SermonIndex Audio Sermons
Image Map
Discussion Forum : General Topics : Sadhu Sundar Singh and The New Church

Print Thread (PDF)

Goto page ( 1 | 2 Next Page )
PosterThread
Everett
Member



Joined: 2007/5/3
Posts: 77
West Bloomfield, MI

 Sadhu Sundar Singh and The New Church

Looks like I'm not the only one who thinks something is strange about the connection between Sadhu and Jakob Boehme/Swedenborg. I thought someone else on this forum would know but not so. So eventually i found this article and it answered most of my questions.

Here is are a few excerpts from the article:

"In Sweden, there were others who were prepared to compare the two visionaries. While the Sadhu was still in Sweden, on May 8, 1922, Major Oswald Kuylenstierna a friend, though apparently not a member of the New Church -- published a short article in a leading Stockholm newspaper, Svenska Dagbladet, pointing out that although Sundar Singh was in many ways Swedenborg's diametrical opposite, having no scholarship and no interest in theology, nevertheless on the visionary level, there was a "striking resemblance" between the two."16

"I regret that I have not found any independent corroboration of this statement concerning Sundar Singh's earlier acquaintance with Heaven and Hell. But it could very well be true. If true, it would help to explain at least some of the resemblances between the Sadhu's visions and those of Swedenborg."

"...Alden went on to state bluntly that "here is a man (Sadhu)who never heard of Swedenborg," and yet '... he devotes himself to the promulgation of the same message as that proclaimed to the Christian world of the West by Swedenborg.' How can such things be?"

"Is it possible that Sadhu Sundar Singh has been reading Swedenborg; and then has had visions which reflected the ideas derived from Swedenborg? Or did he really receive direct information from heaven? The close resemblance of his ideas to those taught in Swedenborg, the divisions of the spiritual world, expressed in the same terms, seem as though he had first gained his information from Swedenborg, and then the spirits had confirmed him in it. It would be interesting to know more of this case, including the previous knowledge which Sadhu Sundar Singh had, and especially whether he had previously read Swedenborg."

FYI: this is all in the name of truth. I'm all about the truth. I'll die for the truth. I live for truth. I have found truth in Jesus Christ, NO even more i have found the absolute truth which is Jesus Christ and i must contend for the truth. I'm am not out to hurt someone's image, I'm on a mission to expose lies if need be and proclaim the truth. Remember we wrestle not against flesh and blood but against principalities, powers and wicked rulers in the heavenly places. I have nothing against Sadhu but i do have a problem with the father of lies and that old serpent twisting truth and i must investigate when i come across something that i am confounded about but have a right away feeling that something's not right.

Take a look at this website. It explains more deeply about what i was trying to say in the last thread concerning Sadhu Sundar Singh.

http://www.baysidechurch.org/studia/studia.cfm?ArticleID=113&detail=1&VolumeID=18&AuthorID=41

By the way it is a lengthy article so be prepared to read or come back another time.

In conclusion, i haven't come up with the answer concerning Sadhu Sundar Singh and his connections with Swedenborg but this article gave me more information to form my opinion and it is not important to devout your whole life to something like this for i am not but its good to be armed and aware whenever presented with something appealing in christendom so that you are not lead astray by any figure, movement, denomination or wind of doctrine whether it be from the catholics or from the pentecostals or from the other side of the world in a different society. No denomination is exempt from the possibility of false teachers arising up. So what really matters is to watch out for each other while watching out for yourself by standing upon the pure unadulturated Word of God. For the bible cannot be added to or taken away and make Christ the focus in all life not rumors, myths, and fables.

Be Blessed

I encourage you as i encourage myself keep the Lord at the center of your life.




_________________
Chad Everett Dalton

 2007/6/6 23:52Profile
theopenlife
Member



Joined: 2007/1/30
Posts: 926


 Re: Sadhu Sundar Singh and The New Church

I read most all of the article and researched amongst some others sources on the internet. As well, I read concerning the "New Church" and it's doctrines, which were directly influenced by Swedenborg. Almost all of it was in agreement, though coming from various parties.

Altogether I must say that many, many of his views were plainly heretical to my understanding of scripture. Further, his insistance on speaking with the saints is frightning, given how little he seemed to regard speaking to Christ if such a communication was readily available.

*Note, some of those apparent heresies to which the Sadhu seems to have subscribed were:

-The ability of the dead to receive Christ [b] after [/b] death.
-The ability to regularly consult the deceased for wisdom and guidance. This included speaking not only with both those who had accepted Christ, but also them who "had not yet accepted" Him. The Sadhu claims to have done this frequently.
-A well noted indifference towards doctrinal divisions. This hardly aligns with Jude, who exhorts us to "contend earnestly" for the faith [b]once delivered[/b]. Sundar had gushing praise for Swedenborg who openly added [b]new revelation[/b] to the scriptures (search his book "Arcana Coelestia" ~ "Angelic Wisdom", which reinterprets Genesis and Exodus with this new light.)
-The belief that all angels and demons were once men.
-Unitarianism; Jesus IS completely Jehovah, and beside him no God is. (Swedenborg taught this doctrine emphatically and Sundar taught that Swedenborg was "a highly trained" angelic leader in heaven.)

Everett, I'm with you going, "whoa, what is this?!" I'm fearful of anyone preaching a gospel given by a man, or an angel, and especially a dead man transformed into an angel.

Perhaps some others could look into this and add scriptural light to this?

 2007/6/7 1:49Profile
Everett
Member



Joined: 2007/5/3
Posts: 77
West Bloomfield, MI

 Re:

Thanks for replying to my thread. It's relieving to know that someone else has the same conviction as I do.

To be honest, I was all set to buy one of Sadhu's books but i just don't buy anything without first reading a little about the person. The little bit that i read seemed too good to be true (because I always pray that God would raise up men and women of God) so i read more on the web and found some of his writings online and his book "The Sadhu, the Wisdom of Sadhu Sundar Singh" on ebook at plough. In that book there were several things that i didnt agree with like how he said that "christianity was the fulfillment of hindiusm". I knew what he meant by that but my bible taught me that Christ is the fulfillment of the law and the prophet and such religions as hinduism could not be fulfilled because they were false anyway, why fulfill them? Rather Christianity is the better way. So subtle statements like this made me investigate even more and i came across in his book that he read some of Jakob Boehme's writings and i wanted to see, you know how he influenced him if some or little and when i looked at Jakob Boehme's writings such as heaven and hell and others they were strinkinly too similiar for comfort.

So now as much as i wanted to embrace him as a special apostle or prophet that God had raised up to reach the hindus and muslims i just couldnt any more. The evidence was too clear even before i came across this article. The article simply confirmed my convictions.

The purpose and motive of this thread was not to start up controversy because as i found out this is nothing new but to inform anybody to be careful not to accept everybody even if they seem like they cant be wrong. There are counterfeits out there and false signs you know? Our mission is not to fight against people but the power and force behind it. So let's contend for the truth from this day forth and forever more.

Have A Great Day


_________________
Chad Everett Dalton

 2007/6/7 7:06Profile
enid
Member



Joined: 2006/5/22
Posts: 2660
Nottingham, England

 Re:

Some years ago, I bought a book about Sundar Singh, and I read a few chapters and put it down.

I read about him being in trances for up to 8 hours. His friends, who were waiting for him in a boat, could not continue the journey until he came out of the trance.

Fair enough, the Bible tells us that Peter was in a trance, Acts 10v10, but for 8 hours?

I don't know, maybe I should have read the book to the end, it might have cleared up some misgivings that I have about him.

Just feel uneasy about it.

God bless.

 2007/6/7 7:22Profile
theopenlife
Member



Joined: 2007/1/30
Posts: 926


 8 Hours.

Eight hours?

I wonder how long John was receiving the revelation, or Ezekiel, his visions?

Nevertheless, eight hours is pretty striking in ways that can be both good and alarming. Don't know how I feel about that.

I've experienced one clear vision in my life. It felt like five seconds but the clock said fifteen minutes had passed. It was in the days when I had repented of sins, before repenting of Sin. You know what I mean? So it wasn't a happy vision of angels.

Thanks Everett and Eind for your thoughts and watchfulness.

 2007/6/7 16:00Profile
heartablaze
Member



Joined: 2007/4/12
Posts: 65


 Re: Singh

This is why I do not like rewrites of so-called saints by those who want to put them in that light- one of those simple books led me to believe that the man had very different doctrine. I guess it was too good to be true, but I will also look for myself.
I also picked up a book of his writings from the library(I did not finish it though, perhaps it was the same book) - and they seemed fine and correct, but it is true that a little bit of untruth can spoil the whole well- or a little bit of leaven(sin) can leaven the whole bread. Hopefully, though, the truth that is there will lead people to the Truth...anyway, I have some researching to do.
Thank you, brothers.


_________________
Kelsey

 2007/6/9 0:14Profile
Everett
Member



Joined: 2007/5/3
Posts: 77
West Bloomfield, MI

 Re:

You know, I haven't lost respect for this man neither do i consider him a deceiver, who knows someone could have tainted with his writings or mistranslated sayings. It could be a rare possibility, probably not likely but that doesn't matter. What matters is what we can learn from people. If we can't learn from someone concerning their doctrine b/c of error then we can look at their life and possibly learn something if anything beneficial from it. It's like a love song that was supposed to be written for Jesus but was captivated by worldly fame to be popular and instead was turned into a secular love song but here you come along and rewrite it for its original purpose to reach the heart of God.

Here's another example: What can we learn from Judas Iscariot's betrayal of Jesus? Certainly we shouldn't follow in his footsteps of greed and theft but we can learn not to do what he did. We can learn that no matter how close a man may LOOK like he is to Jesus he can still have a secret life that will eventually be exposed if not aborted from.

Likewise we see their wasn't everything accurate in Sadhu's life concerning the close comparision with Swendendorf writings that were purposely mixed into his visions and teachings, we can somehow, somewhere learn from him. Take out bits and pieces from his life that were right and positive. Don't we intensely desire revival? Shouldn't we be about our Father's business? Sadhu had some attributes that characterize this but I'm not saying to get into all that spiritualism and mysticism stuff. Everything that leads us closer to God and is according to the Word of God can be used to advance and grow. Everything that leads us away from God and is not according to the Word of God will gradually destroy us and must be avoided.

All of us have different convictions. We have different preferences and interests but without the truth we would have nothing to stand on. The truth points us to the right direction.

So do your research about him if you're still not sure and learn from him what can be beneficial to you. Things not grounded upon the truth are not beneficial but by this God will teach you the difference between truth and error.

By the way is anyone perfect? Although Sadhu had reasons to be positively - examined or negatively - criticized, are we exempt? Preachers and prophets whether they be true or not have it hard. Their under the spot light. We examine everything to the bone until we finally find something wrong in a person. As if anyone's perfect. Why do we do this? It's because we want someone totally perfect in word and in deed that we can rely on so that life will be easier. We want some superhuman that knows all and does all at the snap of our fingers. There's no more need to look here and there in personalities and denominational figures. Jesus is perfect. Depend on him. This is why we all need each other. [b]Together we are one, united we stand tall, divided we are none, separated we fall.[/b]

God Bless you all


_________________
Chad Everett Dalton

 2007/6/9 1:58Profile
ginnyrose
Member



Joined: 2004/7/7
Posts: 7463
Mississippi

 Re: Sadhu Sundar Singh and The New Church

Everett,

This is the first time I have ever heard anyone say anything negative about Sadhu Sundar Singh. Evrything I have heard before is that he was an exemplary godly man who loved the LORD and followed him.

As I checked ot the link you shared I noticed the church who posted it and to me that is a red flag in itself. The red flag is the cult itself: It can not be depended on be be truthful in its interpretation of God's people or their writings.

Now, this means for me, I will need to look at other sourses, like Sadhu's own writings, to see what did he say and what did he mean. On the other hand, this will require a lot of time which I do not have. The fact remains, Jesus is the one who died for me and it is Him I must follow and answer to, and what Sadhu believed is between him and God.

The bottom line is that it is always dangerous to take another man's writings, word as the final authority in matters of life, faith. Other people can and do help us. They also can and do destroy. Deception occurs when most of the info shared is correct and it gets you hooked where you will be blinded to the truth, to what is false in this teaching.

My opinion and thanks for sharing. I will be more alert about this man from now on.

ginnyrose


_________________
Sandra Miller

 2007/6/9 9:01Profile
Everett
Member



Joined: 2007/5/3
Posts: 77
West Bloomfield, MI

 Re:

Your right, i just looked and i didn't notice it was posted by the BAYSIDE SWEDENBORGIAN CHURCH but the author who wrote it was Eric J. Sharpe. He was "Professor of Religious Studies at the University of Sydney, Australia. He was a major scholar in the phenomenology of religion, the history of modern Christian mission, and inter-religious dialogue. "He was a specialist in the history of modern day Christian missions to India and wrote biographical studies on influential missionary-scholars such as A.G. Hogg and John Nicol Farquhar." In fact he wrote a book on the biographical study of the famous Indian Christian, Sadhu Sundar Singh explaining the various biographical views that the west and other churches had about him. So on that part I don't think he is an swedenborgian neither a part of a cult but i will do research regarding him and his opinion concerning Sadhu whether its accurate or not.

When i first brought up this tread i was looking for more understanding regarding this issue and i was open for disagreement because its not about getting people on your side but its about finding the truth. So thank you for replying and i hope that you would shed light on why Sadhu's writings, more specifically his visions are so similiar to Emanuel Swedenborg and Jakob Boehme's writings and work. Please if you will compare the two by the source themselves so you can get your own personal opinion regarding the matter and share it with me please.

God Bless you


_________________
Chad Everett Dalton

 2007/6/9 14:34Profile
HomeFree89
Member



Joined: 2007/1/21
Posts: 797
Indiana

 Re:

This man had a great impact on Corrie ten Boom. He helped her go deeper in the Lord and she really thought a lot of him.

Jordan


_________________
Jordan

 2007/6/9 19:00Profile





©2002-2019 SermonIndex.net
Promoting Genuine Biblical Revival.
Privacy Policy