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Santana
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Joined: 2006/8/17
Posts: 286


 Why do most versions leave out the most important words?

Mark 9:29-And he said unto them, This kind can come forth by nothing, but by prayer and fasting. (KJV)

Most versions leave out 'fasting'.

Acts 8:37-And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God. (KJV)

The Ethiopian eunuch just asked Philip what he must do to be saved and most versions leave out the entire verse. :-(

The examples I gave are very important to scripture and I'm kind of confused on why they would chose to omit it.

I don't understand King James Version most of the time but I'm afraid I'll be missing something if I read other versions.


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Leonardo Santana

 2007/1/9 16:35Profile
wonserwonton
Member



Joined: 2006/11/20
Posts: 59
Longview WA

 Re: Why do most versions leave out the most important words?

Thank you for posting this.

About a year ago my cousin told me to stop reading NIV, and, although at the time I didn't understand exactly why, I stopped. I picked up the NKJV because it was the text used for a Bible quiz team that some people tried starting at church, and even that wasn't enough for me. NKJV just doesn't have the depth that KJV does. KJV is somehow heavier and it sticks in my mind better. In the first few months of my KJV reading I spent some time looking into what exactly is wrong with NIV, and was disgusted. There are verses in KJV that mention the Blood of Christ, but in NIV the same verse speaks nothing of it. I find that peculiar...

I was just discussing the difference today with a classmate, so thank you for sharing these two examples.


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Amy King

 2007/1/9 18:40Profile
KingJimmy
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Joined: 2003/5/8
Posts: 4419
Charlotte, NC

 Re:

The issue is ultimately one of textual criticism in regard to the actual Greek/Hebrew manuscripts used by the translators. There are differences in manuscripts mostly because of copyists errors, as for thousands of years copies of the Bible were made by hand. It's not so much that the modern versions leave parts of things out, but rather, the manuscripts they base their translations on are ever-so-slightly different than ones used by the KJV.

So, be careful of those who espouse conspiracy theories about individuals who have attempted to demonize various translations. It ultimately boils down to that some scholars have thought various manuscripts are better in quality than others. It's a rather complicated matter.


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Jimmy H

 2007/1/9 19:15Profile
tjservant
Member



Joined: 2006/8/25
Posts: 1658
Indiana USA

 Re: Why do most versions leave out the most important words?

I urge you to pray much about such things. I have seen and heard compelling evidence pointing in both directions on this issue. I am sure you will get many more educated replies than mine, but I say pray pray pray… for God to lead you in such matters.

Remember unless you are reading the original Greek, Hebrew, and Aramaic you are reading a TRANSLATION.

Be lead by God in all matters, including this, and it will not be such a monstrous ordeal. Believe me people can really get “wild” about this. It is important, but listen to God not just man’s opinions.

God bless

TJ


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TJ

 2007/1/9 19:55Profile
MrBillPro
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Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3235
Texas

 Re:

Quote:

tjservant wrote:
Remember unless you are reading the original Greek, Hebrew, and Aramaic you are reading a TRANSLATION.
God bless
TJ



Could you please tell this to the folks at our Bible study, our teacher there has them all but me convinced that the KJ version is the only one to use, well I still go there with my NASV and will continue to do so unless they kick me out. :-)


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Mr. Bill

 2007/1/9 20:54Profile
tjservant
Member



Joined: 2006/8/25
Posts: 1658
Indiana USA

 Re:

Quote:

MrBillPro wrote:
Quote:


Could you please tell this to the folks at our Bible study, our teacher there has them all but me convinced that the KJ version is the only one to use, well I still go there with my NASV and will continue to do so unless they kick me out. :-)



I understand. My last Bible study group could be considered borderline King James Onlyists. Some of them will never see any Bible other than the KJV as worthy. I think some of them might even scream if you touched them with an inferior translation. No kidding. Of course to them theirs is not a translation.

In my Bible study group I noticed at times someone would say they did not understand a passage. Before anyone said anything I would read it from a NASB and they would say “Oh now I get it”.

Sometimes I would bring up a word in the KJV. Then the Greek. Then I would show them that other words could be used. Many times the different word worked better.

A few times in the KJV it says master where teacher is closer to the Greek. Not a big deal really. The English often call school teachers, school masters. I just tried to show them that different is not always bad, or wrong. I did this very slowly and never caused any “bad blood”. We always left with a smile.

I like the KJV. I will always own and use one. I also use the NASB. I do not use or recommend all translations. Some are very bad.

God Bless

TJ


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TJ

 2007/1/9 21:44Profile
Christinyou
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Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3698
Ca.

 Re:

This is where it is very important to make comparison between KJV and newer translations.
The In Christ Position and Who He is in the believer and What He has done in the believer. This is where Satan does his work. "In Christ" is in the KJV 224 times and 147 directing us in Christ and Christ in us. Check our NIV in this area.

Here are just a few:


KJV


Romans-- "In Christ JUSTIFIED." Ro 3:24.
Romans 3:24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

Corinthians-- "In Christ SANCTIFIED." 1Co 1:2.
1 Corinthians 1:2 Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours:

Galatians-- "In Christ CRUCIFIED." Ga 2:20.
Galatians 2:20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ lives in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

Ephesians-- "In Christ ASCENDED." Eph 1:3.
Ephesians 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:

Philippians-- "In Christ SATISFIED." Php 1:11.
Philippians 1:11 Being filled with the fruits of righteousness, which are by Jesus Christ, unto the glory and praise of God.

Colossians-- "In Christ COMPLETE." Col 2:10.
Colossians 2:10 And you are complete in him, who is the head of all principality and power:
Thessalonians-- "In Christ GLORIFIED." 2Th 1:10-12.
2 Timothy 1:10-12 But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Savior Jesus Christ, who has abolished death, and has brought life and immortality to light through the gospel: For which I am appointed a preacher, and an apostle, and a teacher of the Gentiles. For the which cause I also suffer these things: nevertheless I am not ashamed: for I know whom I have believed, and am persuaded that he is able to keep that which I have committed unto him against that day.

Colossians; Fulfillment of God Word: Colossians 1:25-27 Of which I am made a minister, according to the commission of God which is given to me for you, to fulfill the word of God; Even the mystery which has been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints: To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:

NIV

Romans-- "In Christ JUSTIFIED." Ro 3:24.
24] and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus. (Rom 3:24 NIV)

Corinthians-- "In Christ SANCTIFIED." 1Co 1:2.
[2] To the church of God in Corinth, to those sanctified in Christ Jesus and called to be holy, together with all those everywhere who call on the name of our Lord Jesus Christ-their Lord and ours: (1Cr 1:2 NIV)

Galatians-- "In Christ CRUCIFIED." Ga 2:20.
[20] I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me. (Gal 2:20 NIV)

Ephesians-- "In Christ ASCENDED." Eph 1:3.
[3] Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in the heavenly realms with every spiritual blessing in Christ. (Eph 1:3 NIV)

Philippians-- "In Christ SATISFIED." Php 1:11.
[11] filled with the fruit of righteousness that comes through Jesus Christ-to the glory and praise of God. (Phl 1:11 NIV)

Colossians-- "In Christ COMPLETE." Col 2:10.
10] and you have been given fullness in Christ, who is the head over every power and authority. (Col 2:10 NIV)

Thessalonians-- "In Christ GLORIFIED." 2Th 1:10-12.
10] but it has now been revealed through the appearing of our Savior, Christ Jesus, who has destroyed death and has brought life and immortality to light through the gospel. [11] And of this gospel I was appointed a herald and an apostle and a teacher. [12] That is why I am suffering as I am. Yet I am not ashamed, because I know whom I have believed, and am convinced that he is able to guard what I have entrusted to him for that day. (2Ti 1:10-12 NIV)

Colossians 1:25-27 Fulfillment of God's Word:
[25] I have become its servant by the commission God gave me to present to you the word of God in its fullness- [26] the mystery that has been kept hidden for ages and generations, but is now disclosed to the saints. [27] To them God has chosen to make known among the Gentiles the glorious riches of this mystery, which is Christ in you, the hope of glory. (Col 1:25-27 NIV)

In Christ: Phillip


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Phillip

 2007/1/10 0:23Profile
Smokey
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Joined: 2005/2/21
Posts: 417
Edmonton Alberta Cda.

 Re:

King Jimmy

I am dumfounded that you would use the same eronious statement to discredit the KJV as athiest, and ultra liberals do.
Quote: "There are differences in manuscripts mostly because of copyists errors, as for thousands of years copies of the bible were made by hand"
FACT one The bible as we know it has not been around for "thousands of years", only 2 thousand.

Fact two The scribes in charge of copying scripture, were more carefull than any modern proofreader I have ever known.

And then to follow that statement up with the bold faced lie.
Quote: "It's not so much that the modern versions leave parts of things out, but rather, the manuscripts they base their translations on are ever-so-slightly different than one used by the KJV."

THERE IS NOTHING EVER-SO-SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT TO THE "MAJOR" ALTERATIONS UNDERTAKEN IN MOST NEWER VERSIONS.


Greg


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Greg

 2007/1/10 0:42Profile









 here we go again.

another 100post plus cyber tussle over different Bible versions.

how edifying this will be.

What glory will be given to God!

isnt religion fun? You can fuss and tussle, biting and devouring a brother (or sister)over the internet, KNOW that you are right AND righteous, blow some steam off, turn off the computer and when all is said and done, what PRECISELY has been accomplished?

hmmmm?

answer me that somebody?

What precisely has been accomplished by yet another long boring turgid thread arguing Bible versions......EXCEPT to divide the Body just a little bit more.

Oh boy, arent the lost envious of the fruit of so great a salvation?

"look how they love one another".

have fun kids.

 2007/1/10 1:33
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3235
Texas

 Re: here we go again.

Quote:

bartle wrote:
You can fuss and tussle, biting and devouring a brother (or sister)over the internet, KNOW that you are right AND righteous, blow some steam off, turn off the computer and when all is said and done, what PRECISELY has been accomplished?




Sounds like you might know this first hand, but "everyone" here has been guilty of this once or twice so your preaching to the choir. :-P


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Mr. Bill

 2007/1/10 9:37Profile





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