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 WOF scandal... here we go again!

[b]Scandal Brewing at Oral Roberts[/b]
Saturday, October 06, 2007

By JUSTIN JUOZAPAVICIUS, Associated Press Writer

Foxnews.com

TULSA, Okla. — Twenty years ago, televangelist Oral Roberts said he was reading a spy novel when God appeared to him and told him to raise $8 million for Roberts' university, or else he would be "called home."

Now, his son, Oral Roberts University President Richard Roberts, says God is speaking again, telling him to deny lurid allegations in a lawsuit that threatens to engulf this 44-year-old Bible Belt college in scandal.

Richard Roberts is accused of illegal involvement in a local political campaign and lavish spending at donors' expense, including numerous home remodeling projects, use of the university jet for his daughter's senior trip to the Bahamas, and a red Mercedes convertible and a Lexus SUV for his wife, Lindsay.

She is accused of dropping tens of thousands of dollars on clothes, awarding nonacademic scholarships to friends of her children and sending scores of text messages on university-issued cell phones to people described in the lawsuit as "underage males."

At a chapel service this week on the 5,300-student campus known for its 60-foot-tall bronze sculpture of praying hands, Roberts said God told him: "We live in a litigious society. Anyone can get mad and file a lawsuit against another person whether they have a legitimate case or not. This lawsuit ... is about intimidation, blackmail and extortion."

San Antonio televangelist John Hagee, a member of the ORU board of regents, said the university's executive board "is conducting a full and thorough investigation."

Colleagues fear for the reputation of the university and the future of the Roberts' ministry, which grew from Southern tent revivals to one of the most successful evangelical empires in the country, hauling in tens of millions of dollars in contributions a year. The university reported nearly $76 million in revenue in 2005, according to the IRS.

Oral Roberts is 89 and lives in California. He holds the title of chancellor, but the university describes him as semi-retired, and his son presides over day-to-day operations on the campus, which had a modern, space-age design when it was built in the early 1960s but now looks dated, like Disney's Tomorrowland.

Cornell Cross II, a senior from Burlington, Vt., said he is looking to transfer to another school because the scandal has "severely devalued and hurt the reputation of my degree."

"We have asked and asked and asked to see the finances of our school and what they're doing with our money, and we've been told no," said, Cross who is majoring in government. "Now we know why. As a student, I'm not going to stand for it any longer."

The allegations are contained in a lawsuit filed Tuesday by three former professors. They sued ORU and Roberts, alleging they were wrongfully dismissed after reporting the school's involvement in a local political race.

Richard Roberts, according to the suit, asked a professor in 2005 to use his students and university resources to aid a county commissioner's bid for Tulsa mayor. Such involvement would violate state and federal law because of the university's nonprofit status. Up to 50 students are alleged to have worked on the campaign.

The professors also said their dismissals came after they turned over to the board of regents a copy of a report documenting moral and ethical lapses on the part of Roberts and his family. The internal document was prepared by Stephanie Cantese, Richard Roberts' sister-in-law, according to the lawsuit.

An ORU student repairing Cantese's laptop discovered the document and later provided a copy to one of the professors.

It details dozens of alleged instances of misconduct. Among them:

_ A longtime maintenance employee was fired so that an underage male friend of Mrs. Roberts could have his position.

_ Mrs. Roberts _ who is a member of the board of regents and is referred to as ORU's "first lady" on the university's Web site _ frequently had cell-phone bills of more than $800 per month, with hundreds of text messages sent between 1 a.m. to 3 a.m. to "underage males who had been provided phones at university expense."

_ The university jet was used to take one daughter and several friends on a senior trip to Orlando, Fla., and the Bahamas. The $29,411 trip was billed to the ministry as an "evangelistic function of the president."

_ Mrs. Roberts spent more than $39,000 at one Chico's clothing store alone in less than a year, and had other accounts in Texas and California. She also repeatedly said, "As long as I wear it once on TV, we can charge it off." The document cites inconsistencies in clothing purchases and actual usage on TV.

_ Mrs. Roberts was given a white Lexus SUV and a red Mercedes convertible by ministry donors.

_ University and ministry employees are regularly summoned to the Roberts' home to do the daughters' homework.

_ The university and ministry maintain a stable of horses for exclusive use by the Roberts' children.

_ The Roberts' home has been remodeled 11 times in the past 14 years.

Tim Brooker, one of the professors who sued, said he fears for the university's survival if certain changes aren't made.

"All over that campus, there are signs up that say, `And God said, build me a university, build it on my authority, and build it on the Holy Spirit,'" Brooker said. "Unfortunately, ownership has shifted."

 2007/10/8 12:18
hmmhmm
Member



Joined: 2006/1/31
Posts: 4991
Sweden

 Re: WOF scandal... here we go again!

when i was unsaved, we as in me and my friends called people like this, i think american word is "con-men". The mystery to me is how they can be in ministry even to start with.... but anyway, this is grieving.... may God move and grant us repentance and save some of these "pastors" ,


_________________
CHRISTIAN

 2007/10/8 12:35Profile
makrothumia
Member



Joined: 2005/5/19
Posts: 608
Texas

 Re: WOF scandal... here we go again!

Thank you Krispy,

Let everything that is being done in secret be brought to the light. "It is light that makes everthing manifest." We are to expose the fruitless deeds of darkness, especially when they are committed by men who call themselves teachers. All who call themselves teachers should set the example like Paul who was able to say, "You know how holy, righeous, and blameless we were among you." May every false accusation be shown to be so, but let every hidden deed done in secret be exposed by the light.
Although I do not consider this good news, it is important news. Thank you,

Makrothumia


_________________
Alan and Dina Martin

 2007/10/8 12:36Profile
lovegrace
Member



Joined: 2006/8/12
Posts: 313


 Re: WOF scandal... here we go again!

Quick to judge. But it's okay Krispy.

One thing I thought was ironic.

The article said, "Richard Roberts, according to the suit, asked a professor in 2005 to use his students and university resources to aid a county commissioner's bid for Tulsa mayor. Such involvement would violate state and federal law because of the university's nonprofit status."

Hmm, the government controlling what a college does. This is why Calvary Chapel is 'for-profit' legally. So it can say and do what it wants freely instead of being resisted against, like ORU here.

Yes the rest is sad but understand this is a money issue. Not just a 'wof' thing. I've seen and heard many many Southern Baptist Pastors cheat on their wifes with a secretary. So, I'm not trying to 'bash' anyone. Just trying to have a 'sober judgement' cause Krispy is highly critical of the WOF and Charasmatics/Penetcostals.

I think the "Here we go again" title shows that immaturity.

In closing, Understand every denomination has it's "mess ups" and no church is perfect but it's God alone, Christ alone who we follow.

 2007/10/8 12:44Profile









 Re:

lovegrace, thank you for pointing out my immaturity. One day I hope to attain the heights of maturity that you have. :-) (I'm just poking fun atcha... dont get upset.)

Anyway... when did I ever say that these things dont happen in other "denominations"? There is a church that I know of that doctrinally is the polar opposite of ORU, yet the pastor has bilked over $40,000 out of his church's building fund... and the only ones now left in his church is his family.

He was, at one time, a very close friend of mine. He wont speak to me now because he didnt like my rebuke (he sought me out for support... didnt get it).

It's been a very painful thing to see what this fundamental Baptist preacher has done to the people who attended his church.

Personally, I think he should be in jail.

So before you go casting me as immature, perhaps it would be wise for you to walk a mile in my shoes.

The reason why I never brought this up on a thread was because this is a local issue concerning a little hole in the wall church out on a country road with a pastor no one here has ever heard of... so what is the point?

I [b]will[/b] bring up ORU because they are world renown. They claim to represent our Lord Jesus Christ (very poorly before this scandal, I might add). They have put themselves in the spotlight, and even tho they really dont represent people like me and you... in the eyes of the world at large, they are what people think of when they think of Church, Jesus and the Bible.

There is only one preacher that I can name who is not WOF that anyone in the world can name... and thats Billy Graham. And other than a few doctrinal nuances with which I disagree with him on, there has never been a scandal concerning him.

We cant say that about the others... WOF'ers like Benny Hinn, Joyce Meyer, TD Jakes, etc.

And just for the record, I had quite a bit to say about Ted Haggard, who isnt a WOF'er.

Lovegrace, you want to color me as being biased toward only WOF... but this simply is not true. I am biased for truth. Period. And my record on that is painfully documented on this forum.

Am I highly critical of Charismatics / Pentecostals? Not at all. I am critical of their heretical teachings. Same for WOF doctrine.

Henry David Thoreau once wrote about a period in his life in which he was thrown in jail for "civil disobedience"... I dont know what it was he was protesting against, doesnt matter. Anyway, a friend of his came to visit him and asked "What are you doing in here?" ... and Thoreau asked him "What are you doing out there?"

So yea, I earnestly contend for the faith as God thru Paul has commanded us to do. I am critical of Charismatic, Pentecostal and WOF doctrine. I am critial of heresies and heretics.

I have to ask... why arent you?

Krispy

PS I never said I disagree w/ all Charismatic and Pentecostal doctrines. You really need to spend more time reading my words on here and less time responding off the cuff. Do some homework first, please.

 2007/10/8 13:18
RobertW
Member



Joined: 2004/2/12
Posts: 4636
Independence, Missouri

 Re:

Quote:
So yea, I earnestly contend for the faith as God thru Paul has commanded us to do. I am critical of Charismatic, [i]Pentecostal[/i] and WOF doctrine.

I have to ask... why arent you?



How did Pentecostal get lumped into that group? :-o True classical pentecostals are not at all in step with Word of Faith or Charismatic teachings. The only real thing they have in common is their belief in the operation of the gifts of the Spirit. But that is mere Book of Acts Christianity. ;-)


_________________
Robert Wurtz II

 2007/10/8 13:30Profile









 Re:

Quote:
How did Pentecostal get lumped into that group? True classical pentecostals are not at all in step with Word of Faith or Charismatic teachings. The only real thing they have in common is their belief in the operation of the gifts of the Spirit. But that is mere Book of Acts Christianity.



Yea, I tried to clarify that when I added my PS. There are major differences between Pentecostal and Charismatic doctrine too. I didnt lump them together... lovegrace did. I was merely responding.

On points of salvation, I agree with Classic Pentecostal doctrine. I seperate from them mainly on the issue of tongues being the initial evidence of being filled with the Holy Spirit. I actually tend to go along with Charismatic doctrine on that one... tongues happens, but it is NOT given to every person. Thats scripture.

I disagree totally with the entire premise of WOF.

However, it needs to be said that the line between WOF and Charismatic is so blurred now it's barely distinguishable.

Anyway... lovegrace apparently doesnt understand the differences between Charismtic, Pentecostal and WOF, so he lumped them all together than left it in a bag on my front porch. I was just responding.

Krispy

 2007/10/8 13:39
Miccah
Member



Joined: 2007/9/13
Posts: 1752
Wisconsin

 Re:

Quote:

How did Pentecostal get lumped into that group? :-o True classical pentecostals are not at all in step with Word of Faith or Charismatic teachings. The only real thing they have in common is their belief in the operation of the gifts of the Spirit. But that is mere Book of Acts Christianity. ;-)



I'm critical of anyone who thinks that their way is the only way. Including myself. So in essence, why am I responding to myslef? :-P

Christiaan


_________________
Christiaan

 2007/10/8 13:45Profile
lovegrace
Member



Joined: 2006/8/12
Posts: 313


 Re:

Honestly, I don't know what to say. It's like I'm trying to have coffee with a lion.

Krispy, can we be civil?

Note: I've never ever meant to say "I'm more mature than you Krispy". Dude, I have long way to go and as the months and days go by, I realize how much more I need to grow.

I would also like to make a side note. That I NEVER said "Charismatic, Pentecostals, and WOF are the same" instead, here is an exact quote within the context of what I said.

Quote:
Just trying to have a 'sober judgment' cause Krispy is highly critical of the WOF and Charasmatics/Penetcostals.



Then to further prove this 'side-note' point. Krispy later posts this.

Quote:
I am critical of Charismatic, Pentecostal and WOF doctrine. I am critical of heresies and heretics.



Interesting you put 'Charismatic' and 'Pentecostal' with 'heresies'.


My observations by saying “Krispy is quick to judge WOF and Pentecostal's and Charismatic” is made because Krispy jumps into these topics with his ‘badge and gun’ trying to be God’s truth against these groups. Many of the times, he assumes way too much and in many ways takes the bad of each of these groups (Pente’s/WOF/Chara….) and roles them together and blames whichever the topic is at hand. For example, he would blame or condemn Charismatic for the life of Benny Hinn. Which isn’t the same group. Or blame the Pentecostals for the sins of WOF movement. They are each separate and unique. I would have examples posted but I’m not good at searching the archive of this website.

Also, I’ve seen you very very quick to judge these groups and slower judgments on more fundamental people. One example I can think of, is a slow judgment of Dr. Dino, who leans very fundamental in his beliefs but quick judgments against any of the 3 groups listed above, whether it’s their leaders or churches. Their were others but I'm trying to go by memory, which isn't perfect.


In conclusion, Krispy if you can't see that your VERY biased AGAINST these groups. I will say that you have a plank in your eye and you need NOT to worry about my 'speck'.

If anything, I encourage you to seek God and ask Him if He see's these things because I'm certain that He will show you in a more clear and perfect way.

Seek the Perfect One, not my partical statement. He will lead you into ALL truth.

 2007/10/16 18:05Profile
intrcssr83
Member



Joined: 2005/10/28
Posts: 246
Logan City, Queensland, Australia

 Re:

Quote:


Yea, I tried to clarify that when I added my PS. There are major differences between Pentecostal and Charismatic doctrine too. I didnt lump them together... lovegrace did. I was merely responding.

On points of salvation, I agree with Classic Pentecostal doctrine. I seperate from them mainly on the issue of tongues being the initial evidence of being filled with the Holy Spirit. I actually tend to go along with Charismatic doctrine on that one... tongues happens, but it is NOT given to every person. Thats scripture.

I disagree totally with the entire premise of WOF.

However, it needs to be said that the line between WOF and Charismatic is so blurred now it's barely distinguishable.

Anyway... lovegrace apparently doesnt understand the differences between Charismtic, Pentecostal and WOF, so he lumped them all together than left it in a bag on my front porch. I was just responding.

Krispy




Thanks for the clarification.
To the undiscerning reader however, it can easily come across as being that you were using WoF and other heretical extremes as a means of erecting a strawman argument against non-cessationist theology in general.

It is indeed a sad reality regarding the influences these people are having on christendom overall.

3If anyone teaches a different doctrine and does not agree with the sound words of our Lord Jesus Christ and the teaching that accords with godliness, 4he is puffed up with conceit and understands nothing. He has an unhealthy craving for controversy and for quarrels about words, which produce envy, dissension, slander, evil suspicions, 5and constant friction among people who are depraved in mind and deprived of the truth, imagining that godliness is a means of gain. 6Now there is great gain in godliness with contentment, 7for we brought nothing into the world, and we cannot take anything out of the world. 8But if we have food and clothing, with these we will be content. 9But those who desire to be rich fall into temptation, into a snare, into many senseless and harmful desires that plunge people into ruin and destruction. 10For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evils. It is through this craving that some have wandered away from the faith and pierced themselves with many pangs.
1 Timothy 6:3-10

Another thing is that this is no longer just a problem for the american church; it's being preached all over singapore as well (I'll create another thread about this.)


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Benjamin Valentine

 2007/10/16 23:17Profile





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