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Discussion Forum : News and Current Events : Liberal judges rule CA homeschools illegal...

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ccchhhrrriiisss
Member



Joined: 2003/11/23
Posts: 4476


 Re:

Thanks, Mike...

I actually read that letter earlier this afternoon. While it is doubtful that California State Troopers will begin raiding homeschools, it does give individual School Districts (considered "special districts") a legal leg to stand on for forcing parents to send their children to accredited schools (public or private). While this letter points out that it is highly unlikely for districts to press charges against parents, the possibility now exists for such prosecution.

Like this letter says, the safest way to fight it is through the Supreme Court. The current slightly conservative makeup of the Court will likely favor the parents (rather than "big government"). This is certainly a violation of parental rights. But since "parental rights" are not currently defined by the Constitution, the defense will likely proceed with a violation of the "Free Exercise clause" of the First Amendment (in which Congress cannot violate the free exercise of religious practice).

Still, it might be a good time to write Congressmen -- particularly if you are a homeschooler living in California or a western state. My wife and I may relocate to California this summer. As a result, we might also write a few letters.

:-)


_________________
Christopher

 2008/3/8 18:16Profile
crsschk
Member



Joined: 2003/6/11
Posts: 9192
Santa Clara, CA

 Re:

Understood brother. I did fail to mention that I heard it on the local Christian radio station out here. They have a certain talk show that tends to rub me the wrong way more often than not. There was a certain sense of jumping to conclusions and that ... embellishment factor that starts raising red flags. [i]This could lead to ...[/i] is a far different cry than [i]This means you could be arrested ... etc. etc.[/i] according to one of the expert\lawyer\defender's they had brought on.

My aunt worked in the main school district for many, many years as an administrator. The public school system here is definitely not being exaggerated as to the poor shape it is in.


_________________
Mike Balog

 2008/3/8 18:34Profile









 Re:

Quote:
Compliments, do you think the only way a parent can be qualified for teaching their children is to go through school and get a piece of paper that gives them those credentials?

Certainly not!

However, to be wise as serpents and harmless as doves, I think that we should dot our lines and cross our T's when we are dealing with this world.

If the law requires that children be taught in a Private School, or be tutored at home by a qualified teacher then we should make the adjustments. It's not like they are saying, "Deny Christ or die". I think that we Christians do more harm by attracting attentions unto ourselves. Our citizenship is in heaven, not here on the earth. We can train up a child in the way of the LORD or in the way he should go when he is old he will not depart from it. I know this to be true in my own life. I went to a secular school. My mother taught us about faith, now that I am older, I have not departed from it.

I hear believers say, "It's our right", "We have rights". When did this come into effect? My bible says that we should live a quiet and peaceable life as we sojourn here. My bible says that we are to obey the laws of the land and to subject ourselves to the king,, queen, president, prime minister.

We should be in our prayer closet tearing down strongholds, not holding meetings on how to defend our "Constitutional Rights". Can you imagine a Chinese Christian standing up to the Communist Regime and saying, "Give us Christians the freedom to worship". He'd be squashed in a moment. Were not to hold rallies or find the best lawyers in the state. Cursed be the man that leans on the arm of flesh, our help comes from God.

I am just talking Joy, not aiming any of this at you, but mainly to myself and to us all.

 2008/3/8 20:05
MaryJane
Member



Joined: 2006/7/31
Posts: 3057


 Re:

Compliments wrote
____________________________________

We can train up a child in the way of the LORD or in the way he should go when he is old he will not depart from it.
_______________________________________

The sad truth is with what is being taught in public schools today it is extremely difficult to follow this command. For 180 days out of the year, six and half hours a day, even children as young as six in some states are taught very worldly, anti-Christ curriculum. Those worldly influences can be very detrimental to a young child's growth in the Lord. I guess for me the question comes down to why put one so impressionable and unable to discern in that situation at all. Father has given me the ability to care for and raise my children in accordance with His Word so that they will grow up desiring the things in life that He has for them.

God Bless
MJ

 2008/3/8 20:29Profile









 Re:

Quote:

Compliments wrote:
Quote:
Compliments, do you think the only way a parent can be qualified for teaching their children is to go through school and get a piece of paper that gives them those credentials?

Certainly not!





Good! I didn't think you did...but for the sake of the discussion wanted to know for sure. :)

Quote:

However, to be wise as serpents and harmless as doves, I think that we should dot our lines and cross our T's when we are dealing with this world.

If the law requires that children be taught in a Private School, or be tutored at home by a qualified teacher then we should make the adjustments. It's not like they are saying, "Deny Christ or die". I think that we Christians do more harm by attracting attentions unto ourselves. Our citizenship is in heaven, not here on the earth. We can train up a child in the way of the LORD or in the way he should go when he is old he will not depart from it. I know this to be true in my own life. I went to a secular school. My mother taught us about faith, now that I am older, I have not departed from it.

I hear believers say, "It's our right", "We have rights". When did this come into effect? My bible says that we should live a quiet and peaceable life as we sojourn here. My bible says that we are to obey the laws of the land and to subject ourselves to the king,, queen, president, prime minister.

We should be in our prayer closet tearing down strongholds, not holding meetings on how to defend our "Constitutional Rights". Can you imagine a Chinese Christian standing up to the Communist Regime and saying, "Give us Christians the freedom to worship". He'd be squashed in a moment. Were not to hold rallies or find the best lawyers in the state. Cursed be the man that leans on the arm of flesh, our help comes from God.

I am just talking Joy, not aiming any of this at you, but mainly to myself and to us all.



Good post, brother. We need to keep all these things in perspective. And it isn't a life and death issue with public education. However, if we have opportunity to influence the laws that are made that effect our families, shouldn't we do so? (note, I'm writing this with the past couple of things brought up in relation to this court case in mind - not all court cases call for public action). In America this is still an option for Christians. Especially when it's a case of laws being made by judges and not in the proper order established by our constitution. That is what bothers me about this California court case, a judge declaring homeschooling to be against the law.

Thank you for your words. They bring in some good balance in helping to examine these issues in relation to Scripture and what God says about government.

 2008/3/8 20:31
PassingThru
Member



Joined: 2005/5/7
Posts: 175


 Re:

Quote:
A primary purpose of the educational system is to train school children in good citizenship, patriotism and loyalty to the state and the nation as a means of protecting the public welfare,..."



I'm all for good citizenship, but loyality to the state depends very much on the state of the state.

Forcing all children to be 'trained' by the state is another step towards dismantling the family, by minimising parental influence on the next generation. It is an obvious step towards a form of government that views citizens as existing for itself. It craves control.

Another interesting aspect is the form in which this was done. A single, extreme case was used to project forced schooling as being sensible and beneficial, when in fact it is neither.

PassingThru...

*edit - minor grammar correction.

 2008/3/8 20:35Profile









 Re:

Quote:
The sad truth is with what is being taught in public schools today it is extremely difficult to follow this command. For 180 days out of the year, six and half hours a day, even children as young as six in some states are taught very worldly, anti-Christ curriculum.

When I was in school in the 70's, I never had curriculum that had any thing that was Christian. I never read in any literature anything about Jesus Christ. It was shunned at this school and you were looked at as out of step with society. But I loved going to this school. Looking back I can see why I was different, the hand of the LORD was upon me and kept me from believing the garbage that was anti Christian, like evolution. But todays children are faced with other issues like accepting homosexuals as an ok lifestyle. God help our children.

Thanks for your post MJ.

 2008/3/8 20:57
dantejones
Member



Joined: 2006/1/6
Posts: 31
Albuquerque, New Mexico

 Re:

As a soon-to-be teacher myself, i'd like for it to be known that public education is one of the most de-federalized institutions in the country; states school boards have all the power in determining what is taught and by whom, so the actual government is not intruding on anyone, just the appeals court in California.
However, this ruling is absolutely outrageous, and one that we should all stand against. How absurd!


_________________
Ben Ordaz

 2008/3/9 3:05Profile
Compton
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 2732


 Re:

I'm glad to hear that this is perhaps an overstated misunderstanding from the news. (Yet another example of why the news is untrustworthy.) But I think it's good for these legislators to see what kind of ire they raise when they touch our children...even if it was just a misunderstanding.

Quote:
We should be in our prayer closet tearing down strongholds, not holding meetings on how to defend our "Constitutional Rights". Can you imagine a Chinese Christian standing up to the Communist Regime and saying, "Give us Christians the freedom to worship".



Hi Compliments,

I hear this sentiment often at SI. I can certainly imagine they would say it if they lived here. They might wonder why you aren't and why you place so little value on something they would welcome.

The early Puritans, a most spiritually minded people that we often quote around here, fled first to Holland and then to the Americas for the ability to raise their families the way they wanted to. They traded their comforts, to risk death and work hard in a wilderness for this possibility. I dare say they knew the meaning of prayer more then most of us...yet they also discovered that in addition to prayer they could also get their families out of England and then out of Holland.

The freedom to worship and to raise our families as we see fit is not a trivial liberty. Now the first century Christians lived in an empire that persecuted them not of their own choice. Even they would have gladly been thankful for liberty had Ceasar given it to them in a way that agreed with their confessions. Certainly Paul knew something about maintaining a prayer closet, yet he did not hesitate to appeal to Ceasar. If he were as spiritual as some of us are around here, I think he should have just kept his mouth shut that day he was taken in Jerusalem, and passively submitted to the Romans as they beat him, denying his rights.

If we are persecuted because we have no choice then may God be with us. Truly there must be portions of Christ's comforting fellowship that are reserved for those suffering brethren whom the world is not worthy. Yet, shame on us if we, under the guise of being heavenly minded, let our familes fall under persecution because we didn't have the good sense to take adavantage of our citizenship, or because we thought living in persecution will cure us of our worldliness. Our children will suffer more then we for such carelessness.

My apologies for the civics lecture brother!;-)

MC


_________________
Mike Compton

 2008/3/9 3:11Profile









 Re:

Quote:

MaryJane wrote:
Compliments wrote
____________________________________

We can train up a child in the way of the LORD or in the way he should go when he is old he will not depart from it.
_______________________________________

The sad truth is with what is being taught in public schools today it is extremely difficult to follow this command. For 180 days out of the year, six and half hours a day, even children as young as six in some states are taught very worldly, anti-Christ curriculum. Those worldly influences can be very detrimental to a young child's growth in the Lord. I guess for me the question comes down to why put one so impressionable and unable to discern in that situation at all. Father has given me the ability to care for and raise my children in accordance with His Word so that they will grow up desiring the things in life that He has for them.

God Bless
MJ


MJ and others,

My sons were brought up in the public schools and I can honestly say, that I've not been unhappy with what they were taught near as much as "HOW" they taught ~ without love and compassion by a few.

And in defense of teaching (I am also a high school teacher), I have to add that for 95% of us who teach in the public schools, we are way too busy following curriculum guidelines and standards to set aside time to teach an anti-christ agenda.

I'm not against homeschooling, but I do have an honest question... if we are the light of the world - how can we be when we hide ourselves away in our homes (under a bushel) and not go out into the world that our light and our children's light would shine?

One last thing, I've seen kids take a stand in the classroom for what they believe in and put everyone to silence! I just smiled and went on teaching. Sometimes, I wonder if we are doing our children an injustice by hiding them away. I don't know, I'm just asking an honest question.

God bless us all as we seek HIM!!!

 2008/3/9 8:47





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