasteless, but have been slowly poisoning our systems none the less.

We must ask the Lord to show us the way, for only He knows the truth of the matter and will keep us unto life.

 2008/12/24 11:12Profile
Lonny
Member



Joined: 2008/12/18
Posts: 12
UK

 Re:

Good question Miccah - I will actually read all manner of books and poetry which might not strictly be in line with orthodox Christian thought - however I will do that either to understand what the world is saying about life or to challenge my own way of thinking. That way I try to ensure that I don't get stale or hidebound and also to ensure that i am not giving answers to questions that had stopped being asked some ten plus years ago. How about you?

In terms of the analogy of eating food - everyone knows that the odd burger is truly delicious! :-)


_________________
Richard Lonsdale

 2008/12/24 14:38Profile
HeartSong
Member



Joined: 2006/9/13
Posts: 3156


 Re:

Quote:
In terms of the analogy of eating food - everyone knows that the odd burger is truly delicious!


What "tastes" good is not always what is good for you. In fact, often it is the things that "taste" good that are the most lethal for the enemy knows that you can be trapped by appealing to your senses.

Through "greed for gold," or the desire to make more money, Satan manipulates one person to add a little "flavor", knowing that the "product" will be more desirable to another. Through "lust" for the added "flavor", another will buy this product because it "tastes" good. Invariably, this added "flavor" is full of poison, and is usually addicting.

It is a cycle designed to destroy both the buyer and the seller.

 2008/12/24 15:06Profile
Miccah
Member



Joined: 2007/9/13
Posts: 1752
Wisconsin

 Re:

Lonny wrote:

Quote:



How about you?




Lonny, I have read "The Shack", hence I feel that it is ok to warn against it.

Being past the spiritual milk stage in my walk, I am able to read books as such, with MUCH prayer before, during and after, in order to increase my understanding and knowledge to fight against such things.

But I would never recommend to people to read this garbage without those people first being lead by the Holy Spirit. If the Spirit is leading you to read a/this book, then one should read it, but this is usually not the case.

To recommend something that you KNOW is wrong and literally breaks the Second Commandment is inexcusable

Maybe you have heard this before and is a good analogy to use in situations like this. The best wayto combat heresy is to study and know the Truth. This Truth is given to us through the Spirit of God and through the scriptures.

Another good lessen about what is acceptable or not can be obtained through the observence of what the "main stream church" deems acceptable or what they embrace. If it is embraced by Laodicea, more then likely it should be thrown away.

"The Shack" IS embraced by Laodicea.


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Christiaan

 2008/12/24 15:34Profile
poet
Member



Joined: 2007/2/16
Posts: 231
Longview WA

 Re:

A.W. Tozer said: “wrong ideas about God are not only the fountain from which the polluted waters of idolatry flow; they are themselves idolatrous. The idolater simply imagines things about God and acts as if they were true.”

I Just read "the shack" last week and wrote a position paper based on this book.
I found more than 50 statements in the book that misrepresent God, who he is and his character and nature.
My pastor recommended that I read it because he is getting his master at NW University; and it was required reading for one of his classes.
I just gave him the paper to check out on monday, I'll find out what he thinks after christmas.
I found it odd that some students in his class found many fundamental issues with the book and others noticed less.
This book is poison, and is so diabolical as to deny Christ, because it denies the Christ of the bible; of which the book says Mack's pre-conditioning or pre-conceived ideas about God are wrong, when we all as rational people get our ideas about who God is by HIS Word.

Believe me when I say this, our churches today are so ignorant of the God of the bible that they are not able to discern or recoginize whether the god of the shack is any different from the God of the bible.

I'll give you an example of a pastor I used to sit under, who is an experienced based teacher.
he would say things like don't put God in a box; when he was about to make a statement that we would probably not agree with. why wouldnt we agree with what he was about to say I ask?
Because his next statement was going to say something about God that wasn't found in scripture, or contradicted one of the fundamentals thats why.
Pre-conditioning, pre-conceived ideas, don't put God in a Box... ohh better yet, don't be a Pharisee, I had that one used on me too, only because we question someones teachings but we try to compare what someone teaches with Scripture, not by Storys, or subjective testamonies, the Bereans were commended, and we should always compare what someone teaches with scripture.

Even if an Angel from heaven preaches a gospel other than the one we have preached let him be eternally occursed.

My pastor said that there are even churches out there that are using "the shack" as a sunday school teaching tool.....
Not as a discernment tool either....
Please stay away from this book, do not recommend this book, do not promote this book.


_________________
howard

 2008/12/24 23:26Profile
CJaKfOrEsT
Member



Joined: 2004/3/31
Posts: 901
Melbourne, Australia

 Re:

Quote:

poet wrote:
I Just read "the shack" last week and wrote a position paper based on this book.
I found more than 50 statements in the book that misrepresent God, who he is and his character and nature.


Hi Poet.

I am still plugging away at this book, and so am yet to form a concrete opinion about it. I must admit that I began this book, expecting nothing but "humanist junk", especially in light of its mainstream success, but have been pleasantly surprised. I would be interested to read your paper on it, especially the "50 statements in the book that misrepresent God".

Quote:

This book is poison, and is so diabolical as to deny Christ, because it denies the Christ of the bible; of which the book says Mack's pre-conditioning or pre-conceived ideas about God are wrong, when we all as rational people get our ideas about who God is by HIS Word.


So, if I am reading you right, Mack was right to believe that God is a cruel task master, who does not, in fact love him, at best, and is powerless to help him, at worst? You believe that God is someone who justifies alcoholic wife beating, as long as the person doing so is a student of the Bible? You believe that God is someone who is waiting with a rod to beat us every time we get out theology slightly wrong?

If you put those statements, in the book, in their proper context, you'd see that this is exactly what you are saying, when you make the above statements. Brother, I have personally met many young believers whose parents demand that their children "honour their parents", while ignoring the command to not "provoke their children to wrath". I watched one such "man of God", who held a masters degree in theology from one to the most respected Evangelical Bible Colleges in Australia, slap his son across the back of the head, for asking why he had to eat the crust of the bread, which he didn't like.

The sad thing is, many Christians have deified "the Bible", at the expense of God (Tozer spoke of this also, btw). The Shack is making an attempt at addressing this.

Quote:

Believe me when I say this, our churches today are so ignorant of the God of the bible that they are not able to discern or recoginize whether the god of the shack is any different from the God of the bible.



The same can be said about any book, regardless of the best intentions of the author. In fact, the above mention youth walked away from reading Leonard Ravenhill's "Why Revival Tarries" being convinced that his best efforts to meet up with God's "demanded obedience" were unable to achieve righteousness. I'm sure that Ravenhill would turn in his grave to be accused of promoting salvation by "self righteousness", and yet this was the impression that this young man walked away with. So, would you say that we should ban Ravenhill also?
Quote:

Even if an Angel from heaven preaches a gospel other than the one we have preached let him be eternally occursed.


Please present how the Gospel presented in The Shack differs from the Scriptural one? I'm yet to see it.
Quote:

My pastor said that there are even churches out there that are using "the shack" as a sunday school teaching tool.....
Not as a discernment tool either....


Naturally, any attempt at replacing the Scriptures with any book, regardless of its Scriptural integrity, is a dangerous one. But, then again, where do we draw the line with this? Do we ban illustrations in preaching, only permitting the Scriptural quotations? The Shack is intended as an allegory. It's purpose is to draw attention to certain Scriptural principles, not to establish doctrine, itself.
Quote:

Please stay away from this book, do not recommend this book, do not promote this book.


I am actually more concerned about the backlash against this book, based primarily on its popularity. What if God were to allow such a book to become popular, in order to offend our theological intellect? What if His target is the "Laodicean church", believing itself to be rich in its theology, having "progressed from milk to meat" (Heb 5:12-14)? What if His desire is that we leave "the principles of the doctrine of Christ..not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God", in order to "let us go on unto perfection" (Heb 6:1)?

(Oh, I'm gonna get some grief over this post...I can just smell it) :-)


_________________
Aaron Ireland

 2008/12/25 7:15Profile
Koheleth
Member



Joined: 2005/11/10
Posts: 530
NC

 Re:

Quote:

Lonny wrote:
Oh good grief! Time is too precious to waste on fiction? Lighten up!



I think the question remains, in light of the death of Christ, how much we should lighten up. Peter told us to "be sober, be vigilant".

Quote:
I am not comparing them to God's Word as given to us in the Bible and I am not comparing The Shack to that either but God can still speak to us through it.



I agree that God can and does speak to someone seeking light by using errant sources. But for a person that already has light (spiritual light meaning more understanding of the truths about God), I do not believe that God will "speak" (reveal truth) through these types of materials. The presentations of God in The Shack may be an interesting exercise for Christians to think about, but will definitely never be God "speaking" unless we believe that God is choosing to use Bible-contradicting statements and perspectives to speak. If that were the case, God would be guilty of duplicity and confusion. The God of the Bible never has revealed himself as deceptive in that way.

 2008/12/25 7:27Profile





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