SermonIndex Audio Sermons
Image Map
Discussion Forum : Articles and Sermons : Wilkerson Has Partaken Of "Holy" Laughter?

Print Thread (PDF)

Goto page ( Previous Page 1 | 2 | 3 Next Page )
PosterThread
jeremyhulsey
Member



Joined: 2003/4/18
Posts: 777


 Re:

After listening to this sermon, it doesn't sound like any kind of endorsement for the Holy Laughter movement. He's just not condemning those who have had an experience with the Lord as though all "holy laughter" is intrisicly evil or a false manifestation. There are testimonies from some very godly people early in the Pentecostal movement that reported experiencing holy laughter. It's not that "holy laughter" is automaticly bad, but that there is a categorical and qualitative difference between one who is experiencing the Lord and another who is being confirmed in their rebellion.

I have one sermon where Bro. Wilkerson talks about himself being slain in the Spirit. He contrasts the true against the false. His final statement went something like "If the Lord's gonna lay you down, He's gonna lay down a clean vessel!" The jist of his sermon was that we often bypass the laver of cleansing to go straight to the altar for a blessing.(I'll have to search my tapes to see exactly which sermon it is.)

I came up with a statement at bible school that sort of goes with this, "Truth without fire is dead. But fire without truth is deadly."

In Christ,
Jeremy Hulsey


_________________
Jeremy Hulsey

 2004/6/17 17:30Profile









 Re: HUSLEY

Your statement on the issue was brief and certainly to the point!

I could not have said it better myself!

Notice in my originbal post I DEFINATELY did not claim wilkerson was "endorsing" the various movements and false revivals among us; I was simply ASKING.... :)

Why did I post this issue? To receive individual responses to Wilkerson's sermon.

Husley, you LITERALLY have stated what I have always believed...each word posted by you is the word in my own heart.

I have been "slain" in the Spirit twice in my life as a Believer; once when I was 17 years old and once when i was 24, and the same PAOC Evangelist (Silas Matchett) prayed for me on both occassions, and this man is a Holiness Pentecostal who knows his God as all do who are truly Redeemed.

Both occassions I was literally struck to the floor weeping and sobbing over the Holiness of God and my own sin present before me; both times a definate change took place, a softening of my heart towards the Spirit of Christ.

Does God move? Yes!

The thing I learned at VBCI (Victory Bible Colleges International) is that the Lord moves in PATTERNS, PROMISES and in STRANGE WAYS, as David described His Spirit in Psalms.

Example: Philip ran as fast as the Chariot in Acts; however, does God give a promise, "Thou canst run as fast as a car" ? No; thus we call this a STRANGE ACT of God.

Example: People all through the Book of Acts prayed in other Tongues, prophesied, spoke the Word with boldness,etc etc, and in ACts 2:39 it says that the Gift of the Spirit is a PROMISE to all who are afar off.....The Spirit in PERSON is a PROMISE indeed.

Example: Each time a nation/individual turned FROM God TO idols/sin, God's PATTERN was to pour out wrath....EVERY SINGLE TIME, except where repentance was sought and found.

Thus, Wilkerson and anyone else who has had experiences that are starnage are not always in "the wrong".

My Pastor friend (best friend and Mentor, Pastor Daniel Jalbert who is also a friend of TSC) saya it like this: If God gives you an experience that cannot be validated by the WHOLE of Scripture, tell no one and leave it to you and the Lord alone as precious and special between you and He.

Pastor Dan Lirette

 2004/6/17 18:33









 Re: Brother Greg:

No, dear brother; not implying, suggesting or doing otherwise with this issue on Wilkerson.

What was my point?

My point was simply that I wanted input from others; Wilkerson DID make reference to personal UNcontrollable laughter and he also, in other sermons, blasted the laughter Movement.

I think the issue DESERVES probing, don't you and others believe so?

I asked a Pastor friend of mine to hear it and he was confused as he listened to Wilkerson...and you will note some other posts here which show the same.

The issue IS and issue, dear brother.....

Now, PERSONALLY, I love Wilkerson and know that he is NOT agreeing with the Laughter Movement in any way.....

It IS good to know if OTHERS see it the same and if not, shouldn't we explain to them what Wilkerson is truly saying here instead of allowing the young and weak to believe something that WIlkerson is NOT even claiming?

Point is, and the posts bear it out, that people HAVE misunderstood Wilkerson.

Now we have a chance to show that Wilkerson was NOT referring to HIS laughter experience as that of the Toronto style experience.

GBU

Daniel

 2004/6/17 18:54









 ROBERTW

Brother Robet; are you upset with any of my posts? It seems that you have taken a vengeful stance against me and/or my posts.

Just wanted to know, sinmce these are your words.....


"As for Jimmy Swaggart; pointing out apparent contradictions in Dave Wilkerson's ministry will not rebuild Jimmy Swaggart's."

Brother, my Swaggart and Wilkerson post have NOTHING to do with one another and I am NOT seeking to discredit Wilkerson; he's the best Man of God alive and with us today presently.

Why would you believe I was seeking to discredit Wilkerson?

Pray, my dear Brother, when making such a statement as that as you have.

You claim that I wanted to discredit Wilkerson to build up Jimmy Swaggart?

That is certainly not ANYTHING that I sought to do; I love and listen to both of these men on a consistent and regular basis.

Swaggart and Wilkerson are two of my all time favorite ministers.

Though your words show a clear slant against Swaggart himself, I will say that I need not discredit anyone, Wilkerson or otherwise, to "rebuild Swaggart's Ministry"...

God will hold Swaggart up, brother...not Dan Lirette.

God is the lifter of men's souls; and He delights in taking care of Swaggart and all others who have repented.

GBU

Daniel.

 2004/6/17 19:01
sermonindex
Moderator



Joined: 2002/12/11
Posts: 37289
"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11

Online!
 Re:

Quote:
My point was simply that I wanted input from others; Wilkerson DID make reference to personal UNcontrollable laughter and he also, in other sermons, blasted the laughter Movement.


Thank you for clarifying brother but I would like you to consider that the method you used to attract attention to your point was not done that well. I first off had the impression by reading the title that Wilkerson is part of the laughing revival movement and if a person doesnt take the time to read the entire thread they might draw a quite assumetion or conclusion. There has been and continues to be much flack towards brother Wilkerson. Even at one point Wilkerson concedes of not even wanting to go to church because people on the streets would say 'are you a false prophet?' etc and it would grieve him so much. Thats why I think it would be better to rather speak of wilkerson in this situation in better terms.

I think brother Hulsey came up with a great summation of the matter and I would also say that no man is perfect as your stated also brother daniel.

This might seem abit off topic but im a firm believer in the principle of seeking light and truth and the darkness will be exposed as a consequence. If I am stumbling around in the dark with a lamp and trying to point out all the wrong things it will end up being a futility. But rather if I (we) as the body of Christ become once again the light and salt of the earth, then the counterfeit christianity will be seen for what it is.

Brother Keith Daniel gives this call very powerfully in this sermon: [url=http://www.sermonindex.net/modules/mydownloads/visit.php?lid=4230]The Sermon on the Mount (video)[/url]


_________________
SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2004/6/17 19:07Profile









 SERMONINDEX

First, Brother Greg, let me say MSN Messnger just cut out! So I came here! hehe

I agree with your statement fully, and if i seemed to have posted my thread in a manner that may not have been appropriate to some, I ask your forgiveness.

One contention, however, with a statement you made, Brother Greg:

"...I think it would be better to rather speak of wilkerson in this situation in better terms."

Should this not apply to Swaggart and any other we make reference to?

Thank you also for pointing out the method used; greater wisdom wiull be used next time; God DID promise to give me some ;) lol.

Damniel

 2004/6/17 19:54
sermonindex
Moderator



Joined: 2002/12/11
Posts: 37289
"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11

Online!
 Re: SERMONINDEX

Quote:
Should this not apply to Swaggart and any other we make reference to?


I would think there is a volume of difference between swaggart and wilkerson. The maturity and determination in his walk with God is something that is note worthy and to be admired. Wilkerson seems to have been through much controvesy and has spoken out on many key issues: judgement, false gospels, etc. He has been faithful with his call of a watchman over the nation of America and I pray God keeps him true to that purpose. If brother wilkerson feel into dubious sin of a manner that is not to be named once amongst the saints then I would say that would be a very damaging witness to the entire body of Christ in America.

Towards brother Swaggart, I believe as do others that he has truly repented. But he cannot expect to gain back spiritual success and the favor of the people. And what really worries me is that He is acted as though nothing really happened and rarely mentions his backslidding. I would think he would be a broken man now in the hands of the potter and be more grave and serious over spiritual matters. I watched him on the internet TV once a few months back and he was having a good ole pentecostal time, which is fine! but as I said there is volumes of difference between Wilkerson and Swaggart.

And not to be make more dissension but wouldn't your reasoning apply to other men such as John Wimber, Kenneth Copeland and the likes who if you did ask them would say they are seeking the face of God like no other man. I am sure all these men repented also, will not the judge of all the earth do right? I think many man's souls are in God's hands and we can speculate but rather that energy would be better used preaching the 'true gospel' the truth that is in Jesus Christ. And stop focussing on the falacies of others even how dubious and maligned they are.

The church needs to be the salt of the earth once again.


_________________
SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2004/6/17 20:08Profile
Tears_of_joy
Member



Joined: 2003/10/30
Posts: 1554


 Re:

Quote:
I first off had the impression by reading the title that Wilkerson is part of the laughing revival movement and if a person doesnt take the time to read the entire thread they might draw a quite assumetion or conclusion.



For this reason, I suggest the title of this thread to be changed.It really gives bad impression for those who don't know and haven't heard brother Wilkerson and will read only the title.

 2004/6/17 20:22Profile









 Aticle Should be "re named"?

To all who think/believe that the title of this post implies Wilkerson as one of the "laughing believers"...well, without AT ALL seeking to be ignorant or unloving (and I mean that Brethren).... let me ask:

Does anyone understand what the rules of English Composition are measured by?

Take a look at the title.... You don't even have to GLIMPSE at it to see the question mark (?) .

It's called a question; not a statement.

Within a question there can never be any implication except by the own biased perception of the reader; this is Composition friends.

If any of you have taken the title to be offensive or imlicated, according to the ruled of English, it HAS to be because of a perceived interpretation on YOUR part, simply because a question mark completely excludes any statement of fact, and gives only a query.

Why is it that some write about the TITLE?

It's not a title; it's an imposed (not implied) statement.

Daniel

 2004/6/17 21:47
sermonindex
Moderator



Joined: 2002/12/11
Posts: 37289
"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11

Online!
 Re: Aticle Should be "re named"?

Quote:
It's not a title; it's an imposed (not implied) statement.


Dan Lirette, A False Prophet?

Brother I think the above example shows that this is not always a suitable method to draw a conclusion. Clearly the above statement is not correct you are not a false prophet but it brings into peoples minds the idea of you being one, Therefore to address the subject away from the person's name would be more suitable? I really never learnt english grammer and was a drop out in school but it seems like better edicate.


_________________
SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2004/6/17 21:59Profile





©2002-2020 SermonIndex.net
Promoting Genuine Biblical Revival.
Affiliate Disclosure | Privacy Policy