Joe, I understand what you are trying to convey here, but had to object as to the text you were using to make this point. (private interpretation???) That was my objection.
There are many references to those lost and or babies but in the Church....
1. CARNAL Christians....still fleshly acting out of fleshly selfish motives...immature Christians.
2. False teachers.......
And I must say....2nd and 3rd John state ...."don't let them in in the first place".
ADDED: False teachers, I mean!!!!!
John here wasn't talking about the JW's that come to your door, but false teachers and troublemakers who come into the Church.
You can't **force** salvation on anyone. And you can't force Maturity on anyone.
We do have a problem though...as we become seeker friendly seekers wanting increased church membership.... promoting inter-denominational churches where the main thrust of the church is....**lets see what we can agree on, and stick to that**, and mark those who won't go along with the program as troublemakers....then there is another side to who's calling who a goat.
Oh, and how many Churches who say they are saved and Washed in the Blood put a iron wall around their Church.....not wanting anyone new to come in for fear of contamination with sinners! Self righteous legalists!
Whether we are in Church, the World, the office, our homes, no matter where we are.....we will encounter all sorts of situations and people.
Let you light so shine before men!!!
All men everywhere everyplace!
| 2008/4/11 15:07|
Greenville, South Carolina
In the most gracious way; your point is clearly made.
You are correct, you cannot force salvation on anyone. However, we do have a responsibility of teaching, speaking and conveyeing the gospel that is uncompromising. I do not preach hellfire brimstone, but I do preach and teach that there is a judgment that we all must face. For non repentant sinners, it is a day of wrath and for sinners saved by the grace of God it is a judgment of our works - the White Throne.
It is irrelevant on the terminology used to distinguish between unrepentant sinners and repentant saved sinners. Our responsibility is to proclaim the Gospel to all nations. We cannot sit back and preach an uncompromising message to the flock. All Christians have been commissioned to spread the Good News to everyone. We are not told to refrain from the gospel in order to make someone comfortable.
The unrepentant, unsaved will stand out if we preach the Gospel of Jesus Christ. Once the seed is planted by the true Gospel being taught, then the Lord will decide if the Holy Spirit will convict someone to repentance.
It should all be done lovingly and in a non judgmental way. God will do His work, but we must not fall into the trap of being seeker friendly or comrpomising.
Thanks Katy for your words of insight.
| 2008/4/11 15:23||Profile|
| Re: Feedback on my article please|
I just wanted share my thoughts and encourage you in the Lord and to exhort others in the Lord. As I read your main point in this thread, being Pastors of the true church should take their responsibilities seriously, because of the concern of where the people spend their eternity is not a trival thing. Preaching sermons not to make the people happy and feel comfortable or tickle their ears. Point # 2 , many Pastors are not doing that. No one challenged your main point but only your terminology of the lost, being goats. Actually the term goats was not actually challenged in being wrong, but the time period in which you were using it. I read your thread of truth, amen it and observed it just set there without comment, except for mine, [u]for over two weeks edit: not 2 weeks, I looked at wrong date[/u], although you asked for feedback and then what happened???? I see no reasoning in saying your terminology was wrong in calling the lost people goats, or that would particular terminology would make your post any less valid. When the Pastor preaches a sermon about how the Word and the Holy Spirit convicts the goats and he preaches the cross and how Jesus saves and how the Holy Spirit within them prompts them to live a better moral life as a result in being pleasing to him. Saved not by our works, but as a result of his grace and of his work, producing fruit, becoming a new creation. As the Pastor elaborates in his sermon on that subject and about living moral lives and moral issues and about how many goats lost people are living immoral lives and how many goats support people that promote immorality and how we can recognize those people who are set apart and who are not by their fruits, at least one of the goats in the church will horn the Pastor after church about being political from the pulpit. Is he, no, but its a goat tactic.
| 2008/4/11 15:59|
However, we do have a responsibility of teaching, speaking and conveyeing the gospel that is uncompromising. I do not preach hellfire brimstone, but I do preach and teach that there is a judgment that we all must face. For non repentant sinners, it is a day of wrath and for sinners saved by the grace of God it is a judgment of our works - the White Throne.
But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
13And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
14And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
Joe, the final judgement is not the wrath of God, but the lake of fire...HELL!
Many unsaved today and through out history have not met with the **wrath of God**. The Day of His Wrath, called the **Day of the Lord** is coming for sure...but only those who are still upon the earth. This is what Matthew 24&25 are talking about.... a certain time and place in history.
We, the Saved are children of the DAY...not children of the night...so that day should not overtake us as it will to the Lost.
So what do we preach today to sinners.....the JUDGEMENT....the **second** death? Would that not be HELL? The Lake of Fire?
However, those in Christ will be part of the first resurrection...the Resurrection of Jesus Christ in the Believer when we will be Glorified together with Him. Jesus said I AM the Resurrection.....of LIFE....not the resurrection of death and hades. They will be raised up to stand before the Great White Throne Judgement....even with all the Angels who fell. We the Church will be judging those angels
1 Corinthians 6:2-4
2Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?
3Know ye not that we shall judge angels?
When do you suppose the Church will Judge the Angels?
When Paul said WE shall all stand before the Judgement seat of Christ, Paul is talking to Christians...not unbelievers...and our works will be judged....but our sin has all ready been judged at the Cross. Jesus took our Wrath and Judgement, and to those who have put their faith in Him. Colossians 2.
Should we not also preach HELL (the final Judgement) to the Lost?
The Judgement seat of Christ and the great White Throne Judgement are two different Judgements, just as the Judgement of Nations ( Matthew 25)is too an altogether different judgement taking place before the 1000 years. That judgement determines who will and will not enter the Kingdom Reign. Again in Matt 25 there is no mention of the Lambs Book of Life.
| 2008/4/11 16:07|
Greenville, South Carolina
Thanks for the words of wisdom.
I find it ironic that my article was about preaching the cross with no compromising to distinguish the goats from the crowd and the messages conveyed on this thread/post was compromised by talking about a goat and giving it the attention.
What is having the spotlight? The goats (unsaved) or the Gospel?
| 2008/4/11 16:11||Profile|
Joe, an uncompromising Gospel preaches HELL!!!!
| 2008/4/11 16:18|