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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : please im confused about baptism and feel i could go to hell

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PaulWest
Member



Joined: 2006/6/28
Posts: 3405
Dallas, Texas

 Re:

Paul is like the thief on the cross, mach II. The proof that the salvific requirement changed not after the resurrection; man was still saved immediately by faith, with absolutely no confidence placed in the flesh. Water baptism, when it's all said and done, is but a physical sacrament than can be done without being Holy Spirit regenerated. Paul tarried at least three days blind after the Damascus road exeperience before any kind of baptism, and there is also no account of him speaking in tongues as initial evidence when he received the Holy Spirit. I include this just to show how God used Paul to break the legalistic mode of immediate water baptism and the obligatory tongues errors He knew would plague the church of the 20th century.


_________________
Paul Frederick West

 2008/2/15 10:40Profile
broclint
Member



Joined: 2006/8/1
Posts: 370
West Monroe, LA

 Re:

Our point here brothers is to help the man who inquired rather prove our points... to this end I will bow out.

Clint


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Clint Thornton

 2008/2/15 10:41Profile
BlazedbyGod
Member



Joined: 2007/8/22
Posts: 462


 Re:

Quote:

broclint wrote:
Brother Blazed, you are getting a little too hot in your response. Remember that the inquiry here was not whether he should be baptized but whether baptism were essential to salvation and it clearly is not. You would put millions into hell by such a doctrine. Sure we are to follow the Lord in all the ordinances such as communion, some require "foot washing" others speaking in tongues "to be saved" and there is no doubt that all of these are doctrines taught in the Bible but are not NOT what saves us.

Again read the context of what Paul said and he made no mistake in saying it:1 Corinthians 1:14 - 18 (KJV) 14I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius; 15Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name. 16And I baptized also the household of Stephanas: besides, I know not whether I baptized any other. 17For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect. 18For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

He did not even recall who or who he did not baptize. It is not that baptism is unimportant, but very obviously Paul was concerned in getting folks converted, saved, redeemed, by the BLOOD of Jesus Christ. Water is used as a symbol, nothing more, nothing less.

Clint



Broclint, I am not sure I understand your first statement about me getting "too hot"-but nevertheless I apologize for it seeming that way-we are just typing and things can come off different when reading verses hearing someone.

As I understand, the topic is: "please Im confused about baptism and feel I could go to hell"

 2008/2/15 10:41Profile
PreachParsly
Member



Joined: 2005/1/14
Posts: 2164
Arkansas

 Re:

If you believe in the Lord and have repented, I would suggest getting baptized. There's no reason not to. It's going to be hard to study this issue out if you are fearing you are going to hell.

The Bible does say that you should be baptized. It says a lot of things you should do- and you need to do them all. But what is most needful is that you trust in Christ.

Believe with your whole heart and you will be saved. Then obey the Lord. Faith and obedience go hand in hand, but faith is what holds obedience together.

Again, my suggestion is to get baptized. Then you can study the scriptures without a heavy conscience and with a level head.

I only give this advice on this particular topic because we are to be baptized- regardless if it's something we have to do to be justified (which it's not). On other issues I wouldn't say to just go ahead and do it and then study it out. Usually you study then you do it. But in this case most everyone agrees that you do need to get baptized, whether they think it's something you have to do to be saved or not.

I wouldn't be surprised if 98% of the people that have posted on this thread have been baptized.


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Josh Parsley

 2008/2/15 10:44Profile
broclint
Member



Joined: 2006/8/1
Posts: 370
West Monroe, LA

 Re:

Brother Blazed, did not mean to attempt to judge, it just seemed with the all caps to come across that way, my apologies.

Clint


_________________
Clint Thornton

 2008/2/15 10:44Profile
BlazedbyGod
Member



Joined: 2007/8/22
Posts: 462


 Re:

Quote:

PaulWest wrote:
Paul is like the thief on the cross, mach II. The proof that the salvific requirement changed not after the resurrection; man was still saved immediately by faith, with absolutely no confidence placed in the flesh. Water baptism, when it's all said and done, is but a physical sacrament than can be done without being Holy Spirit regenerated. Paul tarried at least three days blind after the Damascus road exeperience before any kind of baptism, and there is also no account of him speaking in tongues as initial evidence when he received the Holy Spirit. I include this just to show how God used Paul to break the legalistic mode of immediate water baptism and the obligatory tongues errors He knew would plague the church of the 20th century.



The Bible never says Paul was saved "during those three days" either-neither does it indicate that simply BECAUSE of the Damascus road experience that he was.

 2008/2/15 10:45Profile
BlazedbyGod
Member



Joined: 2007/8/22
Posts: 462


 Re:

Quote:

broclint wrote:
Brother Blazed, did not mean to attempt to judge, it just seemed with the all caps to come across that way, my apologies.

Clint



No problem, and I still love you with the genuine love of the Lord though we currently have different beliefs pertaining to this subject.

 2008/2/15 10:48Profile
PaulWest
Member



Joined: 2006/6/28
Posts: 3405
Dallas, Texas

 Re:

Quote:
The Bible never says Paul was saved "during those three days" either-neither does it indicate that simply BECAUSE of the Damascus road experience that he was.



Neither does it say he wasn't saved until Ananias layed hands on him. Our account has been that an encounter with Jesus Christ alone by faith is sufficient. "[i]Lord, what wilt thou have me do?"[/i]

No man calls Jesus "Lord" but by the Holy Spirit.

Remember the thief: "Remember me, [i]Lord,[/i] when thou comest into thy kingdom"

Two men, two confessions of Lord. One before the resurrection, one after. Saul was already a chosen vessel by God before Ananias layed hands on him. Had Saul died before Ananias reached him, would he have been lost forever?


_________________
Paul Frederick West

 2008/2/15 10:48Profile
BlazedbyGod
Member



Joined: 2007/8/22
Posts: 462


 Re:

Quote:

PaulWest wrote:
Quote:
The Bible never says Paul was saved "during those three days" either-neither does it indicate that simply BECAUSE of the Damascus road experience that he was.



Neither does it say he wasn't saved until Ananias layed hands on him. Our account has been that an encounter with Jesus Christ alone by faith is sufficient. "[i]Lord, what wilt thou have me do?"[/i]

No man calls Jesus "Lord" but by the Holy Spirit.

Remember the thief: "Remember me, [i]Lord,[/i] when thou comest into thy kingdom"

Two men, two confessions of Lord. One before the resurrection, one after. Saul was already a chosen vessel by God before Ananias layed hands on him. Had Saul died before Ananias reached him, would he have been lost forever?



Matt 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that [b]doeth the will of my Father[/b] which is in heaven 22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Many people will call Jesus Lord, and still not have eternal life.

Now these people in Matt 7:21-22 that called him Lord, did they have the Holy Spirit?

 2008/2/15 11:01Profile
LoveHim
Member



Joined: 2007/6/14
Posts: 562
Indiana, US

 Re:

Quote:
Our point here brothers is to help the man who inquired rather prove our points... to this end I will bow out.

Clint

i agree brother, but it is because of these verses and his friends (brothers like blazedbyGod) that the original brother has all the confusion over it. so it's almost like by answering these very verses that brother blazedbyGod is using, it may help our original brother see verses in a different light. maybe, just maybe, the Lord may use these explanations to shed light for our brother.

definitely our aim should never be to just "win" an arguement. if that is my goal, then let me log off now. ;-)

phil

 2008/2/15 11:08Profile





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