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pastorfrin
Member



Joined: 2006/1/19
Posts: 1406


 Re:

Hi chief,

Quote:
I noticed that nearly all the scriptures you used were from the gospels. Very little of the gospels were written to the church.



The usual answer for explaining away the works of Christ in us! Problem is the gospels
Where written to every believer if we can believe His command in
Matthew 28:20
Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

“This states what we are to teach all nations to the end of this age: "all things" that He commanded His disciples. No man or church has a right to qualify or limit, to add to or take from, any of the original teachings and practices of Christ and the apostles. This means that every jot and title of the New Testament from Matthew 1:1 to Rev. 22:21 is the contract we are now under and all of it must be taught and practiced by Christians.”
(Dake)

In other words Jesus said if you are a believer you shall.
Mark 16:15-20
And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. [16] He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. [17] And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; [18] They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.
[19] So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God. [20] And they went forth, and preached every where, the Lord working with them, and confirming the word with signs following. Amen.

Let me emphasize here that it is not the signs I am talking about but the believer and ‘If’ you are a believer Jesus says these things will happen because you are.
If we proclaim His Word without the works than men have no confirmation that it is His
Word!

Thus we have Jesus saying:
John 14:8-12
Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us. [9] Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father? [10] Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works. [11] Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works' sake. [12] Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.

He has gone to the Father, are we believers or not?

In His Love
pastorfrin

 2007/5/25 15:59Profile









 Re:

Pastorfrin,

My question to you is this. What are the works we are to perform.

 2007/5/25 16:13









 Re:

Quote:

running2win wrote:
To believe is to believe in such a way that it changes my life so that I cry out "Jesus, because of what you did for me I repent of my sin and will keep your commandments." So it has to be a deep convincing belief, not just an assent to the fact that a certain thing is true.

Quote:
The problem is we try to read into things, when to us, it's too simple, or, to us, the truth is not doing what we think it should do.



Very good. I think this is a common problem, and God spoke to me about it a couple of years ago through this passage:

Quote:
Mark 9:9 And as they came down from the mountain he (Jesus) charged them that they should tell no man what things they had seen, till the Son of man were risen from the dead. 10. And they kept that saying with themselves, questioning one with another what the rising from the dead should mean.



Now that seems really ignorant that they couldn't see that it meant exactly what it said. THE RISING FROM THE DEAD! I don't know of any other way to interpret that ;-)
Well, I found out that I was doind alot the same thing by wondering "what does this mean" or "I wonder what Jesus meant by that". Well, if Jesus said in John 14:12 that we would do greater works than he did because he was going to the Father, I think I can safely deduce that he meant [b]greater works.[/b] So now the question is where are the greater works? Not that we need them to be saved, but as a tool to bring souls to God. Well to be honest with myself I'm not doing the "greater works". I found that I can't just go up and speak with "holy boldness" or heal someone. So I have to conclude that I'm missing something in what God intended christians to be. I don't know what that is exactly but I know the One who does so I'm urgently and desperately seeking Him to restore me to what the disciples were in the book of Acts so that God might get the most amount of glory out of my life.

Oh God make the church what it is meant to be, starting with me!

To believe is to believe in such a way as to cry out Quote: "Jesus because of what you did for me I repent and will keep your commandments". Don't you see what your saying. Your telling me that you saved yourself by your works. The crying out, the repenting,(if your saying repentance is what I think your saying)The tears, the begging, the pleading, the EMOTION, the FEELING.

 2007/5/25 16:21









 Re:

Quote:

JaySaved wrote:
Quote:
I noticed that nearly all the scriptures you used were from the gospels. Very little of the gospels were written to the church.



They might not have been written specifically to a particular church, but the gospels were written for all believers.

I totally agree. Meant for study and growth, but, for the most part, not for application.

 2007/5/25 16:24
running2win
Member



Joined: 2007/5/15
Posts: 231
Bowmansville Penssylvania USA

 Re:

Quote:
My question to you is this. What are the works we are to perform.



I'm not the one to whom the question was adressed and neither do I have and exact answer to this but I just want to say that in real revivals there are often testimonies of healings and other miracles. Now I don't believe [b]AT ALL[/b] that we need to seek for signs and miracles, but I think there is benefit in asking ourselves the question "what is the difference from us and the church in Acts?"


_________________
Jeff Mollman

 2007/5/25 16:31Profile
running2win
Member



Joined: 2007/5/15
Posts: 231
Bowmansville Penssylvania USA

 Re:

Quote:
Don't you see what your saying. Your telling me that you saved yourself by your works. The crying out, the repenting,(if your saying repentance is what I think your saying)The tears, the begging, the pleading, the EMOTION, the FEELING.



Yes I can see that that wasn't explained very well. I'm terribly sorry. We are saved by [b]grace through faith ALONE[/b], but what I was getting at is that to truly believe means that your life will change. The Bible makes it clear that even the demons believe. Repenting doesn't save you but to be saved you must repent... if that makes any sense.
Thank you for correcting that! (blush)


_________________
Jeff Mollman

 2007/5/25 16:35Profile
pastorfrin
Member



Joined: 2006/1/19
Posts: 1406


 Re:Works'

Hi chief,
You asked,

Quote:
My question to you is this. What are the works we are to perform.



I believe Jesus has adequately answered that question, but if you believe we are only to use His words for study and growth and not for application it really makes no difference.
No wonder the church is so confused today. :-?

In His Love
pastorfrin

 2007/5/25 17:02Profile









 Re:

Quote:

running2win wrote:
Quote:
Don't you see what your saying. Your telling me that you saved yourself by your works. The crying out, the repenting,(if your saying repentance is what I think your saying)The tears, the begging, the pleading, the EMOTION, the FEELING.



Yes I can see that that wasn't explained very well. I'm terribly sorry. We are saved by [b]grace through faith ALONE[/b], but what I was getting at is that to truly believe means that your life will change. The Bible makes it clear that even the demons believe. Repenting doesn't save you but to be saved you must repent... if that makes any sense.
Thank you for correcting that! (blush)

That's quite alright. I don't mean to sound harsh, only direct. The salvation issue has been so complicated that many people can't even make a simple decision to belive ON Jesus.

Here you have Buddah. Here you have Ala. Here you have emotionalism. Here you have works. Here you have traditionism. Here you have the Pope and mary.

Here you have Jesus.

I'm betting everything on Jesus. I'm trusting in Jesus. I'm depending on Jesus. He died on the cross for my sins and rose again on the third day. He did that for me. I believe that. He is my Lord and Saviour. That's it! I don't always FEEL saved. Sometimes I might even doubt if I am saved. The devil will try to tell me that I'm not saved. I'm taking God at his word. He promised that if I believe on the Lord Jesus Christ I shall be saved. He promised that if I believe on the Lord Jesus Christ that I will not perish but I WILL have EVERLASTING LIFE. I have everlasting life RIGHT NOW because I believed on Jesus.

 2007/5/25 18:25









 Re:

Quote: The bible says that even the demons believe.

Sure, but the demons can't be saved.

 2007/5/25 18:28









 Re:

Quote:

pastorfrin wrote:
Hi chief,
You asked,
Quote:
My question to you is this. What are the works we are to perform.



I believe Jesus has adequately answered that question, but if you believe we are only to use His words for study and growth and not for application it really makes no difference.
No wonder the church is so confused today. :-?

In His Love
pastorfrin

The power of God is the gospel. The fruits of the Spirit are love, joy, peacelongsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness, temperance, speaking in tongues, healing, casting out demons, slaying in the spirit, an emotional high. Oh....sorry about that. You get what I'm saying. :-D

 2007/5/25 18:35





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