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Discussion Forum : General Topics : Tithing-In the New Testament Church

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BlazedbyGod
Member



Joined: 2007/8/22
Posts: 462


 Tithing-In the New Testament Church

This is just a question or thought of mine that I had:

But, if we-the Church-New Testament believers-are NOT under the Law of Moses-but are under grace, and of the Spirit of the Living God; then why do we Tithe in the New Testament?

2. In 90% of Old Testament scripture-tithing itself was mostly from what I see corn, oil, wine, oxen, etc...and only a few instances was it money.


Again, this is something that I just thought of-this is not, and I don't want it to turn into condemning people who pay tithes or condemning people who don't pay tithes-I just want your thoughts, understanding, knowledge or revelation of the topic. Thanks in advance.
:-D

 2007/11/16 15:57Profile









 Re: Tithing-In the New Testament Church

Careful Blaze... you're starting to think about things instead of just accepting what you've been taught!!

Thats never a good thing! ;-)

Tithing is never once taught by the Apostles to the NT church. Paul, in all of writings, including that of giving, never once even hints that the NT believer should tithe as did the OT believers under the Law.

Not once.

Never.

Zip.

Nada.

However... God owns it all. He has made us stewards of what He blesses us with. We should give ALL to God, not just 10%.

But God wants a cheerful giver. Not someone who gives out of compulsion by the Law.

Krispy

 2007/11/16 16:04









 Re: Tithing-In the New Testament Church

Quote:

BlazedbyGod wrote:
This is just a question or thought of mine that I had:

But, if we-the Church-New Testament believers-are NOT under the Law of Moses-but are under grace, and of the Spirit of the Living God; then why do we Tithe in the New Testament?

2. In 90% of Old Testament scripture-tithing itself was mostly from what I see corn, oil, wine, oxen, etc...and only a few instances was it money.


Again, this is something that I just thought of-this is not, and I don't want it to turn into condemning people who pay tithes or condemning people who don't pay tithes-I just want your thoughts, understanding, knowledge or revelation of the topic. Thanks in advance.
:-D



I do not believe that we tythe as in a certain percentage. They were led by the Holy Ghost and gave as every man had need. Key word here being "NEED".

Acts 5:3
But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land?

Acts 4:34-36
34Neither was there any among them that lacked: for as many as were possessors of lands or houses sold them, and brought the prices of the things that were sold,

35And laid them down at the apostles' feet: and distribution was made unto every man according as he had need.




 2007/11/16 16:06
reformer
Member



Joined: 2007/6/25
Posts: 764


 Re:

Good post, I have deali ng with tithing and offerings. I am not opposed of giving. I feel like all I have been taught was a deception of the truth. I have been spoon fed what to believe about tithing. I am going to seek scripture and not rely on someone to tell me to give. I understand there are things that need to be mantained at church, that is just part of having a building. The church I left had an annual budget of 3.5 million and 1.5 million went to personnel ministry...11 fulltime ministers, 7 other fulltime personnel, this includes medical and dental and retirement.That is seperate from the debt we have aquired! Is it tithing, or is it just paying the bills. To me just ask, we need to keep the lights on and just call it what it is.

you can link to their website to look at the budget and judge for yourself.

I question if what is going on today is biblical. I do want to support the church and I think we should, I don't want to use this as an excuse on not to tithe. i am seeking God about this and believe HE will give me clear thought, and not sit in condemnation because I may miss out on a blessing from God if I don't give...hog wash!!


Blessings :-)
mike

 2007/11/16 16:22Profile
Miccah
Member



Joined: 2007/9/13
Posts: 1752
Wisconsin

 Re:

[u][b]Luke 18:22 (NKJV)[/b][/u]

[i]So when Jesus heard these things, He said to him, “You still lack one thing. Sell all that you have and distribute to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me[/i]


[u][b]Luke 21:1-4 (NKJV)[/b][/u]

[i]And He looked up and saw the rich putting their gifts into the treasury, and He saw also a certain poor widow putting in two mites. So He said, “Truly I say to you that this poor widow has put in more than all; for all these out of their abundance have put in offerings for God, but she out of her poverty put in all the livelihood that she had.”[/i]


Everywhere you look, Jesus did not talk about tithing. The only thing that you see is where Jesus says to sell everything and give it away.

The reference of laying down everything at the diciples feet is another good verse on this.



[u][b]Acts 2:44-47 (NKJV)[/b][/u]

[i]Now all who believed were together, and had all things in common, and sold their possessions and goods, and divided them among all, as anyone had need.
So continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, they ate their food with gladness and simplicity of heart, praising God and having favor with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily those who were being saved.[/i]

[u][b]Acts 4:32-35 (NKJV)[/b][/u]

[i]Now the multitude of those who believed were of one heart and one soul; neither did anyone say that any of the things he possessed was his own, but they had all things in common. And with great power the apostles gave witness to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus. And great grace was upon them all. Nor was there anyone among them who lacked; for all who were possessors of lands or houses sold them, and brought the proceeds of the things that were sold, and laid them at the apostles’ feet; and they distributed to each as anyone had need.[/i]

[u][b]2 Corinthians 9:6-15 (NKJV)[/b][/u]

[i]But this I say: He who sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and he who sows bountifully will also reap bountifully. So let each one give as he purposes in his heart, not grudgingly or of necessity; for God loves a cheerful giver. And God is able to make all grace abound toward you, that you, always having all sufficiency in all things, may have an abundance for every good work. As it is written:


“ He has dispersed abroad,
He has given to the poor;
His righteousness endures forever.”

Now may He who supplies seed to the sower, and bread for food, supply and multiply the seed you have sown and increase the fruits of your righteousness, while you are enriched in everything for all liberality, which causes thanksgiving through us to God. For the administration of this service not only supplies the needs of the saints, but also is abounding through many thanksgivings to God, while, through the proof of this ministry, they glorify God for the obedience of your confession to the gospel of Christ, and for your liberal sharing with them and all men, and by their prayer for you, who long for you because of the exceeding grace of God in you. Thanks be to God for His indescribable gift![/i]

Tithing is important, but not mandated. If anything is mandated by Jesus, I read only to give it all to the poor. In Acts and 2 Cor, we are supposed to divided amongst one another, lay it (money) at the diciples feet, and give with a cheerful heart.

I give with a cheerful heart. The Lord honors those who honor Him, and I try to honor Him daily. Giving is another way to honor the Lord.

[u][b]1 samuel 2:30 (NKJV)[/b][/u]

[i]...for those who honor Me I will honor...[/i]

Christiaan



_________________
Christiaan

 2007/11/16 16:58Profile
LoveHim
Member



Joined: 2007/6/14
Posts: 562
Indiana, US

 Re:

dear brothers,

i have not talked to many people at all about this issue because my "church" is very pro-tithing. but i would encourage everyone to really look into how the early church operated and by what means they did so. many churches may use tithing to pay the bills, but then there are churches that operate on very little money but alot of love and dependence upon the Holy Spirit..

do i personally believe in tithing as something that we are bound to in the NT?? no. but i long for a church that wants people to give so that they can take all the offering and give it to those who are in need. missionaries, poor, people within the congregation who are hurting, etc.

but i understand why some people tithe and do my best not allow a disagreement on a small doctrine overshadow the unity and love with one another that we should have.. but if we're not careful, that is what can easily happen

phil

 2007/11/16 17:14Profile
BenWilliams
Member



Joined: 2006/12/11
Posts: 351
El Paso, Texas

 Re:

This has always been an issue to me that I have not agreed with most churches on.

We all know that the new testament does not teach tithing, that was a requirement of the children of Israel according to the law.

First thing about that is that as gentiles, the law was not given to us, it was given to the children of Israel, we were not ever obligated to fulfill any part of that law. We have only been obligated to fulfill the law of our consciences.

Now, a couple of things, one has already been mentioned a bit, and that is that we are to give, as led by the Holy Spirit, not out of the letter of the law, but out of a heart that is sensitive to what the Spirit of God is saying.

I believe churches out of desperation to keep themselves running have often turned to tithing, because it is principle like, and is easy to teach, it is march harder to stand in faith, believing that God will move upon the people to support the church and it's missions every month. I don't believe all churches are guilty of this, but I do believe they are not diligent to seek the Lord on this, rather they just follow tradition, because it has worked in the past, so it must be true.

I feel like the constant passing of money buckets makes a church look cheap, money hungry, and money driven. Every week, a five or ten minute sermon on tithing, and how great and good it is. Why not teach the people to hear from the Lord, and then tell them how much money the church needs a month, or a week to keep running, and let God impress upon the hearts of men and women to do what is needed.

Lastly, one thing that ministers do not talk about very much is this, when Paul was with the Jewish Christians, he told them they had a responsibility to support the ministers of God full time so that they could minister freely to the people.

But when he was with the gentiles, he did no such thing, rather he worked for a living, making tents, and then ministered when he was not working.

Perhaps if we saw a little more of that, we would see more humble pastors.


_________________
Benjamin Williams

 2007/11/16 18:35Profile









 Re: Tithing-In the New Testament Church

Why we pay Tithe?

1. It belongs to God.
2. It is Holy.
3. Because we love Him.
4. We Obey God's commandments.
5. God appointed Jesus to receive Tithe.
6. There is no lacking in God's House
7.We may receive bountiful blessings.
8. There is no lacking in servant of God's life.

 2007/11/16 20:52









 Re:

Quote:

Miccah wrote:
Tithing is important, but not mandated. If anything is mandated by Jesus, I read only to give it all to the poor. In Acts and 2 Cor, we are supposed to divided amongst one another, lay it (money) at the diciples feet, and give with a cheerful heart.

I give with a cheerful heart. The Lord honors those who honor Him, and I try to honor Him daily. Giving is another way to honor the Lord.

[u][b]1 samuel 2:30 (NKJV)[/b][/u]
[i]...for those who honor Me I will honor...[/i]
Christiaan



If I could, I'd like to add what you said about, "I read only to give it all to the poor." I personally believe that includes widows and/or orphans.

My sister is a widow and she must pay anyone to come to her house to do anything. No one from her 1,200 seat / 2 services a day church EVER has offered to come and minister to her but where has she pay her tithes for the last 20 years? You guessed it. [I need to say here and now that she has never complained or connected the dots. I would never say this to her nor even cause her to connect any dots that I might "think" I see.]

But I think it's terrible, if her church is doing this to her, there are millions of other widows going through the same thing.

Another post....................
Quote:

LoveHim wrote:
dear brothers,

i have not talked to many people at all about this issue because my "church" is very pro-tithing.

phil



Aren't they all? Or at least the "big" ones are. They need money to run those big buildings, this is why most churches are run like a business anymore.

I grew up going to a church where the pastor and his wife gutted a house that they owned and everything was open and we had church there for 30 years. Oh my gosh, they even kept the out house into the early 80's!!! They saved the money that came in and helped whoever needed help, had missionary journey's and in 1982 when they decided to build a church, they paid cash for it. In 1982, $190,000 cash was a LOT of money.

My point is they made due and did not go into debt so that they had to beg bread from everyone to pay the bills of the church.

Just so no one gets the wrong idea... I believe in giving and giving with a cheerful heart!! But I do NOT believe in what most of the church today is doing... going into debt and fleecing the sheep on a weekly basis because of it.

 2007/11/16 22:34
Miccah
Member



Joined: 2007/9/13
Posts: 1752
Wisconsin

 Re:

Intens4Him wrote:

Quote:


If I could, I'd like to add what you said about, "I read only to give it all to the poor." I personally believe that includes widows and/or orphans.



100% agree. I lumped them into the poor catagory. Thanks for pointing this out

In Christ,

Christiaan


_________________
Christiaan

 2007/11/17 0:24Profile





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