SermonIndex Audio Sermons
Image Map
Discussion Forum : Revivals And Church History : Head 1. Our woful Condition by Nature.

Print Thread (PDF)

PosterThread
sermonindex
Moderator



Joined: 2002/12/11
Posts: 37211
"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11

Online!
 Head 1. Our woful Condition by Nature.

[img]http://www.sermonindex.net/images/forum/2004/june/featured_sum.gif[/img]

[b]The Sum of Saving Knowledge - Table of Contents[/b]

HEAD I.
Our woeful condition by nature, through breaking the covenant of works. Hos. xiii. 9. O Israel, thou hast destroyed thyself.

I. The almighty and eternal God, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost, three distinct persons in the one and the same undivided Godhead, equally infinite in all perfections, did, before time, most wisely decree, for his own glory, whatsoever cometh to pass in time: and doth most holily and infallibly execute all his decrees, without being partaker of the sin of any creature.

II. This God, in six days, made all things of nothing, very good in their own kind: in special, he made all the angels holy; and he made our first parents, Adam and Eve, the root of mankind, both upright and able to keep the law written in their heart. Which law they were naturally bound to obey under pain of death; but God was not bound to reward their service, till he entered into a covenant or contract with them, and their posterity in them, to give them eternal life, upon condition of perfect personal obedience; withal threatening death in case they should fail. This is the covenant of works.

III. Both angels and men were subject to the change of their own free-will, as experience proved, (God having reserved to himself the incommunicable property of being naturally unchangeable:) for many angels of their own accord fell by sin from their first estate, and became devils. Our first parents, being enticed by Satan, one of these devils speaking in a serpent, did break the covenant of works, in eating the forbidden fruit; whereby they, and their posterity, being in their loins, as branches in the root, and comprehended in the same covenant with them, became not only liable to eternal death, but also lost all ability to please God; yea, did become by nature enemies to God, and to all spiritual good, and inclined only to evil continually. This is our original sin, the bitter root of all our actual transgressions, in thought, word, and deed.


_________________
SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2004/6/10 14:46Profile
sermonindex
Moderator



Joined: 2002/12/11
Posts: 37211
"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11

Online!
 Re: Head 1. Our woful Condition by Nature.

Quote:
Our woeful condition by nature, through breaking the covenant of works. Hos. xiii. 9. O Israel, thou hast destroyed thyself.


I am very much looking forward to going throuh this book and commenting on certain parts of it. We really need to get a solid grasp on the work of salvation that God sets out clearly in the scripture and this old volume really has touched many a men of God in the past and surely is worth our time in the present. This is very vital to understand that we have corrupted ourselves and essentially 'destroyed' ourselves of our own volition.

Quote:
I. The almighty and eternal God, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost,


The God of the scripture is clearly laid out as a God of three seperate and distinct persons hence the theological word used: "Trinity".

Quote:
II. This God, in six days, made all things of nothing


God made a world without sin and it was good. He laying before his creation the law and saying if you eat of the tree you will surely die. Therefore death and life was laid before men to choose. Its interesting that the words 'contractual agreement' is used, God basically promised that there was life in everything else except for partaking of that one tree. This covenant that God made seems fair and just what a small thing to not do and the rest life, eternal life.

Quote:
III. Both angels and men were subject to the change of their own free-will, as experience proved


Man can change, God can't. God is 'unchangeable' there is no variable or shadow of turning in Him. God allows men to change either towards Him or away from Him, 'of their own accord' God allows us to with the circumstances taken in to choose our own way. Through the fall of man by the devil tempting, man inheriting death lost all 'also lost all ability to please God'. I am not sure what that would mean if there is nothing in men at that point that could please God or if there was still the agent of choice in men to choose between good and evil. One thing to take into account is that men did not continue to eat from the tree but fleed in shame (which would be considered a choice of volition towards good rather than bad). 'inclined only to evil continually' I would say that most men would inherently choose to do evil but there was a remenant that choose to 'call on the name of the Lord' it is now a narrow and hard way but still its the choice of life over death. 'original sin' Surely men does have original sin but is there nothing in our volition to choose good? surely there must be some good if you turn the scenario of the garden of eden upside down (which happens after the fall) you find it easy to partake of the tree of knoweldge of good and evil, but in retrospect hard to seek after God and do his will in the garden.

I'm just jotting down ideas as I read through this there is much to look into and I am going to read over it and ponder it more, please feel free to comment on what you agree and disagree with.


_________________
SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2004/6/14 0:14Profile
philologos
Member



Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re: Head 1. Our woful Condition by Nature.

Quote:
did, before time, most wisely decree, for his own glory, whatsoever cometh to pass in time:


I know that Calvinism doesn’t mean that the Godhead had a board-meeting to make these decisions, but I still find myself uncomfortable with the language. Is this a biblical revelation or a deduction in human terms of events as they unfolded? Were there ‘decrees’? and whatsoever cometh to pass in time? Are we saying that God ‘decreed’ Hitler, Stalin, Idi Amin, Saddam Hussein… that God ‘decreed’ Adam’s disobedience? (this is the territory of Infralapsarianism again!)


Quote:
This is the covenant of works.


The problem with this kind of introduction is that we are setting up ideas that will determine the rest of the conversation. A covenant is a solemn and legally binding agreement between at least two parties. Is there any evidence that such an ‘agreement’ ever existed between God and Adam?


Quote:
This is our original sin, the bitter root of all our actual transgressions, in thought, word, and deed.


Readers of these posts will know that I am strong believer in ‘original sin’, but to call it a ‘root’ is predetermining the direction of our conversation. Traditional eradicationists speak much about the ‘root’ of original sin. I don’t think the Bible ever refers to original sin as a root. This gives the picture that it is located somewhere in a man and can be removed like a rotten tooth. I think this is a mistake.


I am really looking forward to reading the Sum of Saving Knowledge together but I would alert folk to the fact that these opening sentences are laying a foundation and so should be scrutinised carefully.


_________________
Ron Bailey

 2004/7/9 6:04Profile





©2002-2020 SermonIndex.net
Promoting Genuine Biblical Revival.
Privacy Policy