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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Rebuilding the Walls

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MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3224
Texas

 Re:

If your asking my opinion I will be more than happy to humble myself and tell you I don't know enough about those particular scriptures to even go there, so to keep me from doing or saying something that I am not sure of I just choose to leave it be.

Trust me if it were "my' calling to do this God would give me an abundance of knowledge of these particular scriptures and he would tell me through my spirit to go out among the Churches and tell these men or women, thats the best explanation I have for you, it's pretty cut and dry.


_________________
Mr. Bill

 2007/12/23 18:51Profile
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3224
Texas

 Re:

Quote:

glorytoglory wrote:

If that is the case than we should not be talking about any man's ministry, beliefs ect.. and these other threads would all have to be locked such as Joel Osteen ect..



Your asking me that? I "don't" talk about anyones ministry so I guess I am the wrong person to ask.
Sorry


_________________
Mr. Bill

 2007/12/23 18:52Profile









 Re:

Quote:

MrBillPro wrote:

Trust me if it were "my' calling to do this God would give me an abundance of knowledge of these particular scriptures and he would tell me through my spirit to go out among the Churches and tell these men or women, thats the best explanation I have for you, it's pretty cut and dry.




Thanks for your opinion. I feel the same way. I just think this IS where the church is at as far as having to choose between confronting these issues that arise in the church or choosing to ignore them all depending on if God has spoken to us about them. Maybe that is my opinion but I feel God has spoken to me. The church in America is not facing persecution really, poverty or famine we are facing a backslidden, prosperity preaching, Laodecian church. How are we as American christians going to handle these issues when we do face them?

Even if you choose not to do anything you have still made a choice.

I often wonder how many christians see the church as one. How many see that if a brother is suffering either in Africa or maybe NYC we all are suffering? Not recognizing your own body when it is crying out to us is the reason it is sick.

[b][color=000000]Isn't a healthy body one that functions properly? If it has a disease it immediately attacks the disease removing it from the body? If we don't recognize we have a body than we have a serious problem on our hands.[/color][/b]




 2007/12/23 20:03
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3224
Texas

 Re:

Quote:

glorytoglory wrote:
Even if you choose not to do anything you have still made a choice.



And your exactly right we do have to make a choice to do as "God" tells us not man, God uses us all differently, if he used us all for the same thing there sure would be a lot of unfinished business to take care of and he would never be able to come back.
I already know what my calling is to Minister to folks through my business and I have done this for over 20 years and best thing is, I don't have to worry about getting fired. :-)


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Mr. Bill

 2007/12/24 1:03Profile
ccchhhrrriiisss
Member



Joined: 2003/11/23
Posts: 4499


 Re:

Hi glorytoglory...

Quote:
So do you think we should not talk about Joel Olsteen or anyone else for that matter? What if we have gone to our brother in private and have than taken 2 or 3 with us should we still not take it to the church than?? What is your idea of handling matters in the church according to Matthew 18:16-17? Do you think it's a big mistake on our part to talk about Joel Olsteen's beliefs, ministry ect...? Seriously I really would like to hear how we are suppose to attend to matters that get out of hand in the church.

Matthew 18:16-17

16But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.

17And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church:

Yes, I feel that it can be appropriate to talk about ANYTHING amongst believers -- as long as it doesn't stray into the realm of slander, speculation, assumption or gossip. I have noticed that some of the posts about men like Joel Osteen (and even President Bush) have occasionally slipped into such realms. When we speak about individuals (and their beliefs) as if we knew all manners of their beliefs as a fact -- then we can err in such conversations.

It is more appropriate, I believe, to discuss the doctrinal error (or supposed error) than to point at the man. Yes, we can mention that a particular doctrine is one that is (to the best of our knowledge) espoused by a particular public figure. But we really need to be as factual as possible when mentioning a man's beliefs. Are we completely sure that this is something that is believed by a particular person?

If you use the verse that you provided in a manner in which you seem to suggest, then this entire message board (and all of our Christian conversations) would center around ERROR. Why? There is a lot of error being taught or believed by members of the Church. Should we discipline a brother because they sincerely hold a doctrine that is contrary to our own? Can a disagreement exist in which we don't have to excommunicate or expel a brother or sister from our fellowship?

I know individuals who I firmly consider part of the Body of Christ who hold some doctrinal beliefs that I feel are error. Some hold (in sincerity) doctrines that are obviously false , while others simply hold a doctrinal view that is contrary to my own. Should I point out these brethren in a public manner? What if someone felt the same way about YOU? Would you appreciate being pointed out as a doctrinal heretic simply because of a belief?

We really need to be careful about our words. Words are powerful things. They can heal and they can kill. They can comfort and they can discourage. Yes, there is a need for Church discipline, but we had better make sure that we are 100% correct in both our beliefs and our manner in which such discipline is carried out. Otherwise, we will have a lot of verbal crucifixions being carried out.

:-(


_________________
Christopher

 2007/12/24 10:04Profile









 Re:

Quote:

MrBillPro wrote:
Quote:

glorytoglory wrote:
Even if you choose not to do anything you have still made a choice.



And your exactly right we do have to make a choice to do as "God" tells us not man, God uses us all differently, if he used us all for the same thing there sure would be a lot of unfinished business to take care of and he would never be able to come back.
I already know what my calling is to Minister to folks through my business and I have done this for over 20 years and best thing is, I don't have to worry about getting fired. :-)




What if I worked for you and you knew I was a professing christian and we went to the same church but you found out I was stealing from you? Even on this message board we run into those we disagree with. I'm sure you could not say you have never had to correct anyone. Don't we have any responsability at all to each other as members of the body of Christ.

Aside from that, if you allowed employees to curse at your business and you posted it on your door and made it publically clear you don't mind would it be gossip if I told others you don't mind? What if you had a sign on your door saying heretics welcome, blasphemers welcome. Would you say it is gossip if I told others about your sign?






 2007/12/24 10:08
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3224
Texas

 Re:

Quote:

glorytoglory wrote:
What if I worked for you and you knew I was a professing Christian and we went to the same church but you found out I was stealing from you? Even on this message board we run into those we disagree with. I'm sure you could not say you have never had to correct anyone. Don't we have any responsibility at all to each other as members of the body of Christ.

Aside from that, if you allowed employees to curse at your business and you posted it on your door and made it publically clear you don't mind would it be gossip if I told others you don't mind? What if you had a sign on your door saying heretics welcome, blasphemers welcome. Would you say it is gossip if I told others about your sign?



I will have to have some time to answer that, because that is about the most far fetched hypothetical example I have ever seen, I will try some day to get back to this. :-P
I will try to see how that example is supposed to make me do something I am not called to do and that's go to these Ministers and correct them, I am not even that scripturally knowledgeable to even confront one in the first place, that would be like me defending myself in a court room. :-)


_________________
Mr. Bill

 2007/12/24 13:02Profile









 Re:

Quote:

MrBillPro wrote:
Quote:

glorytoglory wrote:
What if I worked for you and you knew I was a professing Christian and we went to the same church but you found out I was stealing from you? Even on this message board we run into those we disagree with. I'm sure you could not say you have never had to correct anyone. Don't we have any responsibility at all to each other as members of the body of Christ.

Aside from that, if you allowed employees to curse at your business and you posted it on your door and made it publically clear you don't mind would it be gossip if I told others you don't mind? What if you had a sign on your door saying heretics welcome, blasphemers welcome. Would you say it is gossip if I told others about your sign?



I will have to have some time to answer that, because that is about the most far fetched hypothetical example I have ever seen, I will try some day to get back to this. :-P
I will try to see how that example is supposed to make me do something I am not called to do and that's go to these Ministers and correct them, I am not even that scripturally knowledgeable to even confront one in the first place, that would be like me defending myself in a court room. :-)




That's not far fetched. Haven't you ever atleast disagreed with another brother or sister to the point you felt like you should say something? Surely you have.

It happens on sermon index all the time.

 2007/12/24 14:21
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3224
Texas

 Re:

Quote:

glorytoglory wrote:
That's not far fetched. Haven't you ever at least disagreed with another brother or sister to the point you felt like you should say something? Surely you have.

It happens on sermon index all the time.




Yes but I have yet to come to their home and confront them as we would a Pastor "are suppose to a Pastor" and also most here this is not their profession, I guess I really don't understand you but thats ok I have been guilty of not understanding folks before, and sure I will into the future because my understanding is limited unlike Gods.


_________________
Mr. Bill

 2007/12/24 14:41Profile









 Re:

Quote:

MrBillPro wrote:
Quote:

glorytoglory wrote:
That's not far fetched. Haven't you ever at least disagreed with another brother or sister to the point you felt like you should say something? Surely you have.

It happens on sermon index all the time.




Yes but I have yet to come to their home and confront them as we would a Pastor "are suppose to a Pastor" and also most here this is not their profession, I guess I really don't understand you but thats ok I have been guilty of not understanding folks before, and sure I will into the future because my understanding is limited unlike Gods.



You don't have to be a pastor to confront someone. Jesus did not say this to just pastors but all christians. This is the way things should be handled in the church. You can't ignore the body that is why the body is suffering and especially here in America. Untimately if all else fails God intervenes and I have witnessed this many times.

 2007/12/24 14:59





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