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 Re: Continued

Luke 6:45 A good man out of the good treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is good; and an evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is evil: for of the abundance of the heart his mouth speaketh.


What seems to disappoint me about this thread is a possible lack of being open to different styles of music that can very well have an anointing attached to it. Remember God has made every blade of grass different, when you begin to uniform the children of God this becomes out of character of the way our Lord God has made us. A music style is just a style. It is the heart of the one performing it that matters. Not the style of the music. So I not only believe, I know there is nothing wrong with christian styles of rock n roll, hip-hop, rap, alternative style, country, bluegrass, jazz, blues, R&B, ambient, worship, digital music, contemporary and ect. These are just styles. It is the Spirit behind them that matter. I personally have heard some great worshiping music that contains all these, which have well uplifted me. Do I agree with the Spirit in all the music in the categories of these styles? No. I believe most modern christian music of modern styles does lack worship and is more on a line of entertainment. But you cannot rule out any style of music simply because of style. I have found fault in music of every style and can prove it if you wish. Whatever your favorite style music, I could show you of a song in that style that is not of a pure Spirit.

 2007/7/13 5:59









 Re:

My biggest issue with Christian music today is that it is predominately owned by [b]secular[/b] corporations. Their number one goal is [b]not[/b] spreading the gospel... it is making [b]money[/b].

It is an unbiblical yoking together. When an Christian artist signs a recording contract with a secular company they are not obeying God's Word.

This is not only happening in contemporary music, but secular ownership is also true in Southern Gospel, Black Gospel, etc etc... and yes, even praise and worship music.

99% of Christian music today is secular owned and the bottom line is it is driven by the bottom line... [b]money[/b].

I'm not even getting into the horrible doctrine in most of it, or the lack of any doctrine at all, or the "God as my girlfriend" lyrics in a lot of it... there is a lot that has gone off the tracks in Christian music today.

But there is a reason it has gone off the tracks... an unholy alliance between light and dark. An unequal yoking. Disobedience to scripture. That is at the root of it all.

I personally dont have much of an issue over musical styles. I like all kinds of musical styles.

But Christian music today is an industry designed to seperate Christians from the money God has provided them. And some argue that the secular companies have the money needed to get the message out to the world.

Really? C'mon... the lost of this world are not buying Christian music. The secular radio stations are not playing Christian music. Sure, some modern rock stations play a song or two by Switchfoot or POD... but there is nothing in those song's lyrics to even suggest those bands are Christians. Those stations will not play an overtly Christian song.

The only band that ever successfully got on the secular airwaves with an overtly Christian message was Stryper... and that was two decades ago.

Boy, do I feel old.

Krispy

 2007/7/13 8:14









 Re:

Quote:

4christalone wrote:
Dear Littlegift,

Thank you, I agree with the statement on Kieth Green

Oh the need to have people who would walk out when the music does not have the Holy Spirit's confirmation in their heart.

James

In a sense I have an advantage re music, because I was never "into" "pop" or rock music, even as a teenager in the 60's, before becoming a Christian. Some I quite liked, but could take it or leave it, (even Cliff Richard!) So there was never that ungodly "pull" towards anything "unclean" in that area.

Unlike certain books... From a child I was fascinated with fantasy stories - especially science fiction. I read the whole of the Lord of the Rings (including appendix and maps) 9 times in 5 years! Television programmes such as Dr Who and Star Trek also gripped me.

Much, or even most of it, was probably harmful spiritually, as I realised afterwards, but it was like an obsession, a drug. The reason was something in my soul that I'd never let the Lord deal with. I'd been a Christian for about 16 years when I finally let the Lord free me from this addiction.

Now I can clearly see the occult influence in much of this type of literature, and can't stand to read it, or see anything like that on TV.

The same sort of thing can happen with music, I believe, which is why many Christians can't discern it, any more than I could with fantasy stories.

So, those of you who don't see any harm in "heavy" Christian rock music, ask the Lord if maybe there's something in you that answers to it, and stops you from discerning...

Blessings

Jeannette

 2007/7/13 10:10









 Re:

Quote:
Television programmes such as Dr Who and Star Trek also gripped me.



Yea... now there's some state of the art special effects! lol ...not to mention that great Shakesperean actor: William Shatner!

Krispy

 2007/7/13 10:45
HomeFree89
Member



Joined: 2007/1/21
Posts: 797
Indiana

 Re:

Quote:

4christalone wrote:
Dear Jordan
PLease go on. I see you are into music please describe, as you feel the Lord leading, your position and why.

James



Bro. James,

My background in music has been "Christian" rock (DC Talk, some POD, Newsboys, etc.). Then we received teaching that told us all drumbeats were bad and of the devil, so we got rid of all of our CCM. Just a couple years ago, we started listening to things with drums, bass guitar, electric guitar, but it's not rock (Steve Green,Keith Green, Legacy Five). The Lord had shown us that not all drums are bad, if they aren't the driving force of the music and if the singers are living right before God.


So, as you can see I've listened to a lot that's out there and I wouldn't go back to it. The effect it has on my spirit is a huge reason why I wouldn't listen to it. When I enter a Christian bookstore and I hear the music they're playing it troubles me and I don't like staying there long.

Another reason would be, after checking out the roots of rock and finding out the people who made it acceptable, I realized that we shouldn't be copying it. Should we use the same music in our "worship" that Elvis and Little Richard made popular?

1Jo 2:15 "Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him."

Brother, it blesses me to see how you're seeking and wanting God's best. This is something that God is still working with me on. Just a couple of weeks ago I had to get rid of a couple of CDs that God was convicting me about, but I sure didn't want to get rid of them. They were Southern Gospel, but the spirit was one of amusement and not worship, so the Lord is still teaching me, too.

God bless,
Jordan


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Jordan

 2007/7/13 13:57Profile
Nile
Member



Joined: 2007/3/28
Posts: 403
Raleigh, NC

 Re:

Quote:

HomeFree89 wrote:
Quote:

4christalone wrote:
Dear Jordan
PLease go on. I see you are into music please describe, as you feel the Lord leading, your position and why.

James



Bro. James,

My background in music has been "Christian" rock (DC Talk, some POD, Newsboys, etc.). Then we received teaching that told us all drumbeats were bad and of the devil, so we got rid of all of our CCM. Just a couple years ago, we started listening to things with drums, bass guitar, electric guitar, but it's not rock (Steve Green,Keith Green, Legacy Five). The Lord had shown us that not all drums are bad, if they aren't the driving force of the music and if the singers are living right before God.


So, as you can see I've listened to a lot that's out there and I wouldn't go back to it. The effect it has on my spirit is a huge reason why I wouldn't listen to it. When I enter a Christian bookstore and I hear the music they're playing it troubles me and I don't like staying there long.

Another reason would be, after checking out the roots of rock and finding out the people who made it acceptable, I realized that we shouldn't be copying it. Should we use the same music in our "worship" that Elvis and Little Richard made popular?

1Jo 2:15 "Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him."

Brother, it blesses me to see how you're seeking and wanting God's best. This is something that God is still working with me on. Just a couple of weeks ago I had to get rid of a couple of CDs that God was convicting me about, but I sure didn't want to get rid of them. They were Southern Gospel, but the spirit was one of amusement and not worship, so the Lord is still teaching me, too.

God bless,
Jordan



Amen brother.


_________________
Matthew Miskiewicz

 2007/7/13 14:03Profile









 Re:

Quote:
Then we received teaching that told us all drumbeats were bad and of the devil, so we got rid of all of our CCM.



Brother, in the past I'd been told many things-- don't do this and don't do that--but it wasn't until the Holy Spirit [i]told[/i] me and convicted me that I knew the truth for myself. If He hadn't taught me the truth, I would have become a slave to the opinions of men, and never have found true freedom. Our Hope is in Christ. The Spirit gives life, the flesh profits nothing. So continue to press on and seek His face. Life in the Spirit is too wonderful.

In Christ,
Slavyan

 2007/7/13 15:09
HomeFree89
Member



Joined: 2007/1/21
Posts: 797
Indiana

 Re:

Quote:

NotMe wrote:
Quote:
Then we received teaching that told us all drumbeats were bad and of the devil, so we got rid of all of our CCM.



Brother, in the past I'd been told many things-- don't do this and don't do that--but it wasn't until the Holy Spirit [i]told[/i] me and convicted me that I knew the truth for myself. If He hadn't taught me the truth, I would have become a slave to the opinions of men, and never have found true freedom. Our Hope is in Christ. The Spirit gives life, the flesh profits nothing. So continue to press on and seek His face. Life in the Spirit is too wonderful.

In Christ,
Slavyan



Amen! There is true freedom in the Spirit. Not the cheap, fleeting freedom of the world, but peace and contentment in the Lord. Praise God!

Jordan


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Jordan

 2007/7/14 17:35Profile
narrowpath
Member



Joined: 2005/1/9
Posts: 1067
Germany NRW

 Re:

Last Sunday we had a baptism service in our church where an elderly women got baptisted. Her granddaughter who does not go to our church sang
"Amazing Grace" in honour of her grandmother.
I did not check, but I do not think that she was a Christian (there is a slight chance that I am wrong here). She had a very beautiful voice and sounded like a professional artist, but it was a performance, not worship. It was "soulish" but not spiritual. Somehow I felt sad about it.

I wholeheartedly agree with what James [4christalone] said in his blog. I think it is right that nothing in itself is unclean. There are no forbidden combinations of soundwaves that constitute a tune of music. It is the spirit that is behind it. I recently attended a prayer meeting of young people and one of them played a tune of supposedly "Christian Punk" For me it sounded like somebody running amuk in shopping mall with a chain saw. I rebuked the fellows and asked them if they could imaginge looking at Jesus hanging on the cross while listing to this music.

Even in contemporary worship music that we sing in our congregations there is the tendency to be carried away with beautiful music that creates a certain mood or feeling or even worse, an altered state of mind. Music can be used to induce supposed manifestations of the spirit (Toronto Blessing).

Worship should be an interaction with God and it is scriptural to use music in worship. However, music should only act as a servant, not as a master. Music is NOT the medium of worship, the medium is the word sung to God.

I do believe that Satan has a propensity to pervert worship to lift himself up above the morning stars. He uses Christian and secular music for his wicked schemes.

Isaja 14:11Your pomp is brought down to Sheol,
the sound of your harps;
maggots are laid as a bed beneath you,
and worms are your covers.
12"How you are fallen from heaven,
O Day Star, son of Dawn!
How you are cut down to the ground,
you who laid the nations low!
13You said in your heart,
'I will ascend to heaven;
above the stars of God
I will set my throne on high;
I will sit on the mount of assembly
in the far reaches of the north;[b]
14I will ascend above the heights of the clouds;
I will make myself like the Most High.'

I can imagine that many a Christian musician who performs on stage in a large auditorium looking at a sea of people lifting their hands in worship is tempted to think that the worship is unto himself.

Philip

 2007/7/14 20:26Profile
HopePurifies
Member



Joined: 2007/4/12
Posts: 181
Georgia, USA

 Re:

Quote:

4christalone wrote:
Dear Hopepurifies,

This is a good test to put your music through:

Does it humble you, or lift up your pride?
Are the artists performing or leading worship?
The fear of the LORD is to hate evil: pride, and arrogancy, and the evil way, and the froward mouth, do I hate. Proverbs 8:13
Much of today's CCM is pure pride. You can tell by the way they decorate themselves, in the way they interact with the crowd, as well as the boastful lyrics and amplified booming.

Does it invite you to worship God, or does it itself push your emotions high?
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness, self-control. (Galatians 22-23)
Much music is designed to push you into jumping or all sorts of crazyness. That's wrong, especially during worship which is what we are talking about.

Is it beautiful and lovely, or is it grungy?
Finally, brethren, whatever things are true, whatever things are noble, whatever things are just, whatever things are pure, whatever things are lovely, whatever things are of good report, if there is any virtue and if there is anything praiseworthy—meditate on these things. Phil 4:8

Is it just like the world's music?
And you shall make from these a holy anointing oil, an ointment compounded according to the art of the perfumer. It shall be a holy anointing oil. Exodus 30:25
You might think this scripture is a stretch, but the lyrics of today's CCM could acknowledge any God and not just ours. I'm not against all songs that are simple in theology but I wouldn't trust a singer who only sings those type of songs. When God had people make His tabernacle the scent and the design was not to be replicated elsewhere. God likes things to be holy to Him. Not just thrown about carelessly and understood as easily by the world as by Christians.

If you were worldly could you dance inappropriately to it? (headbang, grind?)
That's just good sense. Having not been a Christian my entire life, I was shocked when certain Christian artists got my body doing what it used to in sin.

Thank you I like that test perhaps we can expond a little deeper yet?



Hmm, I'd love to expound since you asked me to but I'm not sure how haha.

A lot of the other posters are giving great advice.

To those who say style doesn't matter, style does matter. There is music that makes you want to cry even though you have no idea what they are saying. It is extremely important to avoid music that causes bad feelings like anger, self-pity, envy, sensuality, and pride. There are styles made to do that, and everyone just has to be honest with themselves about the impact music has on them.

We have an extremely short time here on earth, and Jesus Christ's return is ever eminent. Make sure you'd feel comfortable inviting Him in to listen with you to your music. Make sure your music ushers you into a deeper walk with God. Make sure it furthers His kingdom and blesses Him.

Music that edifies with the wisdom of God will be "first pure, then peaceable, gentle, willing to yield, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality and without hypocrisy," instead of earthly, sensual, and demonic.

But hey, a variety of styles keeps things very interesting! It is good to like the music you listen to. Walk in the light and have fellowship with Christ and then you will be able to have a clear conscience about the kind of music you listen to.


_________________
Melanie

 2007/7/14 21:18Profile





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