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 demons?

Demons is a subject that i have great difficulty with. This is because if you believe that they are active agents in our lives, then reason, physics, and the whole of progressive Western thought, really, falls by the wayside and everything is motivated or controlled by forces we cannot see or comprehend.

Germs become unimportant, frivolous ideas.
Freewill comes into question. (posession)
Intention, inspiration, happenstance events, all accidents, your health, your musical abilities etc. all become disjoined from the real world because the real world is evil spirits floating around causing trouble, diseases, crime, cancer etc. people become carriers without selfwill.

the whole notion of cause and effect becomes a useless idea.

anybody else have a problem with the idea of demons???

bub

 2008/4/11 11:20









 Re: demons?

Quote:
anybody else have a problem with the idea of demons???



Not really. They're in the Bible.

 2008/4/11 13:44
PreachParsly
Member



Joined: 2005/1/14
Posts: 2164
Arkansas

 Re: demons?

Bubba,

What is your basis for any spiritual truth? In other words, where does it come from?


_________________
Josh Parsley

 2008/4/11 13:50Profile
JoeBenson
Member



Joined: 2008/3/29
Posts: 38
Greenville, South Carolina

 Re: demons?

Bubba,

To answer your question - No I don't have a problem with demons or the demon issue.However, I do believe that they are real because the Word of God states it.

Focus on the Lord Jesus Christ and your demon issue will disappear. It may just be a demon trying to sidetrack you from the Savior Jesus Christ. Suggestion - if you are saved and redeemed by the blood of Christ, then why worry about the demons??

Be strong in the Lord and in the power of His might. It is through Christ and Christ alone that all issues are resolved. Expecially those of a demonic nature. If we stay focused on the Savior Jesus and not the journey itself, everything will allign according to His will. Peace be with you Sir.

In Christ,

Joe Benson


_________________
Joe

 2008/4/11 14:03Profile









 Re:

Parsly,

excellent question. Certainly the Bible contains the spiritual Truth of God and His Son.

But we also need to keep in mind that the Bible was written at a very different time and in very different cultural circumstances than what we face today.

Consider the Television. If a person from Jesus time saw a television, they would see a box full of demons and have absolutely no understanding of the physics that make the thing work. We know different; that its just electrons flying around and no demons are involved. (unless you start in on the content, which is another matter altogether.)

Demons were recorded in the Bible as being a cause of many evils that people did not comprehend. So i have to question whether the Bible presents the real Truth of the matter, when it is refering to demons. if you want to discount the progress of time and the vast cultural differences between modern humans and those that lived 2000+ years ago, taking everything as literal, then, i don't think you are reading and understanding the Bible correctly.

bub

 2008/4/11 14:13
LoveHim
Member



Joined: 2007/6/14
Posts: 562
Indiana, US

 Re:

Quote:
excellent question. Certainly the Bible contains the spiritual Truth of God and His Son.

But we also need to keep in mind that the Bible was written at a very different time and in very different cultural circumstances than what we face today.

bub, i appreciate your honest and open opinions. the problem you're going to keep having is that you look at the bible as simply a book that is true in certain things (God, who Jesus is), but not true in other things it talks about. you seem to keep acting as if it is not as relevant in our culture as it was in theirs.

but the bible does not need to adapt because man is still the same as he has been for thousands of years. sin is still sin, man is still man, the devil is still the devil and God is still God.

at some point, you'll see that certain things can be explained and certain things you will have to trust by faith. the question is "can you do that"??

have a good day,
phil

 2008/4/11 14:21Profile









 Re:

Phil, i appreciate your honest response.

I think the idea of an inerrant Bible is opposed to the truth that God alone is perfect. it also seems like a demand being made of God.

i have "trust by faith" in Salvation bought by the blood of Christ's obedient and perfect sacrifice.

don't really need any other truth from the Good Book, do we? (although there is much, much more to learn from this Great Book. it holds many Truths and has much to say about our relations with others and our purpose on this earth. )

we've been given brains and gumption to explore the vast Universe, to learn about God's great creation. (which we have only just begun)

demons seem like a historical artifact used to explain the unexplainable.

bub

 2008/4/11 14:47
JoeBenson
Member



Joined: 2008/3/29
Posts: 38
Greenville, South Carolina

 Re:

Bubba,

I was not going to get more involved in this dialogue, but I saw your comments to Parsley and got a bit concerned. Your comment was:

"Demons were recorded in the Bible as being a cause of many evils that people did not comprehend. So i have to question whether the Bible presents the real Truth of the matter, when it is refering to demons".

My concern is: Do you think or believe that the Word of God is the definite Truth of God? By your comment, I sense that you question that it is.

Remember that faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God - Romans 10:17

If it weren't for the Word of God, there would be no Word of Truth. All we have to rely on is the Word of God and the Holy Spirit working in our lives. We cannot add to the scripture by putting our own thoughts in to the equation. The Word of God is sufficient for all things. God speaks through the Word of God; the Holy Bible.

I suggest that you spend some time in prayer concerning your issue. God never fails. Stop, pray and listen to His voice. He will help with your concerns.

In Christ,

Joe Benson


_________________
Joe

 2008/4/11 15:01Profile
HomeFree89
Member



Joined: 2007/1/21
Posts: 797
Indiana

 Re:

Quote:

bubbaguy wrote:

Demons were recorded in the Bible as being a cause of many evils that people did not comprehend. So i have to question whether the Bible presents the real Truth of the matter, when it is refering to demons.
bub



Yes, the Bible is the written Word of God so it presents the "real Truth". There is no form of deceit in God and He is all knowing so He knew what He was talking about when He inspired the authors of the Bible. So yes, there are real demons.

I honestly don't see how you can have any foundation for your believing in Jesus and what He's done when you're critical about or just plain don't believe the other things in the Bible. I'll pose the question again, where is your solid foundation for believing, Bubba?

Jesus has never changed (Hebrews 13:8) and His Word hasn't either.

With concern,
Jordan


_________________
Jordan

 2008/4/11 15:12Profile
PreachParsly
Member



Joined: 2005/1/14
Posts: 2164
Arkansas

 Re:

Quote:
Parsly,

excellent question. Certainly the Bible contains the spiritual Truth of God and His Son.

But we also need to keep in mind that the Bible was written at a very different time and in very different cultural circumstances than what we face today.

Consider the Television. If a person from Jesus time saw a television, they would see a box full of demons and have absolutely no understanding of the physics that make the thing work. We know different; that its just electrons flying around and no demons are involved. (unless you start in on the content, which is another matter altogether.)

Demons were recorded in the Bible as being a cause of many evils that people did not comprehend. So i have to question whether the Bible presents the real Truth of the matter, when it is refering to demons. if you want to discount the progress of time and the vast cultural differences between modern humans and those that lived 2000+ years ago, taking everything as literal, then, i don't think you are reading and understanding the Bible correctly.

bub



What are you defining as "the spiritual Truth of God and His Son"? Wouldn't you agree that those who speak of demons see them as spiritual beings? It would appear that if the Bible contains spiritual truth about Christ, demons are considered a spiritual reality, then when it says that Christ cast out a demon, it is actually telling us about a spiritual truth.

If you believe that the writers of the new testament seen demons as a spiritual reality and they speak of Christ casting them out then the only conclusion you can come to is that the writers believed these things to be "spiritual Truth about God and His Son." You either have to say that Spiritual Truth changes or the writers aren't conveying to us full spiritual truth. If you say that it changes, you contradict what Truth is. If you say that the authors didn't convey to us spiritual truth, you contradict your first statement. I don't see a way around it.

Another thing you are seemingly denying is that the Bible means what the writers meant it to mean. To say that a text means something other than what the author intended it to mean is to be... well... absurd, don't you think? If I interpreted your post to mean you are telling me about your pet frog and how you are having problems with him staying in his aquarium, you would think I am crazy. Surely, for me to understand what you are saying I have to attempt to acquire what you, the author, meant by it. I'm sure you agree with that.


_________________
Josh Parsley

 2008/4/11 15:16Profile





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