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Discussion Forum : News and Current Events : Terrorism and Persecution

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Zapthycat
Member



Joined: 2003/8/5
Posts: 75
Livermore, CA

 Terrorism and Persecution

Greetings again...

First off, if you are going to read this post, please read it all. I'm not long winded, but this is a very in-depth topic.

We know that terrorism is a constant threat to our lives. We know that the next attack is "imminent" according to our Gov't.

We know, likewise, that G.W. Bush is not a practicing Christian. In saying that, I know I pit myself against a large portion of Christians in the US, because they generally are of the "conservative" Christian political bent. So why do I say that he's not a Christian? I had been concerned, when he was elected, that many Christians and Pastors preached about "electing morality" and how he was a Christian, and how they hoped he would get the Holy Ghost, etc. They were, in my opinion, giving him their unconditional support (in violation of Ps 118:-7) simply because he had gone on record to state that he was Christian... he was not proven. In my opinion, that is basically supporting someone untried, for political gain. But many of us have seen his works... lies, deception... we've seen the video of him flipping off the camera, we're heard the audio of him cussing non-chalantly (proving that he does it regularly), and some may not be aware that his aides have mentioned that the administration "consults" with Pastors in order to get their support, and yet ridicules them later. It sounds a lot to me like Christians were just a voting bloc to him.

That being said, I began making my own observations and doing research... and it's clear to me that he has used his unconditional support from the "religious right" to keep him going. That, and the unrestrained use of the word "Terrorism", to push through whatever policies he wants.

I don't say this lightly: I am of the opinion that America is headed for the deadliest and most efficient persecution of Christians the world has ever seen. The amount of controls that have been built into the system, the REAL ID act, microchip implanations combined with Radio Frequency Identification (RFID chips) that could very well be the "Mark of the Beast", are all set up. Concentration camps have been set up, the police force has been rearmed with tanks and military grade weapons... the infastructure is all in place.

This has all been kept very quiet, and it's only seen by those that look for it. But make no mistake, it has been set up. Ranchers will tell you about the plans to RFID-tag all livestock, not realizing that it's a test for rolling it out to all people. Civil libertarians will alarmingly tell you about the posse comitatus and how that's down the tube, along with most of the bill of rights. You can hear about illegal gun confiscations in Katrina, not realizing that there's a larger plan for it.

But do you realize that this is all part of a bigger plan? That we are the targets? All kingdoms of the world are under the power and control of satan, that is his priveledge (Luke 4:5). That includes America. And we are are prime for the plucking.

Does anyone else realize this? I can understand if no one has really followed this, or if they still think that Bush is a saint... it's time to look at the facts, instead of believing that politicians will lead us into revival, like I heard one pastor speak about.

Thoughts? Objections? Comments?


_________________
J. Wilson

 2007/8/22 11:30Profile









 Re: Terrorism and Persecution

I am a conservative who is disappointed in Mr. Bush's presidency. I think he is better than the alternatives would have been, but I think there has a been a lot of mismanagement going on. I am a Reagan conservative, and wish we could find someone like him to be president.

I think most here would agree that a lot of things we see happening today have much greater signifigance than just headlines. You're preaching to the choir.

As for Mr. Bush's personal relationship with the Lord... you are in no position to judge that, and I think you are completely out of line saying he is not a practicing Christian. I'm [b]not[/b] saying he is, I am saying YOU do not know that he isnt. All you know about him is what is in the media.... hardly a reliable source when it comes to the weather, not to mention someone's relationship w/ the Lord.

News Flash: You're not God. :-)

And I don't say that to defend Bush... I just got done saying this very thing about Benny Hinn on another thread. And everyone knows I don't support Hinn on his best day.

I have to wonder... is this thread a very polite and spiritual way to participate in the new national pastime of "Bush bashing"? If it is, it has no place on this forum. Want to make a difference? Go vote in November. Stirring the pot on this forum by bringing up politics when it's been made abundantly clear that it is a topic to be avoided for the most part is not going to do anything but get people riled up.

By the way, I agree with most of your post concerning the direction America is heading in. That much I can go along with.

Krispy

 2007/8/22 11:45
Zapthycat
Member



Joined: 2003/8/5
Posts: 75
Livermore, CA

 Re:

"Bush Bashing" is not something I care for. In fact, politics isn't something I care for. At my heart I think I still want republicans to win, and so I think I am not quite out of it yet, but I earnestly desire to not dabble in politics whatsoever.

I'm not judging Bush to heaven or hell. I am, however, judging his works. I would NEVER, and I mean never, call someone a Christian that flips people off, cusses regularly (without repentance), or pokes fun at Christians and uses them for personal gain.

That being said, I don't mean he can't be saved, but he certainly isn't going in the right direction... especially if he is responsible for killing hundreds of thousands of people for monetary gain.

This isn't politics. Virtually all politicians are crooks, in my opinion, and I don't advocate any political party. I haven't voted in several years and I don't plan to any more. I'm looking for a city "who's builder and maker is God", and I put no trust in the kingdoms of this world, even though 10 years ago I considered myself one of the most patriotic people in the country.

My interest in the matter is solely on the part of the Church. I am UPSET, to say the least, that the fundamentalist Churches of the USA, has put so much support into politics, and especially into this politician. Don't they realize that the Bible says "It is better to trust in God than in princes"? Princes are political figures! Don't they realize that the Bible says that "God will send GREAT delusion, that they will believe a lie"? Don't they realize that the Bible says that "the very elect" will be fooled? Don't they realize that the anti-christ will be a man that they THOUGHT was going to fix things? That means that YES, the religious right, the Christian Coalition, and every other Christian group formed for political advantage, is supporting a system that is fooling them.

I personally believe Christians should divorce themselves from activism (apart from simple voting) and should focus on what Jesus focused on... evangelism. We're not here to make the world a better place, we're here to lead people to Christ. If we pour our time and money into supporting someone that's going building a system of death camps for us, then something is WRONG here...

And once again, I'm not judging GW Bush, or anyone else. He has to work out his own salvation, just as I have to work out mine. He will be judged according to his final works, just as I will be. But Churches need to stop getting involved with people for impure motives... and by "impure" I mean "anything that isn't Christian", aka "What Christ taught".

Hope that helps you understand my position.


_________________
J. Wilson

 2007/8/22 12:30Profile









 Re:

Quote:
...especially if he is responsible for killing hundreds of thousands of people for monetary gain.



See, this is what I am talking about. All this talk of this being a war for oil... if this is a war for oil, why has the price of oil gone up 135% in the last 18 months?

The President is making money of this war. This is the kind of jibberish we dont need here. Specualtions and accusations that you can not proove one way or the other.

We would be better off sticking to theological issues here.

Krispy

 2007/8/22 12:42









 Re:

Quote:
I personally believe Christians should divorce themselves from activism (apart from simple voting) and should focus on what Jesus focused on... evangelism. We're not here to make the world a better place, we're here to lead people to Christ.



Amen to this, and that is what this site is about... and probably 99.9% of the people here would agree with you.

You're preaching to the choir.

Krispy

 2007/8/22 12:44
Zapthycat
Member



Joined: 2003/8/5
Posts: 75
Livermore, CA

 Re:

Hold on a second, it's a plainly obvious FACT that war is the biggest moneymaker in history.

Regardless whether it's about oil, or simply war itself, hundreds of thousands of people have died, people with SOULS. 3000 Americans, yes... but 500,000 Iraqis. That's ALOT! We're talking about SOULS here.

And war IS a big moneymaker, thousands of defense contractors, the military industrial complex... they are making money that WE are spending. I don't give a fig about OIL, you brought that up. I'm talking about war, war that's taking lives, and that shouldn't be acceptable to ANY Christian.

I cannot PROVE that Bush is personally making money off this. But I can prove that his friends are making money off this. That is the reason we are there, still there, and not going to leave. Every month, billions of dollars more. And in the meantime people with souls, dying. I care less about the monetary cost than about the human cost. It's not about politics, I don't like people dying before they've had every chance they need to get saved.


_________________
J. Wilson

 2007/8/22 13:31Profile









 Re:

Quote:

Zapthycat wrote:
It's not about politics, I don't like people dying before they've had every chance they need to get saved.



moe_mac wrote:
So are you in the movement to stop all traffic tickets from being written and the court system from inacting fines and prison sentences on felony conviction to fight against evil domesticly. That's a big money maker you know, for the states and the federal government. Police die daily in America in this effort. If you looked at the stats on deaths in the US, probably more police and firefighters died in the last five years than soldiers in Iraq. I don't like either but use a little logic. The military is only making an attempt to restrain evil and protect people that the UN did have the gall to enforce after they passed the resolution to do so. The domestic police departments are doing the same thing the military is doing. Have you joined the group to dismantle all the police and courts systems yet? Or do we only strive in a direction when it has a direct affect on the home front and listen to all that one sided recthoric on the news media? Do only US citizen deserve to have an effort made to be protected against evil people? I hope they all get saved, also the ones that are being killed by the evil people before the police and the military can get them. And for that matter if they got saved they wouldn't be evil.

 2007/8/22 14:34
Zapthycat
Member



Joined: 2003/8/5
Posts: 75
Livermore, CA

 Re:

So, you are saying that the US is a "rightous nation" and that everyone else is "evil", so we should kill everyone else, and hope that they have a chance to turn from their ways before we kill them, right?

Our government is getting ready to crack down on every Christian in the country, and preparing to brand us with the mark of the beast, and you still think that we should be in another country creating more terrorists and killing more civilians? Or do you seriously think that they will "follow us here" if we don't fight them "over there"?

EVEN if they did, it's still not our fight. We, as CHRISTIANS, are not supposed to be fighting for satans causes, aka the kingdoms of this world. We are not OF this world, our mission is to save people, not try to make the world a better place.

You can try to pigeonhole me and put me in whatever group you think I belong in, but I don't have a clue what you're talking about to "eliminate traffic tickets".


_________________
J. Wilson

 2007/8/22 14:54Profile









 Re:

Ah... I just noticed you're from [i]California[/i].

;-)

...nuff said.

Krispy

 2007/8/22 15:06









 Re:

Quote:
Our government is getting ready to crack down on every Christian in the country, and preparing to brand us with the mark of the beast, and you still think that we should be in another country creating more terrorists and killing more civilians?



Uhmmm... while this will happen in the future, I do not think the Bush administration is planning Armageddon. You do not understand scripture if you seriously believe what your espousing here. The mark of the beast and the anti-Christ will not be an American thing. Go back to the Bible... and study it this time.

Quote:
Or do you seriously think that they will "follow us here" if we don't fight them "over there"?



Actually... I was in the military. This is a very sound and historically proven strategy. You keep your enemy tied up in one theater of operation, and it keep another theater safe. Pretty simple actually, but since you obviously havent a background in military tactics, I wouldnt expect you to be knowlegable of such things.

But it's really very simple to understand. Heck, I use it when I'm developing offensive plays for the football team I coach.

The Israelite army engaged in those types of tactics several times... at the direction of God.

Krispy

 2007/8/22 15:12





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