I have never heard David Wilkerson preaching that evidence of being baptized in the Holy Spirit is speaking in tongues.
Read his book, "The Cross & The Switchblade" :)
| 2007/7/1 8:20||Profile|
| Re: Are all Speakers on SI Baptist?|
Compliments,Lester summerall was a great man of God and might have books on the baptism of the holy spirit.He recieved wigglesworth's annointing/mantle.he wrote numerous books.Lorie wilkie has a book "the costly annointing" which would be helpfull.
If you listen to Poonen you will be hamstrung, and prohibited from some of the extremely annointed books out there.
The Spirit of God will lead you and once you estaablish a flow of annointing in your life, man and his psycological reasoning will be a legitamate negative in your walk.
I would emplore you to step outside si in your quest for the annointing.
The reason David would not harm Saul is he knew he would harm his own annointing.we need to be carefull of our own attitudes toward others as we could cut off the flow of God into our lives.
Poonen does not understand this principle.
the quest for the annointing is an awesome thing. You shouldnt let ANYONE stand in your way.
as with anything you recieve from God it will come through faith.
The crazy wacky charasmatics have the best books on the baptism of the Holy Spirit.
| 2007/7/1 12:35||Profile|
Read his book, "The Cross & The Switchblade"
Yes, you are right, I have read the book long time ago, I think even in "Run baby run" by Nicky Cruz this subject is mentioned, but my emphasize was on his [i]preaching[/i]. Actually I found SI looking for sermons by Wilkerson, so at the beginning I was listening just him.
| 2007/7/1 15:49||Profile|
check out audio sermons by BH Clendennen, (on this site,) and at the International School of Christ, http://www.schoolofchrist.org/media/a1_index.html
Pastor Clendennen has a whole series of material on the Holy Ghost in particular, and other important things in text format, free. Each text file is only about 3 to 4 pages, and power packed. If you would like to have them, they are posted on his web site, but you have to hunt for them via the site index. It's a laborious process of copy and paste, but it's free. If you wish, you can download the whole file. I've already went through this process, and have all 156 text files on my pc, neatly organized. It's the material for the School of Christ, and if it were not very convicting, very challenging, and very true, I would not have bothered to do this. The material is in open office (odt) format. If you do not have the Open Office (free) office and document software, you will not be able to open the files.) Pastor Clendennen is in his late 80's, is a friend of David Wilkerson's. I also highly recommend John Rhys Watkins, (also on this site), Teresa Conlon, Leonard Ravenhill, Neil Rhodes, just to name a few. You may download the file and it's free, here:
| 2007/7/2 16:59||Profile|
Thank you for the links... concerning reading open office files (odt), you can download textmaker viewer from www.officeviewers.com
| 2007/7/3 6:05||Profile|
This is a good thread... thanks. I would recommened that we keep a balance in our teachers. Washer and Wilkerson are two of my favorites.
In Christ - Jim
| 2007/7/3 8:28|
Santa Clara, CA
| Re: that much difference ...|
We do love our catagories...
If you listen to Poonen you will be hamstrung,
And if we listen to you ... ? Watch out for the way you slash and cut with that knife.
I would emplore you to step outside si in your quest for the annointing.
And I would suggest you seek not after this notion at all, it is poorly defined and contradictory even in these few words;
The reason David would not harm Saul is he knew he would harm his own annointing.
Nonsense. And what you are forwarding here is only more self-seeking, and self-aggrandizement.
[i]But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after ... [/i] Mat 12:39
we need to be carefull of our own attitudes toward others as we could cut off the flow of God into our lives.
Poonen does not understand this principle
And you apparently know little of Zac Poonen to be so lightly throwing his name around here, see your quote there above "Hello?"
| 2007/7/3 9:28||Profile|
Leonard from the average Pentecostal Holiness Churches is that he did not speak in tongues.
I read this and had to giggle a bit. :-P Most classical Pentecostals I have ever known identify themselves almost exclusively by their speaking in tongues as initial evidence. That is not as much true to day- but many times I have heard the statement, "If we take tongues out of the church we need to take Pentecost off of the doorpost." ;-)
Robert Wurtz II
| 2007/7/3 9:53||Profile|
First let me say that I understand entirely what this thread was [u]intended[/u] for. However, it seems it was inevitable that it would evolve into a discussion about tongues and baptism.
So in light of the direction it is going let me say that it does not matter at all whether this pastor or that denomination preaches or teaches the baptism of the Holy Spirit with the evidence of speaking with tongues. The scriptures are very clear that tongues are one of the gifts of the Holy Spirit who gives it as He wills.
As I've said in another thread there is absolutely no scriptural reference for the gifts of the Holy Spirit expiring in THIS lifetime. It would seem wierd to me that Paul would go into such pains to explain the gifts and the need for order if those gifts were not to continue beyond the apostles.
I heard a very well respected bible teachers say that because evidence of the manifestation diminish toward the end of the book of Acts, that that was indicative of the gifts ceasing with the apostles. With all due respect, that's just human reasoning.
There's in no scripture in the bible that says nor intimates that these gifts are done away with. Yes, faith, hope and love endure, with love being the greatest. However, we have to know that we are still looking into a dim glass. We have not come face-to-face with Christ yet.
If we are not experiencing the manifestations of the gifts of the Holy Spirit then perhaps it is because we have been pre-disposed to a certain persuasion that has hindered you and the Spirit from blessing you with them. And that's what these GIFTS are; they are blessings. Whether we realize it or not, it's like we treat the gifts like the plague or something. These are manifestations of the power of God in the life of the believer in order to show mankind that God indeed is among and with us. Preaching the gospel with signs and wonders following us is essential to the full revelation of God's presence and authority in our lives; to demonstrate His love and grace. I've read many testimonies from GFA (Gospel For Asia) where entire villages were converted as a result of a miraculous healing or deliverance from witchcraft, all by the power of the Spirit.
Now, I am not suggesting that conversions are not possible without signs and wonders. For, there were many signs that Jesus did and many still turned away. I do realize that preaching, teaching and conversation are also a means of bringing someone to the knowledge of Christ.
Nevertheless, this in no way diminishes the value of the gifts and their affect on those who see and/or experience them. They are an invaluable tool to display the authority of the Gospel of Jesus Christ, which we preach.
The gifts are not for showboating and entertainment, as some have mistreated them. Often, it is because of those people that many are discouraged and are even afraid to believe in the gifts. Nevertheless, the gifts, which were given by Christ, are for edifying and adding souls to the church. The Holy Spirit works in us through many ways in order to reach the lost and to build the church of Christ.
| 2007/7/6 2:37||Profile|
Signs and wonders. Each time a lost person is a recipient of the salvation of our Lord, that is within itself a sign and a wonder. No one thing any greater than the gift Jesus gave us through HIS sacrifice on the cross. The red letters WORDS and the other inspired Words of God has things to say about seeking signs and wonders.
29 And when the people were gathered thick together, he began to say, This is an evil generation: they seek a sign; and there shall no sign be given it, but the sign of Jonas the prophet.
30 For as Jonas was a sign unto the Ninevites, so shall also the Son of man be to this generation.
Other miracles continue to happen today just as they did when Jesus walked the earth in human flesh. We are to be expectant of them and in prayer for them for we know nothing is impossible with God.
58 And he did not do many miracles there because of their lack of faith.
19 Behold, I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you.
20 Notwithstanding in this rejoice not, that the spirits are subject unto you; but rather rejoice, because your names are written in heaven.
Yes each one of us who has received HIS SPIRIT has indeed had a miracle performed in our life and in our midst and we have not seen all of it yet. See signature below.
| 2007/7/8 6:09|