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 Re:

Quote:

allhavsinned wrote:
does God speak to us audibly today (as in the OT to the prophets) or not. And don't forget to back up what you say with scripture (in context ;-))
Steve


I have no Scripture or tape recorder to back it up but I have heard the audible voice of God twice in my life. cannot "PROVE" to anyone that I heard Him speak to me but no one, absolutely no one can take it away from me. I know what I heard. And I know what fruit of both of those times came out of it... my life's direction did a 180 for His glory! I thank Him profusely for taking the time to audibly direct my path.

 2007/11/29 6:28
BenWilliams
Member



Joined: 2006/12/11
Posts: 351
El Paso, Texas

 Re:

allhavesinned wrote:

Quote:
Whatever Paris Reidhead or Carter Conlon says is irrelevant, just as whatever Todd and Ray says is irrelevant. What matters is what the Word of God says. What you have described regarding "leading" or "God's voice" is not based on anything in the Word of God (except some verses that you have taken out of context), but is something that you have taken to be God speaking with you when it could in fact be you speaking to you in your thoughts.

That's why it's so important to let the Word of God be the source of our guidance and not our own thoughts. Those are relative. His Word is absolute and there is no doubt where that came from.



First of all, the burden of proof is in your court to prove that God no longer speaks to people, or that there are no new revelations.

Both are foolishness, but I will show simply how they are such.

Let's look at what Paul says here in I Corinthians.

[b][color=FF0000]I Corinthians 12:1-2

1Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant.

2Ye know that ye were Gentiles, carried away unto these dumb idols, even as ye were led.[/color][/b]

What is a dumb idol?

If you know anything about language, or history of words, a dumb idol meant an idol that could not communicate, could not speak. Why did Paul make a point of this?

I am assuming that you don't believe that any signs or wonders are for today either, because why would you? You believe in a God that has no relationship with His people.

You probably have never done a study on God to see what His character is concerning speaking to His people. If you did, you would find that God is the God who sees, God is the God who hears, God is the God who speaks.

Let me ask you this, does God answer prayers?

If He does, then He speaks, so you are driven to believe either in a God who speaks, or to a God who does not answer prayer, your choice.

By the way, this is only two verses, if I have to, I can make an outline of all the speakings of God, or the Holy Spirit throughout the NT, and then you really have a problem, because it does not say anywhere that those things have stopped.
-------------------------------------------------


One other thing, and this is for a few people who posted here, ya'll have said that you believe there are no new revelations, what about the revelation of God's mercy, which the scripture says is new every morning?

If there is one that is new every morning, what about the revelation of God's love, His patience, His kindness, His wisdom?

Besides all that, if God gives a man a word of knowledge, that is a new revelation, because it was not known before, and it was a supernatural piece of information, which is revelation.

I think ya'll are speaking from a lack of experience, because God has spoken things to me when I was ministering many times where it was something I had no way of knowing, and yet it was 100% accurate when I spoke it to whoever it was for.


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Benjamin Williams

 2007/11/29 10:57Profile
IRONMAN
Member



Joined: 2004/6/15
Posts: 1924
IN HEAVENLY PLACES WITH JESUS

 God Speaks alright...

Greetings in Jesus' Name by Whose Blood we are Saved.AMEN.

Jesus spoke to people right? Jesus is God, God still speaks to people.

God also speaks to His people through His Angels also:

Acts 8:

[b][color=0000FF]26 And a messenger of the Lord spake unto Philip, saying, `Arise, and go on toward the south, on the way that is going down from Jerusalem to Gaza,' -- this is desert. [/color][/b]

This angel was clearly sent of God so we know he spoke as God instructed him to.

We also have the account of the Revelation...that was Jesus speaking John and asking him to write it all down, as well as what He showed John:

Rev 1:

[b][color=0000FF]9 I, John, who also [am] your brother, and fellow-partner in the tribulation, and in the reign and endurance, of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, because of the word of God, and because of the testimony of Jesus Christ; 10 I was in the Spirit on the Lord's-day,[/color][/b][u][i][b][color=0000FF]and I heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet, saying, 11 `I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last;' [/color][/b][/i][/u]

so John heard the Voice of Jesus telling him what to do...Jesus told us Holy Spirit would come and teach us and that teaching involves speaking to men among other things also like the word, i hear Him speak to me as i read something and He reveals something about it to me. God speaks to us in voice but most of us don't have ears to hear...it is no different to the days of old in which men would say "i heard God talk to me today" and people would be like "yeah uh huh..."Those that heard God's voice were often thought of as nuts in the same way that those of us who say the same thing now are thought of as nuts. the hearts of men don't change do they?

God does still speak audibly...to those who would hear anyway. All the same may God continue perfecting us in spite of ourselves.AMEN.

Grace and Peace are ours in Jesus.AMEN.


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Farai Bamu

 2007/11/29 12:14Profile
PreachParsly
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Joined: 2005/1/14
Posts: 2164
Arkansas

 Re:

Quote:
allhavsinned,

Whatever Paris Reidhead or Carter Conlon says is irrelevant, just as whatever Todd and Ray says is irrelevant. What matters is what the Word of God says. What you have described regarding "leading" or "God's voice" is not based on anything in the Word of God (except some verses that you have taken out of context), but is something that you have taken to be God speaking with you when it could in fact be you speaking to you in your thoughts.

That's why it's so important to let the Word of God be the source of our guidance and not our own thoughts. Those are relative. His Word is absolute and there is no doubt where that came from.

Blessings,

Jon



Hi Jon,

I had a few thoughts that came to mind and I thought I would ask. I' m not meaning to be provocative.

How do you know you're converted? Is it because you have deduced this fact from scripture or because the spirit bears witness with you that you are a child of God?

I know that the Bible doesn't say "Josh Parsley is a Christian." So, don't I have to go on some type of perception or conscience that God has accepted me? If so, wouldn't I have to believe "God spoke to me that I have peace with Him?"

I think we have to have a combination of the Spirit bearing witness with us and it being in line with the Bible.


_________________
Josh Parsley

 2007/11/29 12:20Profile









 Re:

Quote:

Whatever Paris Reidhead or Carter Conlon says is irrelevant, just as whatever Todd and Ray says is irrelevant. What matters is what the Word of God says.




I have found that when people write this what they are really saying is "What matters is how I interpret what the word of God says".

as seen here

Quote:

but is something that you have taken to be God speaking with you when it could in fact be you speaking to you in your thoughts.



so what great men of God have said regarding a matter of doctrine should not be considered but what you say should?

Seems kinda prideful to me. I'm not trying to play the man here, just this ball that is often thrown into play in discussions here on SI.

God has clearly spoken to me in situations such as a word of knowledge for someone and even who to witness to out on the streets in a crowd. He has bore witness to this working. May we have ears to hear.

(BTW love WOTM radio and thank God for it, as usual with modern ministries I dont agree with every apsect of it)

In Christ - Jim

 2007/11/29 12:58
IRONMAN
Member



Joined: 2004/6/15
Posts: 1924
IN HEAVENLY PLACES WITH JESUS

 Re:

Greetings in Jesus' Name by Whose Blood we are Saved.AMEN.

bro Jim
from my own experience of what was said about the voice of God sounding like your thoughts, what i hear sounds like my own voice but the giveaway is that the thoughts are something other than what i would think on otherwise. Furthermore it has been confirmed by His word, events and other saints also. it's like you said when you got a word of knowledge from another brother, that is God speaking to you albeit using the voice of a brother. that brother is the vessel.

you said:

Quote:
May we have ears to hear.



may we have ears to hear indeed.AMEN.

Grace and Peace are ours in Jesus.AMEN.


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Farai Bamu

 2007/11/29 13:13Profile
allhavsinned
Member



Joined: 2005/8/1
Posts: 201
North West England

 Re:

BenWilliams could you edit your post you made it look as though I wrote that statement when actually Jon wrote it to answer me.

for the rest of "ya'll" Thanks for the encouragement, like I said I like Todd Friel but I find the way he pushes the questionable side of his doctrines to be annoying, he has so much influence that some weaker Christians might not follow the voice of God because they don't like it, though I would agree that what He speaks to us MUST be in line with Scripture.

Another point I wanted to mention to Jon, what about those who don't have access to a bible, those alone in prison, can God not speak to them?

Also...
Jn 10:24 Then came the Jews round about him, and said unto him,
How long dost thou make us to doubt? If thou be the Christ,
tell us plainly.
Jn 10:25 Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not:
the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of
me.
Jn 10:26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as
I said unto you.
Jn 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they
follow me:
Jn 10:28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never
perish, neither shall any [man] pluck them out of my hand.
Jn 10:29 My Father, which gave [them] me, is greater than all;
and no [man] is able to pluck [them] out of my Father's hand.
Jn 10:30 I and [my] Father are one.

What does Jesus mean if he doesn't mean 'My sheep hear my voice'? Why is this out of context?

and...

Isa 30:19 For the people shall dwell in Zion at Jerusalem: thou shalt weep no more: he will be very gracious unto thee at the voice of thy cry; when he shall hear it, he will answer thee.
Isa 30:20 And though the Lord give you the bread of adversity, and the water of affliction, yet shall not thy teachers be removed into a corner any more, but thine eyes shall see thy teachers:
Isa 30:21 And thine ears shall hear a word behind thee, saying, This is the way, walk ye in it, when ye turn to the right hand, and when ye turn to the left.

Again I realise He's talking to the Jews here but I think this verse applies to us (the Church) too, I'm open to you showing me where I'm wrong.

Steve


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Ste

 2007/11/29 16:23Profile
Smokey
Member



Joined: 2005/2/21
Posts: 417
Edmonton Alberta Cda.

 Re: Hearing God? not Todd friel


Joh 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will show you things to come.

Seems pretty clear to me.

Blessings Greg :-)


_________________
Greg

 2007/11/29 17:51Profile
allhavsinned
Member



Joined: 2005/8/1
Posts: 201
North West England

 Re:

Just to put you all in the picture, if you go to WayOfTheMaster Radio and listen to Hour2 of 29th November, Todd gives a good 10 mins to this subject and clearly says that God only speaks through the bible, not audibly.

The question he askes is 'is Scripture sufficient' and then goes on to say that if you believe that then you don't need to hear God's voice, but if you claim to hear God speaking to you then you don't believe that Scripture is sufficient. I am sorry but Todd is dead wrong on this, as is mentioned above by bible believing Christians who have heard the voice of God.

Yes the scriptures are sufficient but why does that stop God from speaking. Todd believes that if God speaks another word (small w) then He is giving a new revelation!

I'm a bit of a legalist myself, that is to say that I err on the side of 'if you think it may be wrong, keep away from it' so I should agree with Todd, and I wouldn't tell anyone that they must hear from God to be a Christian, But I believe in a loving God, who cares for His children, (those who have received Him, John 1) and corrects them, and encourages them, does He use the bible for this? Yes very much so and those who don't read the bible often miss out on a lot that He has to say, but there are circumstances when He speaks. let me tell you a quick story...

Afew months ago I was witnessing to a Johovah's Witness and they don't believe God speaks to us, I told her outright 'God is talking to me now as I talk to you, he's prompting me with scriptures and helping me keep focus' I have no Idea weather or not she believed me but I said that because I was sure of it. Put it this way, either God was talking to me by putting scripture verses (passages not chapter and verse) in my mind, or I'm a lot cleverer than I think because normally I can't come up with them at the right time.

Another one, My dad, never been a Christian, still not one, one day in his garden he heard God say 'are you coming now?' (something to that effect) and he replied 'not yet I'v a few problems I want to sort out first'. was that God or a momentary lapse of reason.

My wife last year I asked her if she wanted to go to Israel with my mum, she replied 'no' later that day she was thinking about it and a verse popped into her head, this time it was a reference, so she looked it up and lo an behold it said 'go up to Jerusalem' She told me and I told my mum who said she'd been reading the parable where Jesus says 'one son said he would go and didn't the other said he wouldn't go and he did'. You see I believe God speaks through the scriptures and sometimes he audibly quotes it for us.

Again let me ask what about those who have no bible?

Withoug rambling on I just want to say that I still like Todd, he's overall a better Christian than I am and He knows the scriptures more than I, that's why I'm not writing this to him, he'd just bury me in theology. So I've come to you guys to find the truth, it appears so far that I'm heading in the right direction, are there anythings I'm falling short on?

Just one quickie, if the scripture is sufficient as he says (of course it is) why do we need the book 'Decisions Decisions' (available at WOTMR) to be able to understand the bible better?
Can not God's Holy Spirit guide us as we read it, to understand it better? I think this is the point Greg was making above.

Steve


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Ste

 2007/11/29 20:57Profile
vico
Member



Joined: 2005/5/25
Posts: 258


 Re: Hearing God? not Todd friel

Revelation 2:29 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

John 10:2-5 But he that entereth in by the door is the shepherd of the sheep.
To him the porter openeth; and the sheep hear his voice: and he calleth his own sheep by name, and leadeth them out.
And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice.
And a stranger will they not follow, but will flee from him: for they know not the voice of strangers.

John 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

grace and peace be multiplied to you brother.

 2007/11/29 21:25Profile





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