SermonIndex Audio Sermons
Image Map
Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Love your enemies or punish them in Hell

Print Thread (PDF)

Goto page ( Previous Page 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 )
PosterThread
rookie
Member



Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4792


 Re:

First, I have read through the last part of this thread. I do not imply that I am clear on the significance of the blood and its' ongoing work.

In Leviticus 17, It says the life is in the blood...

In Romans 5:11, it says we are "saved by His life."

Is the power of the blood in the life, that Jesus gives to us, through the work of the Holy Spirit?

In Christ
Jeff


_________________
Jeff Marshalek

 2004/3/1 16:24Profile
philologos
Member



Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re:

rookie asks Is the power of the blood in the life, that Jesus gives to us, through the work of the Holy Spirit?

I believe it is. God became flesh in order to die but, as we have said before, it was not the intensity of the physical suffering that achieved redemption but the fact that God was pouring out Himself in human life. That life was in the blood.

The blood was for God. In Passover terms God had said "when I see the blood I will pass over you". Some evangelicals have adopted the custom of 'covering things with the blood', but the central idea of scripture is that it is God's view of the blood that is significant; not the view of men or demons.

The sacrifice of the life of His Son was the necessary and sufficient price to put away sin and satisfy God's righteous wrath against sin and sinner. So it was the life of God poured out through the human life of His Son. As we said before, the value of the blood was the value of the life. There is a very wonderful verse in Acts Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood. [Acts 20:28] It was His life poured out in death that secured the Church.

Your reference to the Spirit is, in my understanding, an important follow through. God has poured out Himself twice; once in blood and once in Spirit. My understanding is that Christ accomplished and the Spirit applies the work of salvation. In each aspect of the God-head's work there is no holding back, but outpouring.


_________________
Ron Bailey

 2004/3/2 12:28Profile
eagleswings
Member



Joined: 2003/12/30
Posts: 297
Connecticut, USA

 Re: The Power of the Blood

Quote:

"Is the power of the blood in the life, that Jesus gives to us, through the work of the Holy Spirit?"


Hi Jeff and Ron,

In Cbapter 9, 'Life in the Blood' of his book, "The Power of the Blood of Jesus", Andrew Murray also deals with the question.


http://www.worldinvisible.com/library/murray/5f00.0572/5f00.0572.08.htm

It has been a great blessing to me, and I welcome the opportunity to pass it on to others,

in Him,

Roger






_________________
Roger P.

 2004/3/2 15:17Profile
eagleswings
Member



Joined: 2003/12/30
Posts: 297
Connecticut, USA

 Re: Gethsemane

Ron.

"Gethsemane" is one of the most profound, rich, and informative messages I've ever heard. There's much for sober and godly discussion. My wife and I have been working through it for several days. Almost finished.

(I'm feeling a bit like a shill, but I really don't mind. (The dictionary says the word is U.S.Slang.))

Thanks in our Beloved,

Roger


_________________
Roger P.

 2004/3/2 15:30Profile









 Re:


Philologos,

Just wondering. . . . If Jesus was identical in nature with God the Father, how is it that He could die? This is part of my view that if this was so, Jesus' physical being could be likened to a puppet, with no free will. If Jesus was a human, endowed with the full spirit of God, He could be "One with the Father" yet not the same as God the Father.

As you know, I am of the opinion that Jesus and the Holy Spirit are of one nature, but Jesus and the Holy Father are distinct as father and son. They share the same spirit of love, but not the same identity.

Jake

 2004/3/2 16:41
philologos
Member



Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re:

Jake writes Just wondering. . . . If Jesus was identical in nature with God the Father, how is it that He could die? This is part of my view that if this was so, Jesus' physical being could be likened to a puppet, with no free will. If Jesus was a human, endowed with the full spirit of God, He could be "One with the Father" yet not the same as God the Father.

As you know, I am of the opinion that Jesus and the Holy Spirit are of one nature, but Jesus and the Holy Father are distinct as father and son. They share the same spirit of love, but not the same identity.

Hi Jake
This is the mystery (in its proper sense of being a secret) of the incarnation. I am not quite sure what you are expressing in terms of Trinity here. Orthodox evangelicals believe in One God, subsisting in three persons. Co-equal, co-eternal. Older preachers used to say that we must not confound the persons nor divide the substance; that doesn't mean quite what it sounds. It was a way of saying that Father, Spirit and Son are distinct as regards personal identity, but one in nature. Nature here would include God's attributes.

The co-equal, co-eternal Son 'became flesh'; that is to say fully human as God originally created human beings - without taint or bias of sin. Hebrews captures His testimony concerning 'incarnation'; a body hast thou prepared me. He then lived His life on earth as a human being, refusing to behave in divine power for His own benefit. Satan said "if you are the Son of God command that these stones be made bread". He was the Son of God and He could have done it, but His reply was "it is written man shall not live by bread alone but by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of God.". He determined to live as a human being.

To live out His life in the Father's will He suspended the use of His divine powers, other than at the will of His Father. I always do those things that please the Father. John's gospel is full of this unique relationship. This union of God and man was perfect so that at the same time He was fully God and fully man; not 50% of each but 100% of both. Charles Wesley uses these words; "God contracted to a span, incomprehensively made man". Michael Card speaks of Christ's "undiminished deity".

He expressly became flesh in order to die. When He had 'finished' His work He breathed out His spirit. But in many ways this is all the outward observable to the human eye. It was the physical outworking of inward spiritual realities where He poured out all that He was to serve God's purpose in redemption.

I don't follow the logic of why this makes Christ a puppet. In Gethesemen the Father reached out to Him with the "cup"; the cross with all its suffering. His prayer was that, if possible, the Father would take it away... nevertheless not my will but thine be done. That is no puppet nor is it absence of free will. There have only been two men in the history of the world who truly had 'free will'. One of them sold out the whole race to another god; the Other yielded His will so perfectly to God that He undid all the damage the first man had caused. However for that to become a personal reality the Spirit must enter our beings and unite us in spirit to all that Christ achieved; this is sometimes called Redemption: accomplished and applied.


_________________
Ron Bailey

 2004/3/2 19:01Profile
philologos
Member



Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re:

Roger
Thanks for your posting. I have absolutely no idea what a 'shill' is but I am glad I gave you and your wife something to share and discuss.

As you will have heard me say "Gethsemene is holy ground". In the end we must take off our shoes and just worship.


_________________
Ron Bailey

 2004/3/2 19:04Profile
eagleswings
Member



Joined: 2003/12/30
Posts: 297
Connecticut, USA

 Re:


Having finished listening to Ron’s “Gethsemane” message, it’s striking that the message which was given some time ago responds to the original question, which started this thread.

But then again, I shouldn’t be surprised. As Major Ian W. Thomas was (is) fond of saying, to enter into the Christian life is to be “caught up in the timeless purpose of an Eternal God”.


Roger



“I will give thee thanks in the great congregation: I will praise thee among much people” Psalm 35:18.



_________________
Roger P.

 2004/3/4 16:48Profile





©2002-2020 SermonIndex.net
Promoting Genuine Biblical Revival.
Privacy Policy