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Here4Him
Member



Joined: 2006/9/23
Posts: 212
England

 A vital doctrine the church has failed to teach me...

By God's grace He has in recent days begun to truly and beautifully reveal to me the wonderful and foundational doctrine of 'Oneness with Christ' or Unity with Christ.

It is becoming so precious to me, but i had never really seen it before. Maybe i was just being really dumb and it was taught in a subtle way and i just didnt get it, but i dont think so, i really believe that in over 14 years of attending church i have never heard a sermon in all the churches i have been to on this subject. I am angry and dissapointed about that. Im beginning to wonder if there is any docrtine more important than this?!! Its at the heart of the gospel and i am beginning to see that scrupture is always referring to it.

Now many passages of scripture are beginning to make sense, like Col 2:12 "buried with Him in baptism by which you also were raised with Him through faith". Now i know that to be a Christian to 'believe in Jesus' is to be In Jesus (or to be one with Him), and to be in Him means that when He died i died, when He was buried i was buried in Him, when He rose i rose with Him, and now He is in heaven at God's right hand and In Him i am there too! He is my life! Because I am in Him God can treat me as He would treat Him, all His righteousness is counted as mine, His perfect life is mine, His death for sins is counted as mine- Oh how wonderful it is to be 'In Christ!'.

Now i know that all my interaction with God is only because I am in Christ, the only reason God can answer my prayers is because I am in Christ and when I pray in Christ's Name i am praying to the Father in Him- i.e. as though i am Him, therefore how could He turn my requests away!!!

I believe that this is one of the foundational truths to the very understanding of the gospel and i believe it will be the key to unlock Romans 6 to me. Know i can begin to understand how I have died to sin in Christ.

Because i am 'in Christ' or one with Him i can bodly cry to out God 'Treat me as you would treat Him' And He does! Through a lively faith in Christ i become joined to Him- one with Him and through His life, death and resurection and His suffering on my behalf i get the same treatment from God that he has always got- all because He (as my representative) got the treatment i should have got for my sins and rebellion (God's wrath upon the cross). That is the gospel!!! And oh what a gospel!!!!

Is it me or is this a forgotten doctrine? I really think it needs to be taught once again. I love it! I want to know it and then teach it to every poor Christian who hasnt grasped it! Have you grasped it?


_________________
George Platt

 2007/9/24 8:27Profile









 Re: A vital doctrine the church has failed to teach me...

Quote:
Now i know that all my interaction with God is only because I am in Christ, the only reason God can answer my prayers is because I am in Christ and when I pray in Christ's Name i am praying to the Father in Him- i.e. as though i am Him, therefore how could He turn my requests away!!!



Amen, Amen, and Amen! We are dead, and our life is now hid with Christ, in God.

 2007/9/24 8:59









 Re: A vital doctrine the church has failed to teach me...


What a blessed post!

Thank you for sharing this. It's not new to me, but you've certainly stirred up my faith! And hope! It is wonderful to see you in full flight (as of 'on eagles' wings' ;-) )

Here4Him said

Quote:
Is it me or is this a forgotten doctrine? I really think it needs to be taught once again. I love it! I want to know it and then teach it to every poor Christian who hasnt grasped it! Have you grasped it?

Yes, but like you, rather a long way round! I knew I had been born again but so much was out of synch with the Spirit that I had to work very hard to bring the rest of my life into line with this truth ... and you won't be at all surprised to hear I'm realising it doesn't end. One doesn't [i]arrive[/i], in the sense of reaching a point where everything is completely [i]in order[/i] in this world. But there [i]is[/i] glorious rest and it everything [u]is[/u] completely in order in the [i]eternal[/i] [u]now[/u].

I can tell you're going to have a wonderful time noticing all the 'in Him', 'through Him' and 'by Him's and all the 'in us', ('for us' and 'by us's) which challenge any and every complacency over making a claim to sonship through Christ.

But you are very right, that this is central to making the gospel [i]work[/i] in our lives in the living way I believe the disciples were first to experience.

 2007/9/24 9:49
psalm1
Member



Joined: 2007/1/30
Posts: 1230


 Re: A vital doctrine the church has failed to teach me...

Here4Him, I had a similar experience.It also helped me.
sometimes i wonder if the gospel has ever been preached.
Jesus said" unless you eat my flesh and drink my blood you cannot be my disciple" and almost all the disciples left him.
Can you imagine what must of went through their minds?
Fast foreward to the modern man centered gospel and most bretheren see no need for more power from heaven.
The comission to raise the dead heal the sick or cast out demons doesnt even get a second thought.
Where is the great God of elija? A possible reply would be" WHERE ARE THE ELIJAS?"
i GUESS IF WE ALL LOOK IN THE MIRROR WE WOULD FIND A STARTING PLACE.
...David

 2007/9/24 10:41Profile
MaryJane
Member



Joined: 2006/7/31
Posts: 3057


 Re: A vital doctrine the church has failed to teach me...

Greetings

Father has been showing me this same thing as well. This was shared with me a few weeks ago by someone:

“….I had always known Christ was my Saviour, but I looked upon Him as an external Saviour, one who did a saving work for me from outside, as it were; one who was ready to come close alongside and stay by me, helping me in all that I needed, giving me power and strength and salvation. But now I knew something better than that. At last I realized that Jesus Christ was actually and literally within me; and even more than that—He had constituted Himself as my very life, taking me into union with Himself—my body, mind, and spirit….Was this not better than having Him as a helper, or even an external Saviour? To have Him, Jesus Christ, God the Son, as my very own life? It meant that I need never again ask Him to help me as though He were one and I another; but rather simply to do His work, His will, in me, and with me, and through me. My body was His, my mind His, my will His, my spirit His; and not merely His, but literally a part of Him. What He asked me to recognize was, “I have been crucified with Christ, and it is no longer I that live, but Christ liveth in me.” Jesus Christ had constituted Himself my life—not as a figure of speech, but a literal, actual fact…. I had mistakenly thought, “To me to live is to be Christ-like” or “To me to live is to have Christ’s help” or “To me to live is to serve Christ.” No; he plunged though and beyond all that in the bold, glorious, mysterious claim, “To me to live is Christ.”“…there is a life that wins; that it is the life of Jesus Christ: and that it may be our life for the asking, if we let Him—in absolute, unconditional surrender of ourselves to Him, our wills to His will, making Him the Master of our lives as well as our Saviour—enter in, occupy us, overwhelm us with Himself, yea, fill us with Himself “unto all the fullness of God.”

It really spoke to my heart but it also caused me some confusion, like you said I have never really heard this taught before. May I ask in your understanding of what the Word tells us that it is no longer "I" that live but "Christ" who lives in me... how can there still be sin in my life? Do we still contend with the flesh in this body and sin even though it is no longer "I" that live but rather "Christ" who lives in me???

This is so important to me thank you
God Bless
Maryjane

 2007/9/24 14:10Profile
nrlcharlie
Member



Joined: 2007/8/20
Posts: 12
Brisbane Australia

 Re:

Can anyone suggest a sermon audio that is along this line as i would be keen to hear it???

Bless you for this post i have been smitten by Him again because of it!

C.C.I


_________________
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 2007/9/25 0:07Profile
Baohongen
Member



Joined: 2007/4/19
Posts: 18
Runge, TX USA

 Re:

Interesting post. It reminds me of Ephesians 5 and Pauls description of the husband's duty to his wife. At one point the discussion changes:
"after all, no one ever hated his own body, but he feeds and cares for it as Christ does the church - for we are members of his body. For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife and the two will become one flesh. This is a profound mystery - but I am talking about Christ and the church."
Profound but beautiful mystery all the same.


_________________
Heath Powers

 2007/9/25 0:39Profile









 Re: a vital doctrine the church has failed to teach me ...


nrlcharlie asked

Quote:
Can anyone suggest a sermon audio that is along this line as i would be keen to hear it???

I haven't finished hearing the first one yet, but hmmhmm posted two videos of Ron Bailey teaching on

Sin Part 1 its cause and consequence

Sin Part 2 its cure and conquest


I believe these will cover Romans 6, (from his posts here).

I'll be interested to know if these are what you thought you are looking for. Perhaps they are quite basic, but maybe not altogether unhelpful?

Link to the the thread in Articles and Sermons:

[url=http://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=19602&forum=34&2]http://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=19602&forum=34&2[/url]

 2007/9/25 6:05
Here4Him
Member



Joined: 2006/9/23
Posts: 212
England

 Re:

Mary Jane, Thanks for what you shared with us. What your friend said was pretty helpful, although i am still coming to terms with this truth (i know it can only be revealed by the Holy SPirit and not 'worked out' by us) and your friend took it a step further and so i have printed out what they said and will look at it some more.

Pretty amazing truth that 'I am in Christ and Christ is in me!!'

You asked:

Quote:
May I ask in your understanding of what the Word tells us that it is no longer "I" that live but "Christ" who lives in me... how can there still be sin in my life? Do we still contend with the flesh in this body and sin even though it is no longer "I" that live but rather "Christ" who lives in me???



Im not really sure what the right answer is. But here is my attempt. We clearly according to scripture are still left with the flesh and old sinful nature at conversion, and the whole of our life can seem to be a struggle between the two opposing nature. Truly if Christ is in us there will be a struggle, because He is righteous and His SPirit within us yearns for righteousness in our lives. However I believe it is as we come into the truth that we are truly one with Christ, and that our past is caught up in Him and His past (and our future likewise) i.e. that when He died we died in Him, or we died with Him, and when He rose, we rose IN him, when we come to realise that actually and definately as a fact of history - that in Christ we died to sin at the cross, we will realise that we have also been raised to newness of life in Him so that we can be free to live for righteousness. All of this will become real to us as we live upon Christ, make much thought of our being 'In Christ' and joined to Christ and one with Him.

This is all iv got so far- im learning as i go- its exciting!!!


_________________
George Platt

 2007/9/25 6:57Profile
Here4Him
Member



Joined: 2006/9/23
Posts: 212
England

 Re:

In terms of sermons on the subject. I have looked on SI for some.

I have found this one by J Glyn Owen about 'Union with Christ' from Col 2:20-3:4:

http://64.34.176.235/sermons/SID4672.mp3

And i hope i am not being naughty in doing this but i have got hold of four tapes by a preacher called Edward Donnelly from N Ireland, on 'Union with Christ', i have nearly finished the first one and it is Brilliant!!!! There really is such a lack of teaching on this. And you can find 4 sermons of his on 'Union with Christ' at the page below:

http://www.grbc.net/sermons/index.php?conference=7


_________________
George Platt

 2007/9/25 7:15Profile





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